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My little piece of peace

Discussion in 'Marketplace' started by masalai, Feb 5, 2009.

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  1. masalai
    Joined: Oct 2007
    Posts: 6,823
    Likes: 121, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 1882
    Location: cruising, Australia

    masalai masalai

    Hi Sabah,
    That depends on potable water being available somewhere nearby... At present I have 200Litres in 25 litre plastic containers all plumbed and reticulated by pump to where it is needed... The Milne Bay region is volcanic and has many hot springs and many carry lethal doses of Arsenic (also a marker for gold bearing deposits as is evidenced by several active geological drilling/search programs)... I therefore prefer to make my own water from the sea.... A logical conclusion to local knowledge...

    My additional fuel, 2 x 600L proposed at present, in "turtle-packs" http://www.turtlepac.com/products/super-deck-tanks.html will be in the hulls above the W/L and under the forward end of the aft berths, - immediately aft of the radar mast bulkhead, The aft end of the berths is presently a "void", and I do not wish to open that, and it is too far aft, and will put too much weight - along with the engines - at the stern... The "turtle packs" are more secure and will neatly fit in the spaces with no movement or other hassles...

    http://www.caseyresearch.com/gsd/edition/jim-rickards-hidden-role-gold-imf this has a cartoon that was irresistible...
     

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  2. WestVanHan
    Joined: Aug 2009
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    Location: Vancouver

    WestVanHan Not a Senior Member

    If you are very near the equator...what about a solar still?
     
  3. masalai
    Joined: Oct 2007
    Posts: 6,823
    Likes: 121, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 1882
    Location: cruising, Australia

    masalai masalai

    Hi westie,
    Thanks for the input... I considered that and have some of those plastic camping ones "in case", but cannot do other than an RO system to meet expected normal long term needs... Other options are scaled to satisfy unforeseen situations...
     
  4. pdwiley
    Joined: Jun 2008
    Posts: 1,004
    Likes: 86, Points: 48, Legacy Rep: 933
    Location: Hobart

    pdwiley Senior Member

    I would add that unless you've got a big boat and lots of unused space low down, having that much fuel/water high up isn't going to do wonders for you either.

    There are some plans floating about by people who've built their own RO watermakers. I've given some thought to this myself but I can't see needing one for 2 years or more, so no more than thoughts. IIRC Glenn Ashmore built his own for RUTU.

    PDW
     
  5. masalai
    Joined: Oct 2007
    Posts: 6,823
    Likes: 121, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 1882
    Location: cruising, Australia

    masalai masalai

    The pressure water pump is significant as corrosion at high pressures may be a problem cheap pumps with enough pressure for one 40" membrane and possibly 2 membrane cylinders then the controls and pipes - not readily available from the local hardware store... I will buy from a reliable source - likely here http://www.waterwitch.com.au/contact.htm - got this thing about doing business locally ... and I have been there...
     
  6. WestVanHan
    Joined: Aug 2009
    Posts: 1,374
    Likes: 56, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 746
    Location: Vancouver

    WestVanHan Not a Senior Member

    You do have hot engines and hot exhaust..could you not boil and trap the steam?

    Or run AC to boil water?
     
  7. masalai
    Joined: Oct 2007
    Posts: 6,823
    Likes: 121, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 1882
    Location: cruising, Australia

    masalai masalai

    Hi Westie,

    Bugger - what happened there? - what I typed disappeared - sort of replicated here:- - The engines are 'wet' - as the originating engines for smaller Nanni-sail-drives are derived from - Kubota engines - and on this side of the Pacific Ocean, are very popular in small tractors, generators and therefore new and used parts are everywhere...

    Did I mention that the other day I got a 'battery-charger' with mains-generator @ 1100W 4 stroke petrol, for less than $200 and with near 3 years warranty...
     
  8. sabahcat
    Joined: Dec 2008
    Posts: 792
    Likes: 28, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 273
    Location: australia

    sabahcat Senior Member

    I would imagine he only needs the fuel tankage (at least) to get to destination.
    As he travels weight will get less and less and on arrival will just have an empty $100 worth of empty tanks that will no longer be needed.
    I would also think that he would be picking the glassy calm weather window not the rough one, so it probably wouldnt worry it to much.

    Think of it another way, how would the boat be affected with 3 people on each side deck and 2 on the roof?
    Now replace people with fluid in tanks.
     
  9. pdwiley
    Joined: Jun 2008
    Posts: 1,004
    Likes: 86, Points: 48, Legacy Rep: 933
    Location: Hobart

    pdwiley Senior Member

    What sort of money? IIRC I got a price on an engine driven unit made in NZ and it was around $6500. I shelved the idea for a later date at that point. I figure I can catch quite a lot of water off of my cabin top for cheap if I'm anchored up somewhere.

    As for the controls & pipes I guess it depends on what you consider to be a hardware store. I have no problems sourcing Swagelok fittings, Sched 80 pipe in 316L, high pressure gauges and similar. Machining the membrane cylinders is pretty trivial. As you say, the pump is the real killer item.

    PDW
     
  10. Frosty

    Frosty Previous Member

    Why wont the pump of a pressure washer work,---or will it.

    It even looks the same, is 1200psi enough?

    I know a guy --well hes dead now, shot himself in the shower--that made these things up with bitsa's. seemed to work very well as he actually sold them.
     
  11. sabahcat
    Joined: Dec 2008
    Posts: 792
    Likes: 28, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 273
    Location: australia

    sabahcat Senior Member

    There has been talk of the miraculous 3 tools in one device on forums before.
    5hp petrol pressurewasher >> desal >> generator
    I know of some that have claimed to have got the first two working.
     
  12. mydauphin
    Joined: Apr 2007
    Posts: 2,164
    Likes: 53, Points: 48, Legacy Rep: 575
    Location: Florida

    mydauphin Senior Member

    Remember you don't need all your water to drinking quality.
    I collect rain water for usual functions and use sea water if out at at sea.
    You can use cheappy system you can make yourself, but it won't remove all the salt, but you can use it for washing an showering. Use store bought system they sell for home use, put a sediment filter, and cheappy water pressure pump. You can build one under $500. Put you can't drink from it for extended time too much salt.

    Biggest problem with RO systems is... You don't use them enough the membrane and the whole system goes bad. And you really shouldn't usethem in a populate bay or if you have a pooping neighbor, or anywhere water could have problem. For example, Miami River is consider high toxic with arsenic, mercury and several diseases. Run off from land can contaminate seawater for many miles from shore. For drinking water, I buy it in 5 gallons drums or get from clean onshore source. I prefer chlorinated sources, I keep them seal, and clean bottles with hydrogen peroxide when not used.

    A person uses a minimum of 3-5 gallons of water to shower with a faucet that is manually activated. An another 3-5 gallons for miscellaneous cleaning. And you cook and drink about a gallon a day of the best quality water.

    Hope this helps.
     
  13. pdwiley
    Joined: Jun 2008
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    Likes: 86, Points: 48, Legacy Rep: 933
    Location: Hobart

    pdwiley Senior Member

    I believe it will work, at least I've read of people saying they've done it with one. I thought the pressure needed to be up around 1800 psi but a quick Google check seems to indicate 1200 psi would work.

    Volume of output & longevity in salt water might be issues but if the pump is cheap enough, I'd give it a go.

    PDW
     
  14. masalai
    Joined: Oct 2007
    Posts: 6,823
    Likes: 121, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 1882
    Location: cruising, Australia

    masalai masalai

    Clorinated potable water is said to destroy the membranes used to purify salt water, apparently NaCl as a compound (salt), does not adversely effect the membrane.

    If the 'desal' is USED daily, then a back wash of purified water will keep it nice for the next days use... My idea, (as per suggestions by RO tech people), is to operate for 2+hours a day to top up water and longer to meet washing machine use on laundry days... longer NO-USE periods require the system to be "pickled" for storage... There is still the need to ensure a regular workout followed by reverse flush to clean out all the 'salt and slime'. . . so minimising use is not necessary...

    I have much to learn before committing and installing... so this is opinion garnered from casual reading/discussion. When I get the machine I will advise of instructions and constraints in the manual...

    Hi PDW,
    I am looking at Au&4500 RO watermaker commercial. - I hope less...

    double bottom (void) to about waterline in forward end of aft berth so fuel bladder sits with its bottom about waterline height - I am too light in the bows (about 10"+ above water to top of anti-foul treatment)... buoyancy in the mini-keels? and weight of the sail-drives (144kg each)...

    Looking at Manies build thread http://www.boatdesign.net/forums/boat-building/manies-microcruiser-27869-46.html#post548909
    A wooden box section stick, wrapped in glass&tape may be something I could look at?
    - - 12M long and carrying to the masthead, 4 x stays and 2 halyards to lift aloft 2 flat-cut genoa with an area of up to 84 square metres each...
    - - 'CNO' has a beam OA of some 21 ft, and LOA around 40ft...
    - - The sails, - - because they will be made of light cloth, flat cut, to be able to ghost along, - - would only be up when the wind velocity OVER THE DECK remains less than 20 knots...
    - - I like Kiri/Paulownia and I may be able to get 12m lengths from Australian growers/suppliers...
    - - I have to mount the radar on that mast as well as run masthead (anchor) light to the top...
    - - What would be used to hold the stays? - An fabricated aluminium hat with points to secure the 4 stays and 3 halyards (2 for sails and one aft for bosun's chair)? - There is cable (that would run outside the mast), to allow the radar antenna to go about 10ft higher, (on glued brackets and small wooden platform), than at present... Since the sails will be hauled up - wire stays may be necessary because of the abrasion? How does one secure the mast base to the glass over wood mast step on the roof (I have a possibility of bolting an aluminium plate to which the mast can also be bolted) - what is there at the moment does not penetrate the step, it is clamped in place, as I did not want to drill holes unnecessarily - and they may be in the wrong position...

    Any ideas and advice would be greatly appreciated...
     

  15. masalai
    Joined: Oct 2007
    Posts: 6,823
    Likes: 121, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 1882
    Location: cruising, Australia

    masalai masalai

    Oops, I forgot a rather good cartoon I found today... Also applies to many other currencies including the Au$ :p :p and escape route planning?
     

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