My KAT Design

Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by thiago1979, Mar 29, 2016.

  1. thiago1979
    Joined: Mar 2016
    Posts: 13
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: Miami

    thiago1979 Junior Member

    Does any one know how much a Kat plan to a 30-40 feet costs? Also if you would like to work with a Marine Architect on the project does anyone know how much around it would cost? The reason I don't go Kit is because most designs are old and squared. Thanks for your imput
     
  2. PAR
    Joined: Nov 2003
    Posts: 19,133
    Likes: 494, Points: 93, Legacy Rep: 3967
    Location: Eustis, FL

    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    How do you come to that conclusion (design's being old and "squared", what that means)? You lack the necessary skills to make that type of appraisal, don't you think?

    You have limited expertise and experience, in all the areas you'd like to jump into. In a nutshell, you learn to walk after getting a handle on crawling, eventually learning to run. The same is true with yacht design and boat building. Stock plan pricing will range on size, complexity, the specific designer, etc., but a good set of plans will be a $1,000 or more. Custom plans will be considerably more and based on the same reasons.

    Your first yacht design would be after considerable study and closely following a known design, 15' or less. This is the usual route, which breeds successful outcomes and offers a baseline for future design improvements, that can be quantified with the "baseline". The same would be true of your first build, something small and simple, so can can learn and finish, before you get too bored. As your design skills go, so do the ambitions of the next designs, eventually you'll have the engineering confidence, to attempt a 40' cat. Ditto, building a boat of this scale. You just don't know how much effort (and money) goes into a boat of this size.

    Lastly, you need to get out on the water. Beg, borrow and steal rides on as many different boats as you can. You have no idea what you really like or need, so lots of different experiences are best. Go down to the local sailing club and volunteer as crew. You'll gain valuable skills quickly. I'm on the water 3 or 4 times a week, unless up to my eyeballs in epoxy. Most of us that have made the life you dream (liveaboard and/or cruising) have done so after countless thousands of miles under our keels. Personally, I was born on a boat and raised on an island, so I knew what my destiny was going to be, long before I could walk. Living aboard sounds a lot more romantic than you might find it actually is. I've done so several times in my life and enjoy it, but it also has limitations and is a lot more costly and restrictive than living ashore. It's a choice and you don't need help yet, just the willingness to get out on the water and learn a little. My advice, buy a $500 dinghy and splash it in any local puddle ($500 dinghies don't go in oceans). By the end of the summer, your ideas about sailing, design requirements and what you currently think will be dramatically different, than it is now.
     
  3. upchurchmr
    Joined: Feb 2011
    Posts: 3,275
    Likes: 251, Points: 83, Legacy Rep: 579
    Location: Ft. Worth, Tx, USA

    upchurchmr Senior Member

  4. thiago1979
    Joined: Mar 2016
    Posts: 13
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: Miami

    thiago1979 Junior Member

    Good morning Gentlemen
    Here I lay down my current experience with the process and progress of obtaining a Catamaran Plan. I have emailed several Naval Architect companies colleges and University from within U.S and even China. You cannot imagine the frustration I feel knowing Archimedes from 212 BC figured out how to build and calculate the buoyancy of a massive ship Syracusia that would be a present for Egypt’s Ruler Ptolemy. This ship would be 50X bigger than the average battleship. 8X Watch Towers, 400 Tons of Grain, 10 thousand Jars of Fish, 74 Tons of drinking water, 600 tons of wool. The ship would carry well over one thousand people including 600 Soldiers and 20X Horses in separate stables. And yet by today's standards with high tech Autocad 3D as well as Hydrostatics and Stability software as Orca3d a lot of people keep telling you to keep on Dreaming. I find it too convenient that some people here and a few more of Naval Architect companies and School just keep on telling me to move along. There’s definitely something wrong here gentleman.
     
  5. PAR
    Joined: Nov 2003
    Posts: 19,133
    Likes: 494, Points: 93, Legacy Rep: 3967
    Location: Eustis, FL

    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    The only problem here is your naiveté in regard to what you think you need to understand and what you actually do.

    This how hard could it be approuch has been tried countless times, with few success stories. Your grotesque misunderstandings are evident with your sighting of Syracusia. This was a vessel that was moved once, then given away. If it was able to do much of anything, it would have been retained. I would have expected a better historic sampling then this, which wasn't even documented until 200 years after it was built, making one question the validity of any of the dimensions. Maybe Tessarakonteres would have been better, as a 420' catamaran is impressive, though it was likely just as useless, for the same practical and engineering reasons, most of which you also don't understand.

    Which NA firms have you approached? Gotten any quotes? There's a real set of reasons you keep getting the cold shoulder and I suspect this will be a continuing theme in your life, when discounting professional concerns and with fantasies of grand vessels, from a novice mind and hand. I have three engineering degrees and life time of study, but I'm sure you can just wish it to be true and beat the odds against you. Good luck with this approuch and good luck getting any professional to buy into it.
     
  6. pogo
    Joined: Mar 2010
    Posts: 342
    Likes: 9, Points: 18, Legacy Rep: 73
    Location: Germany Northsea

    pogo ingenious dilletante


    Yepp :D







    On the yard i learned boatbuiling we were encountered with a lot of " special clients" with "special ideas" , " impossible wishes and individual, but impossible dreams lacking any basic background.
    Once my boss said to me:
    " Versuche nie jemanden zu belehren der Belehrungen wirklich notwendig hat. Am Ende bist du der Dumme."
    (Never ever try to advice , or to teach someone who needs advices REALLY. In the end he will put the blame on you.)







    pogo
     
  7. Mr Efficiency
    Joined: Oct 2010
    Posts: 10,401
    Likes: 1,035, Points: 113, Legacy Rep: 702
    Location: Australia

    Mr Efficiency Senior Member

    What's going on ? Is it time to wheel out the Submarine Train again ?
     
  8. Mr Efficiency
    Joined: Oct 2010
    Posts: 10,401
    Likes: 1,035, Points: 113, Legacy Rep: 702
    Location: Australia

    Mr Efficiency Senior Member


    Google translation:
    "Never try to teach someone the teachings really necessary. At the end you are the stupid one "
     
  9. pogo
    Joined: Mar 2010
    Posts: 342
    Likes: 9, Points: 18, Legacy Rep: 73
    Location: Germany Northsea

    pogo ingenious dilletante


    Google translation:

    " Versuchen Sie nie jemand die Lehren wirklich notwendig zu lehren. Am Ende Sie der Dumme sind "

    Google translation 3rd:
    " Never try really necessary to teach anyone lessons . At the end you are the fool "

    4th:
    " Versuchen Sie nie wirklich notwendig jemand Lektionen zu lehren. Am Ende wird man die Narren sind "

    5th:
    " Never try really necessary to teach anyone lessons . At the end you will be the fools "

    a.s. o.


    Google transformation :D










    pogo
     
  10. thiago1979
    Joined: Mar 2016
    Posts: 13
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: Miami

    thiago1979 Junior Member

    Hello Par. Yes Here are some of the Companies I have given a try and here is their reply.
    "Dear Thiago:

    Everything starts with a dream.

    Unless you have 500,000$ at the minimum you are better off purchasing something that already exists for a fraction.

    You know, you can actually sail around the world with a used 30 year catamaran that you can buy for 40$K.

    In any case, I wish you good luck. Just do it !!

    Gregor

    Gregor Tarjan
    CEO & founder

    www.Aeroyacht.com
    +1 631-246 6448"

    Another one is
    "Mr. Paul

    Thanks for your email below. Our firm does provide professional naval architecture services. However, do not believe your project is a good fit our staff currently as we do not specialize in Catamaran sailing boats. Further, most boats in this size range are not full custom designs but rather production boats.

    Our team wishes you the best of luck with nautical dreams.

    Kind Regards,

    Drew B. Hains, PE
    Vice President, Engineering
    Naval Architect/Marine Engineer
    Murray and Associates, LLC.
    4101 Ravenswood Road Suite 210
    Fort Lauderdale, FL 33312
    Switchboard 954-527-5505 EXT 42
    Direct 954-331-2574
    Fax 954-527-5504"
     
  11. thiago1979
    Joined: Mar 2016
    Posts: 13
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: Miami

    thiago1979 Junior Member

    I thank everyone's advice Mr. Pogo. I am just one of those person that don't really like to adhere to sayings "You Can't"or "it's impossible". Before I find myself in an old beat up Sailboat at least I can tell myself I tried.
     
  12. Mr Efficiency
    Joined: Oct 2010
    Posts: 10,401
    Likes: 1,035, Points: 113, Legacy Rep: 702
    Location: Australia

    Mr Efficiency Senior Member

    Don't think of it as old or beat up, think of it as "seasoned" or "proven"
     
  13. thiago1979
    Joined: Mar 2016
    Posts: 13
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: Miami

    thiago1979 Junior Member

    I understand your point. To me whatever you may called it, compared to a nice clean Cat these old fiberglass boats looks depressing. Off course if I had a back yard and time and Money I would have tried, but I live in the back of a efficiency renting the place out and looking for my movies illusions of the sea. From this standpoint of view just about everyone have shut me down on this idea. Yes you can place blame on me for attempting to find and build something solid for me to live in and keep it for years to come. I do not mean disrespect towards any of you. Thanks for you support
     
  14. Mr Efficiency
    Joined: Oct 2010
    Posts: 10,401
    Likes: 1,035, Points: 113, Legacy Rep: 702
    Location: Australia

    Mr Efficiency Senior Member

    Safety first, don't worry about the style or visual appeal of it, there is no pose value once you get over the horizon.
     

  15. PAR
    Joined: Nov 2003
    Posts: 19,133
    Likes: 494, Points: 93, Legacy Rep: 3967
    Location: Eustis, FL

    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    Instead of dreaming, got out there and sail. Books and video, just don't help, though they do entice. Stop over at the local sailing club and volunteer as crew. You'll get lot of experience and learn a few things.
     
Loading...
Forum posts represent the experience, opinion, and view of individual users. Boat Design Net does not necessarily endorse nor share the view of each individual post.
When making potentially dangerous or financial decisions, always employ and consult appropriate professionals. Your circumstances or experience may be different.