New One Design Dinghy with special gaff system

Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by ITA511, Jul 7, 2013.

  1. ITA511
    Joined: Jul 2013
    Posts: 3
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: HUN

    ITA511 New Member

    Attached Files:

  2. WhiteDwarf
    Joined: Jun 2011
    Posts: 131
    Likes: 5, Points: 18, Legacy Rep: 80
    Location: Sydney

    WhiteDwarf White Dwarf

    An interesting concept. What crew weight is the design optimised for?
     
  3. ITA511
    Joined: Jul 2013
    Posts: 3
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: HUN

    ITA511 New Member

    optimal:30-50 kg race
    no problem 70 kg
     
  4. Doug Lord
    Joined: May 2009
    Posts: 16,624
    Likes: 305, Points: 93, Legacy Rep: 1362
    Location: Cocoa, Florida

    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    Primus

    On the "Specification" page Beam is listed at 42 kg-which I assume is the hull weight or all up weight? 105lb seems a bit heavy for either. The Optimist is 77lb(35kg) hull weight. What is the beam?
    Good looking boat! The foil tips are sorta weird looking-is there some purpose to that shape?
     
  5. Major Tom
    Joined: Jul 2013
    Posts: 2
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: Cape Town

    Major Tom New Member

    Ita 511, this is not the first site you have been advertising on today, and I am still waiting on the answer to the question 'why do we need another boat that is so similar to the Optimist, Zoom8, Terra etc etc?'
     
  6. tom28571
    Joined: Dec 2001
    Posts: 2,471
    Likes: 113, Points: 63, Legacy Rep: 1728
    Location: Oriental, NC

    tom28571 Senior Member

    There must be some reasoning behind the complicated design of the hull bottom and foils but it is not clear what it might be. If the intent is to have an 8 footer faster than the Optimist, that would be absurdly easy to do. If the intent is to have another 8 footer too complicated to be built at home, (like the International Optimist), that has been accomplished also.

    Otherwise, I don't get the point.
     
  7. Major Tom
    Joined: Jul 2013
    Posts: 2
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: Cape Town

    Major Tom New Member

    I agree that the hull looks overly complicated, especially the aft sides which should be out of the water most if the time. I assume this requires split tooling which also ups the cost of the final product.
     
  8. ITA511
    Joined: Jul 2013
    Posts: 3
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: HUN

    ITA511 New Member

  9. Skyak
    Joined: Jul 2012
    Posts: 1,194
    Likes: 25, Points: 38, Legacy Rep: 152
    Location: United States

    Skyak Senior Member

    The goofy stepped bottom appears to be for stacking (no significant reduction in storage volume, just stability). The tumblehome rear is just for looks. I don't think this was designed by someone that knows boat design. It looks like an industrial designers take on an Opti -same price, new features (useless), better looks.

    It seems to me that there is an opportunity for a beginner one design with better performance and lower cost of operation, but this is not it.
     
  10. Jeremy Harris
    Joined: Jun 2009
    Posts: 978
    Likes: 56, Points: 28, Legacy Rep: 711
    Location: Salisbury, UK

    Jeremy Harris Senior Member

    Let's face it, this is a boat that doesn't offer anything useful over something like the Oppi, and is only being promoted here for free advertising by the manufacturer.

    I find it hard to understand why anyone thinks there is room in the market for another starter boat class for kids. The Oppi is so well established, and has done such a fantastic job of starting so many world class sailors over the past 50 or 60 years that it's hard to see how a more complex new design has a chance of succeeding in this market.

    Mind you, that's probably why the OP is seeking free advertising here..................
     
  11. daiquiri
    Joined: May 2004
    Posts: 5,372
    Likes: 239, Points: 73, Legacy Rep: 3380
    Location: Italy (Garda Lake) and Croatia (Istria)

    daiquiri Engineering and Design

    I agree about the design part. As about the odd hull shape, I was also wondering why on Earth would anyone want to complicate a hull shape of an entry-level dinghy so much. Then I saw this picture on their site:

    [​IMG]

    and the reason became immediately clear. Packaging.

    I want to look at this commercial attempt from the bright side: if it turns out to be a success (good luck!), let's hope it brings Optimist price down (currently at around €3.000 - a bit too much) and hence more kids on the water.

    Cheers
     
  12. Petros
    Joined: Oct 2007
    Posts: 2,936
    Likes: 139, Points: 63, Legacy Rep: 1593
    Location: Arlington, WA-USA

    Petros Senior Member

    perhaps it was designed to be a rental boat. that is the only place where the stacking feature is useful, very few owners would want more than one.

    Also, if the labor rate in Hungary where they are made is lower, they could sell them in Europe cheaper than most other sailing dingys. A tough and low cost, good looking rental boat can certainly find a market.
     
  13. daiquiri
    Joined: May 2004
    Posts: 5,372
    Likes: 239, Points: 73, Legacy Rep: 3380
    Location: Italy (Garda Lake) and Croatia (Istria)

    daiquiri Engineering and Design

    For rentals, I do not believe. Frankly, I've never seen a rent-an-Optimist around here.
    For sailing schools, oh yes. Seen plenty of Optimists in sailing schools, which is logical. It is a first boat for kids (was my first sailboat too), and they usually go out with an instructor (which is why it is not suitable for rental). And sailing schools do need a good stacking system. ;)
    Cheers
     
  14. tom28571
    Joined: Dec 2001
    Posts: 2,471
    Likes: 113, Points: 63, Legacy Rep: 1728
    Location: Oriental, NC

    tom28571 Senior Member

    A few years ago I built a mold from which 12 Optis were built (gratis) in order to get a local sailing school started. The school is a success and all boats have attracted sponsors that have their business logos or names on them. I mistakenly went with the poor "plans" included in a booklet from Opti International in the thought that if the boats were class legal, they could be used in sanctions regattas by students or anyone else using the mold.

    The class tolerances are ridiculous for individual home building and OI clearly would like to discourage wooden boats and have done a great job of it. If I were to do it again, I would use the simple Optimist Pram plans and ignore OI. In the 1960's I built two Optimist prams for grand total of $50 each, equally split between the boat and the sail. Costs of current OI Class legal boats is absurd for a kids boat and effectively eliminates any kid without well off parents.

    A saving grace for my efforts is that the mold has been used by another group and the fleet has grown to over 25 boats from the same mold. The second group ignored the Class scantlings and beefed them up to suit kids in school who are very rough on them. If they are a bit slower, no one knows or cares.
     

  15. Skyak
    Joined: Jul 2012
    Posts: 1,194
    Likes: 25, Points: 38, Legacy Rep: 152
    Location: United States

    Skyak Senior Member

    Well Tom, if nobody else said it... Thanks for your efforts to expand opportunities for new young sailors!

    While I respect the rights of class societies to govern their one designs, and that one design is better than 2 or 3 or 10 for competition, I agree strongly that there is a need for a lower cost beginner class. My personal goal would be to cut the price and increase users by a factor of ten.

    I don't think we are alone in our opinion.

    http://www.boatdesign.net/forums/boat-design/not-optimist-so-its-pessimist-47598.html
     
Loading...
Forum posts represent the experience, opinion, and view of individual users. Boat Design Net does not necessarily endorse nor share the view of each individual post.
When making potentially dangerous or financial decisions, always employ and consult appropriate professionals. Your circumstances or experience may be different.