New Trimaran Foilers

Discussion in 'Multihulls' started by Doug Lord, Jun 8, 2016.

  1. Doug Lord
    Joined: May 2009
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    Location: Melbourne, Florida

    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    =======================================

    Thanks for the pictures of Len's Sting 600-looking forward to the tow video.....
     
  2. trip the light fandango
    Joined: Apr 2018
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    Location: Rhyll Phillip Island Victoria Australia

    trip the light fandango Senior Member

    It's still a model Doug, others go on and build,, although your materials will be very expensive to try which does make it difficult. Any "help" you offered me once doesn't diminish just how unpleasant it has been since then, thus the post. I've reciprocated practical useful information in the past. How many times have you justified by first listing mega expensive high performance full size tri's then tacked yours on at the end, that is conflating by osmosis and sheer repetition. I have lost interest in your stuff like a long playing advert , but the Sydney harbour foiling vid you posted a couple of months ago was a beaut so thanks for that. Looking forward to a new development of yours Mr completely swamp the forum with your brand. ,c'mon Doug what's on the drawing board? or is fire arrow ready, close enough or is it that models are your domain by choice. Perhaps you could have a go at crowd funding because of complexity and cost. It certainly makes it less interesting for me, you've got to hand it to Len.
     
  3. Doug Lord
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    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    ===========================
    Thats an amazing* post. I'm truly amazed when someone like you talks about repetition-yet still has no clue what the thread is about!!! Len Surtees is a friend and is living the dream and doing very well.
    *in the worst sense of the word!!
     
  4. bjn
    Joined: Jul 2014
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    bjn Senior Member

    But how many days/weeks did they spend on testing their models?
    And did they make big public claims based on the model results?
    I think they spent a pretty short time (that's the point of models right - fast to create, fast to get results) and probably they treated the results cautiously, like any good engineer or scientist would.

    I think it should be pretty obvious to you that what frustrates people is that you treat the results of your models with a much higher importance than what they should represent. Your models seem to indicate that your concepts works. But the results should be treated cautiously until tried at full scale. Right?
    Even to me as a casual reader of this forum, it's frustrating to read tens of thousands of words about your models. Good for you that there is a positive result, but come on, you cannot claim to be a pioneer, innovator, etc, at this point. Those claims has to wait until you have launched a successful boat.
     
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  5. Vantage475T
    Joined: Aug 2016
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    Location: Lymington,UK

    Vantage475T Vantage475T

    Is anyone actually interested in the Sting 600?...... A real, sailing, actual foiling boat for the homebuilder!

    Any thoughts / comments on it so far?

    Len said the OMR rating is 0.749 with 2 x 100kg crew.

    Foiling version weight 450kg including motor, sails and anchor or 390kg for non-foiling version.
     
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  6. bjn
    Joined: Jul 2014
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    bjn Senior Member

    Is it that heavy?
    I've seen another boat for the homebuilder, which is about the same size (5,75m), also with swinging beams, but overall much more low tech. Weight is 102kg fully rigged (no motor):
    Slingshot 19 Trimaran Plans https://www.duckworks.com/product-p/fs-slingshot19-id.htm
     
  7. Doug Lord
    Joined: May 2009
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    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    =========================================================
    I find this incredible. The significant thing about the Fire Arrow is the foil system which was designed and tested over 4 years starting in 2010 culminating in successful tests on July 24, 2014.
    But the really cool thing is that starting about 2016 several fullsize trimarans adopted virtually the identical basic foil system starting with Maserati,Macif jr., then Gitana 17, Banque Populaire and Macif 100. Those boats proved beyond a shadow of doubt that the foil system worked at sea over long distances and worked well!
    After Gitana 17 and Banque Pop ,(and talking to Guillaume Verdier and Vincent Prevost),I decided that what had been proven by Fire Arrow and these boats was of such significance that I could design a small trimaran incorporating the foil system and Two Stage Amas, which I have done: WOLF.
    The fact is that Fire Arrow was the first trimaran in the history of mankind to use this foil system, and yes, I am damn proud of that!! But I have done everything humanly possible to share what I've learned- posting details that could have been patented but which I chose to post publicly way before any of these other tri's adopted the system. So there is no question that the Fire Arrow Foil System is a pioneering effort-the first of its type ever. But there is also no question that I have learned a lot , particularly from the efforts of Guillaume Verdier and Vincent Prevost(VPLP), who have been very generous with their time and extremely encouraging for which I am very grateful.
    -----------------------------
    WOLF daughter of fire arrow:
    WOLF 14 conept model rig-8-7-18 003.JPG

    WOLF 14 concept-wolfman 9-1-18 012.JPG

    WOLF 14 concept model-foils-7-10-18 006.JPG
     
  8. Doug Lord
    Joined: May 2009
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    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    ==========================
    I'm interested in the boat and have been for a long time. I think Len has done a tremendous job!

    https://www.sting600.net/
     
  9. Doug Lord
    Joined: May 2009
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    Location: Melbourne, Florida

    Doug Lord Flight Ready

  10. Vantage475T
    Joined: Aug 2016
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    Location: Lymington,UK

    Vantage475T Vantage475T

    They really are completely different beasts.

    I have the Slingshot 19 plans and at the most it calls for Hobie 14 main (114 sq ft) with a Laser 2 Jib of 30 sq ft.

    Sting 600 has 185 sq ft main, jib 95 sq ft and a screecher of 260 sq ft or so.

    I like the smoot design but it is way, way smaller and more lightly built with central seating only. I don't think it would last long in hard choppy conditions and for speed and overall design it is way down the pecking order.

    Sting is more like a Pulse or SeaRail I think.
     
  11. bjn
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    bjn Senior Member

    Sure, I do. But let's take another example of a 6m boat which can be homemade from plywood - the Tornado. Also much lighter. And non foiling of course. But strong in waves and very fast.
    250 kg extra for the possibility to lift 450kg in the right conditions is a pretty significant weight penalty, was my point. Maybe the boat is a bit over engineered and can be made lighter.
     
  12. trip the light fandango
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    Location: Rhyll Phillip Island Victoria Australia

    trip the light fandango Senior Member

    It will be really interesting to see how it goes, good luck.
     
  13. trip the light fandango
    Joined: Apr 2018
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    Location: Rhyll Phillip Island Victoria Australia

    trip the light fandango Senior Member

    ECU's Feelers and transverse rudders/ flaps, I still can't get over that pm when you repeatedly ignored facts and logic while pretending you couldn't understand , it's the modus operandi of someone who is deranged and makes the victim feel like they're going mad, you are a nasty piece of work. The Thunderbirds are go! you should be on a RC forum.
     
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  14. Doug Lord
    Joined: May 2009
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    Location: Melbourne, Florida

    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    ======================
    I suppose, then , that this makes sense to you? I wish it did to me but I guess being a ",..deranged...nasty piece of work" has its drawbacks. Oh, well....... Good Luck!
     

  15. Gary Baigent
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    Gary Baigent Senior Member

    Always the outraged innocent. "How dare you criticize my brilliance." In my deluded mind I've sailed untold sea miles on my bath tub foiler.
    Spare us all, Douglas, build a full sized 6 metre version of your obsessional toy of thousands of postings .... and then you'll introduce some reality to this/your/over indulged/ beyond insanity .... fantasy.
    And no excuses, a simple 6 metre doesn't have to be oven cured Nomex/carbon/epoxy.
     
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