New guy with a broken 302

Discussion in 'Gas Engines' started by xmtrxmt, Aug 21, 2014.

  1. xmtrxmt
    Joined: Aug 2014
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    Location: west coast

    xmtrxmt Junior Member

    Hi,

    New to the in-board motor scene and I have a few questions that I hope you guys can help out with.

    I was given a 1977 6M Reinell Cuddy cab with a 302. One of the freeze plugs from the head has popped, one from each exhaust manifold has popped and two on the underside are pushed half way out. I am assuming that this thing got a taste of ole Jack Frost, lol. Also, there is a damn milkshake in the oil pan, I am hoping for a head gasket rather than the block being cracked.

    I have built a many 302 and 351W based motors for Mustangs over the years so I'm pretty comfortable tearing one down and rebuilding, however, I'm hearing conflicting information from "dudes" in the area on the differences between an automotive 302 and a marine version.

    Can anyone give me the truth on what the difference between the blocks are? I have a good 302 block in the shop in the event that this one is cracked, can I use it?

    Im assuming that this motor runs on a standard 302 firing order and not the 5.0 HO/ 351W order, would this be correct?

    What would be the balance on the damper, is it 50 or 28?

    Hell, can I just drop a complete automotive 5.0 in its place, lol. I have one complete on a stand is why ask :)

    Anyway, thanks for help and if this has been a beat to death subject and I have somehow missed it in my search I apologize in advance.

    Thanks again and looking forward to getting thing apart and back up and running!
     
  2. missinginaction
    Joined: Aug 2007
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    missinginaction Senior Member

    Too bad someone didn't take the time to do a simple winterization. Those small block Fords are very reliable if cared for, as you know. I have a 41 year old 302 (a relatively rare right handed motor - it's in a v-drive) in my SIlverton circa 1973. It's an old style points and condenser ignition sytem that's still going strong.

    If it's a sterndrive or a conventional inboard you'll have a left handed engine that's just like a automobile. Where marine engines part company with their automotive cousins in in all the bolt on components.

    The following is a list of components that are marine specific, that is, you need marine parts to eliminate fire/explosion hazards from possible gasoline fumes in the event something goes wrong and you spring a fuel leak somehow. Marine water pumps are made with different materials to better survive raw water cooling. Marine engines need to pull hard so cam's and manifolds are needed that emphasise low end torque. Unless you have a boat like this guy...............................

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oD5z0gc7LxI

    1. Carburetors. (special venting and different jets/powervalves)
    2. Alternator/regulators.
    3. Starters and starting solenoids.
    4. Fuel Pumps
    5. Fuel lines and/or hose.
    6. Exhaust manifolds and mufflers/connecting hose.
    7. Engine water circulating pump
    8. Distributors
    9. Good marine grade tinned wiring and insulated nylon connectors.

    Holley makes a specific carb for the 302, it's a small 4bbl.
    https://www.holley.com/products/fue..._carburetors/marine_carburetors/parts/0-80364
    I also understand that gaskets are different, this is important especially if you're boating in salt water. Freeze plugs will be bronze, and your thermostat housing will be different!

    Good luck,

    MIA
     
  3. xmtrxmt
    Joined: Aug 2014
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    xmtrxmt Junior Member

    MIA,

    Thanks for the insight :) Like I was saying, this is my first inboard boat, I grew up on the river with simple flat bottom boats with small outboard motors so a 20' with an inboard will be a learning curve :)

    So I can use the one I have on the stand that came out one of the Mustangs yes ? Just have to make sure I use the specific parts you mentioned above correct?


    Thanks again for your help
     
  4. xmtrxmt
    Joined: Aug 2014
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    Location: west coast

    xmtrxmt Junior Member

    Ohh, and that boat is out of control! Looks like it would be an awesome toy :)
     
  5. xmtrxmt
    Joined: Aug 2014
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    xmtrxmt Junior Member

    Can I use the fuel injection system, wiring harness, and computer I have in stead of carbed?
     
  6. 7228sedan
    Joined: Nov 2009
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    Location: New Jersey USA

    7228sedan Senior Member

    xmtrxmt if I were you, I'd find an 85 or later 5.0 roller block and top it off with a set of E7TE, or iron GT40 heads... I do believe that Crusader used to use the 5.0 EFI from the Windsors back in the 90's. The Fuel system, and ignition would be the only concerns that I can think of. As they were used in EFI trim, I'd think that you could find replacements. Injectors, intake, other sensors would likely be fine. I actually have 2 roller blocks sitting in my garage waiting for an appropriate opportunity to roll (float) along :cool:
     
  7. xmtrxmt
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    xmtrxmt Junior Member

    That's good to hear :) I have my original 5.0 from my 93 Mustang sitting on a stand in the garage :)
     
  8. 7228sedan
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    7228sedan Senior Member

    Are you going to put the carb intake on it, or keep the efi?
    In order to use the factory Ford ECM, you'd need to run the mass air. A speed density ecm (87-88 ) would eliminate that need. Your profile says you're in CA so that limits you to 87 :). 88 CA 5.0's were mass air. The 93 5.0 didn't have forged pistons, so keep that in mind when you set the timing. The cast pistons in the later 5.0's aren't quite as strong as the earlier forged pistons. Assuming you are using the factory heads, the combustion ratio is not too high (9:1 I believe). The load on a boat engine is significantly higher than in a car. The combustion temps will also be significantly higher. Too much timing, and low octane fuel can cause problems in those conditions. Most of the carb components from the 77 should bolt right up to it if you decide to go that route. Cool project!
     
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  9. 7228sedan
    Joined: Nov 2009
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    7228sedan Senior Member

    Also with regards to your earlier question on 28oz or 50oz. The earlier motor is likely 28oz. It may have the non HO firing order as well. The HO 302 in your garage shares the 351's firing order and 50oz balancer.
     

  10. xmtrxmt
    Joined: Aug 2014
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    Location: west coast

    xmtrxmt Junior Member

    All good info :) I have always wondered why Ford stopped putting forged pistons in the HO motors kinda silly if you ask me. I have a wiring harness, computer, MAF, and air box for the motor, just haven't made up my mind if Im going to go back with the carb set up that is on the current motor, Im thinking it will all come down to how lazy I get :)
     
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