My 1st project

Discussion in 'Projects & Proposals' started by tr0ll, Aug 25, 2012.

  1. tr0ll
    Joined: Aug 2012
    Posts: 3
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: India

    tr0ll New Member

    I was wondering if we can build a ship which can generate power during its journey and later reuse it for its propulsion. For that if we make 4 tunnels , 2 besides the center girder and 2 above it at the sides. then if we use that tunnels for turbine by fixing 3 rotors inside it at aft, fore and amidship . then is it possible to generate current from this system and use it for propulsion?? and what will be its effects on resistance and powering??? any suggestions ??
     
  2. rwatson
    Joined: Aug 2007
    Posts: 5,852
    Likes: 290, Points: 83, Legacy Rep: 1749
    Location: Tasmania,Australia

    rwatson Senior Member

    These concepts have been discussed in huge detail in previous threads.

    The related storage and propulsion of power has had a huge amount of discussion.

    You would be well served by doing some searching and reading of the topics, so that you are able to cover specific principles, rather than the very generalized and under researched topics in your original post.
     
  3. lewisboats
    Joined: Oct 2002
    Posts: 2,329
    Likes: 126, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 1603
    Location: Iowa

    lewisboats Obsessed Member

    RW...Check the OP's handle
     
  4. rwatson
    Joined: Aug 2007
    Posts: 5,852
    Likes: 290, Points: 83, Legacy Rep: 1749
    Location: Tasmania,Australia

    rwatson Senior Member

    Yeees - I wondered about that. I put it down to the fact that he was from 'India', and didn't understand the ramifications of the name.

    Me - I'm just a simple minded old man ! Its my son who likes to stir up pages of controversy with a few crazy statements. Its the sport of the 21st century.

    To think they could never get anyone interested in debates when i was a kid
     
  5. tr0ll
    Joined: Aug 2012
    Posts: 3
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: India

    tr0ll New Member

    i searched about that , but suppose the speed of the ship was 14knots, then after the making of 4 tunnels within it and addition of 12 rotors inside that( i.e 3 rotors in each tunnel) the speed of the ship will get reduced by a considerable amount. so pls can you suggest about how to calculate manually that drop in speed due to the addition of the tunnels ????
     
  6. Petros
    Joined: Oct 2007
    Posts: 2,936
    Likes: 140, Points: 63, Legacy Rep: 1593
    Location: Arlington, WA-USA

    Petros Senior Member

    you can not get something for nothing, the extra power it takes to drive such a device would be equal to the power you are taking and storing for later use, plus the loss in the system (which would be very large). So you increase drag and complexity to get back less than half what you put in. Just use a smaller engine in the first place and save fuel.
     
  7. alan white
    Joined: Mar 2007
    Posts: 3,731
    Likes: 121, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 1404
    Location: maine

    alan white Senior Member

    My dad came up with a similar concept as a young boy. He thought about gearing the rear wheels of a car to the front so that once the rear was in motion, it would get its next boost from the front wheels which would be spinning already. Then when the front wheels ran out of power, the rears would again take over.
    Simple and brilliant but unfortunately probably unsuccessful due to actual physics.
    This is real, however: The Danish converted fishing boats to save their hot cooling water during the winter months and once back home the water was pumped into pipes and fed to homes closeby. Free heat!
    If a ship could save its hot cooling water that heat could be used to create additional power, though probably not enough to pay for the conversion to extra mechanical energy.
     
  8. tr0ll
    Joined: Aug 2012
    Posts: 3
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: India

    tr0ll New Member

    can we find out by what amount that drag gets increased , and how much the speed gets reduced exactly ?? any equations for that ??
     
  9. rwatson
    Joined: Aug 2007
    Posts: 5,852
    Likes: 290, Points: 83, Legacy Rep: 1749
    Location: Tasmania,Australia

    rwatson Senior Member

    Puzzled ... are you guys actually talking about something real ?

    I thought we had a TROLL making nonsensical technical mumbo-jumbo ?
     
  10. tugboat

    tugboat Previous Member

    The concept your are talking about sounds to me like the myth of overunity--or basically the second law(i think) of thermodynamics which states that you cannot generate more power than is put out and vice versa- the system would be redundant because the engines you are running would need extra energy to move the boat which now requires more power to push it-due to increased wetted surface and a larger drag co-efficient-all the while needing to run any electric systems onboard


    ...in order to get those costly rotors going at enough speed to charge a battery bank to store your energy...btw how do you plan to store that energy created?????

    -conversely it would be easier to just go D.E. and use batts and an electric engine and charge using alts off the engine--same thing different mechanical arrangemnt... but much less costly than turbines through the hull, and the extra fuel increase from the drag created. your system seems to be a lead weight to me, cycling into inefficiency.

    I get what your trying to propose but this idea of generating energy from an already ineficient system, has been around since the invention of the wheel...and failed. even if you could get 1% less than perfect efficiency- you likely would still not last very long with that extra effort. ...there is no viable replacement -to my knowedge yet- for liquid/ fossil fuels.
    there are some people in the world who say they have the solution to this riddle..but - its highly suspect--nevertheless maybe they know something more than us common folk...
    the idea would be too costly and redundant..my sincere apologies if this sounds negative...
     
  11. rwatson
    Joined: Aug 2007
    Posts: 5,852
    Likes: 290, Points: 83, Legacy Rep: 1749
    Location: Tasmania,Australia

    rwatson Senior Member

    Tugboat - try reading the previous posts.

    This guy is stringing you along. he is a TROLL
     
  12. tugboat

    tugboat Previous Member

    very true- or an idiot; one or the other...thanks for the heads up!:)
     
  13. rwatson
    Joined: Aug 2007
    Posts: 5,852
    Likes: 290, Points: 83, Legacy Rep: 1749
    Location: Tasmania,Australia

    rwatson Senior Member

    Is this guy for real

    Hey Tuggie, maybe I was too harsh. I got this private message

    "Mr. rwatson if i am not wrong then i asked for suggestions and not comments . And for your information i opted for this name because troll is also a fictional character (refer 'world of warcraft' )."

    My comment back was

    ------------------------------------------------------------------

    Thank you for your message.

    If you are a genuine poster, then please accept my apology.

    But - be aware, you have inadvertently chosen a name that has severe implications on the internet.

    A "Troll" in internet term is "In Internet slang, a troll is someone who posts inflammatory,[3] extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as a forum, chat room, or blog, with the primary intent of provoking readers into an emotional response[4] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.[5]"

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troll_(Internet)

    I am not the only one who thought so -

    see the post number 3

    " RW...Check the OP's handle -
    Steve Lewis "

    This name, plus the inane comments you have posted, mean that this thread will probably not be very well supported.
     
  14. tugboat

    tugboat Previous Member

    I offer my apologies too since I did not read the entire thread...however this person may not have understood what a "troll" slang on here was. it may have been an honest mistake...as regards to what his idea is--most of us have given feedback with our opinions...my advice is to "troll"is to realize- there are no really viable long term solutions as yet to fuels, to my knowedge. and its easier to just run alternators or other systems rather than what he proposes...

    TROLL- if your still around--r u wanting to build a boat?.or experiment with alternatives?..this is a nobel cause--but a difficult and long road,.or is this merely just a quick question? the reason we spoke harshly is because there are other trolls on here who really have nothing positive to input. and almost invariably choose to put stomp on dreams rather than support it -...most others on here- offer feedback that is realisitic without judgement. so again accept mine and Mr Watsons apologies...

    please respond with any questions regarding your project and ill do my best to answer them to the level of my knowledge--
    cheers!
     

  15. tugboat

    tugboat Previous Member

    Ive always wondered about how to reuse the heat from the cooling or the exhaust in both IC and steam engines- to reuse all that wasted energy...
     
Loading...
Forum posts represent the experience, opinion, and view of individual users. Boat Design Net does not necessarily endorse nor share the view of each individual post.
When making potentially dangerous or financial decisions, always employ and consult appropriate professionals. Your circumstances or experience may be different.