MV Conception - dive boat fire. Suggestions for improved diving boat standards

Discussion in 'All Things Boats & Boating' started by JosephT, Sep 4, 2019.

  1. Angélique
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    Angélique aka Angel (only by name)

    My bad, changing room looks to be correct and more logical, thanks.

    fire truth aquatics mv conception dive trip boat bunk layout personal changing room.jpg
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2019
  2. Angélique
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    Angélique aka Angel (only by name)

    Not so unlikely for a battery to give a spark while charging, below an example from a year ago...

    (in German) Bild - 23 . 08 . 2018
    Akkuladegerät explodiert 27-Jähriger tot! Batterie schoss ihm direkt ins Herz
    (Battery charger exploded — 27-year-old dead! — Battery shot right into his heart)

    (in German) Bild - 24 . 08 . 2018
    Warum ging das Ladegerät in die Luft?
    (Why the charger blew up?)

    (in English) AP News - August 23, 2018
    Man in Germany killed when AA-battery charger explodes​

    (in English) Candle Power Forums Thread 08 - 23 - 2018
    Death by charging Li-ion battery explosion​
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2019
  3. fallguy
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    fallguy Senior Member

    Still a little curious.

    What are the chances or probability that 34 people were ALL asleep and not one was awake?

    I would say it is nearly zero. If one person awoke to an odor or was awake; would they have had lighted exits?

    In a building, when fire alarms go off, emergency lighting goes on. Do boats have exits lit?

    There are still problems suggesting all died sleeping. The scenario where all die sleeping is more likely carbon monoxide which hasn't been mentioned.
     
  4. Angélique
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    Angélique aka Angel (only by name)

    The suggestion in the news (September 7, 2019) from the Santa Barbara County Sheriff (post #38) I've seen is that they were all asleep while dying, and that they all died from inhaling highly toxic smoke before they burned, which might be investigated by looking if they're burned inside their lungs, or if there's only smoke residue inside. And since there was no collision they at least all need to be found inside their bunks to be sure they were or could be asleep while dying, as the chance is near zero for anyone to wander around there while asleep. This Sheriff's news was published 5 days after the accident on September 2, 2019, don't know if that's enough time to autopsy them all, after the time needed to recover all bodies and bring them ashore. I wonder how many were found in their bunks to be sure there's a chance they were asleep, or how this could be known otherwise.
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2019
  5. fallguy
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    fallguy Senior Member

    Very unlikely that they all perished in their bunks asleep. Very unlikley they were all found in their bunks.

    I am no conspiracy hack.

    It is math. The likelihood of them all sinking in the sea and being found in the same location as their deaths is nearly zero. So it is highly speculative to suggest they all died asleep. I am no forensic specialist, but smart enough to know conjecture when I see it. If a number of them awoke coughing; they were still awake! As divers, they would have been the most capable passengers to escape the environment. None did. The concept of being overcome by fumes is one thing; suggesting asleep another; unless CO caused their sleep.

    This is a horrific story and the industry needs a cross specialty review of standards. Smoke detection, CO detection, egress, lighting. If noone takes a slap in the face; they have their head in the sand. This and the duck boat tragedy are ungoverned enough alike. If not the government; then the industry must.
     
  6. Angélique
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    Angélique aka Angel (only by name)

    I suggest also increased and low O2 level detection and alarm.
     
  7. Angélique
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    Angélique aka Angel (only by name)

    Posts so far on the Santa Barbara County Sheriff’s Office about the Monday September 2, 2019 MV Conception Dive Boat Tragedy

    Posted: Monday - September 2, 2019
    Dive Boat Conception Burns, Sinks Off Santa Cruz Island

    Posted: Monday - September 2, 2019 (the first pic comes from the 'read all' pages with links to the articles)
    UPDATED: Conception Dive Boat Tragedy

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Posted: Thursday - September 5, 2019
    Conception Dive Boat Tragedy Vigil Set for Friday (September 6, 2019)

    [​IMG]

    Posted: Thursday - September 12, 2019
    ("9/5/19" seems to be written on Thursday - September 5, 2019)
    Ongoing Recovery Effort and Start of Salvage
    [​IMG]

    Posted: Thursday - September 12, 2019
    ("9/6/19" seems to be written on Friday - September 6, 2019)
    Sheriff Releases Update on Efforts to Identify Victims of Conception Incident

    Posted: Thursday - September 12, 2019
    ("9/10/19" seems to be written on Tuesday - September 10, 2019)
    Sheriff Releases Update on Victims’ Identities / Search and Recovery Efforts

    Posted: Friday - September 13, 2019
    ("9/12/19" seems to be written on Thursday - September 12, 2019)
    Sheriff Holds Press Briefing Regarding Conception Victims
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2019
  8. Angélique
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    Angélique aka Angel (only by name)

    The level of CO (and O2) in the blood of a living person can be easily measured by light passing through a finger tip, and takes about 2 seconds. So I think autopsy from the blood would reveal easily if and how much CO was involved, which like you I haven't seen mentioned yet, so it seems to be unlikely to me by now.

    example finger tip CO-oximeter by Masimo

    [​IMG]
    (large pic)

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2019
  9. Angélique
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    Angélique aka Angel (only by name)

    In the 4th (the second to last) picture in post #52 differences looks to be there from the MV Conception...

    1. is that outboards attached to hull instead of the RIB in the davits ?

    2. much smaller area looks to be there behind the aft side window in the lower cabin.

    3. aft side window in the lower cabin is far aft of midship, in post #10 the aft side window in the lower cabin is about at midship.

    4. (not marked) the aft deck looks to be much longer in post #10.

    5. (not marked) all of the superstructure already had be gone on the Sheriff’s 3 first pictures (2 of the blaze) in post #52, before the below shown firefighters got on board.

    differences looks to be there from the MV Conception.jpg

    [​IMG]
    the MV Conception as pictured in post #10, which is very similar to her sister ship MV Vision at the bottom of post #7.
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2019
  10. Angélique
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    Angélique aka Angel (only by name)

    The post #40 ~ 42 - Sept. 12, 2019 LA Times article has 41 pictures, and a link to a not dated NTSB Preliminary Report for Web Release PDF, it's from Sept. 12, 2019 says the LA Times article.
     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2019
  11. Angélique
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    Angélique aka Angel (only by name)

    Turns out pic 1 of 41 shows DB Salta Verde is not a derrick barge, but a regular barge or pontoon, with a mobile rotating land crane on tracks on deck (with makeshift wooden beams to spread the deck load), which is lifting over the side, a very dangerous style of operation due to "pontoon effect"

    Threads: Shocking crane barge accident Crane barge stability


    If in a hurry, it starts slowly to happen at ± 0:30 and then accelerates, movement stops at ± 1:30, more on the linked threads.
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2019
  12. jehardiman
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    jehardiman Senior Member

    Angelique, that's a small boat that responded (either USCG, TOWBOAT US, or FD/Sheriffs) occluding the hull. You can tell by the fire monitor there as well as in previous night photos, also notice the AFFF and burned out hull shape in previous photos. Let the NTSB do their job. The CONCEPTION was fiberglass and wood so there is no doubt toxic smoke will be an issue. As I said before, I don't think this is a standards issue, but an implementation. Lack of an roving/anchor watch is the real troubling issue for me.
     
  13. fallguy
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    fallguy Senior Member

    I have a probem trusting the lives of 34 people to one watchman. He has already worked all day and was certainly tired.

    The inherent risk in such a plan is very high.
     
  14. Angélique
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    Angélique aka Angel (only by name)

    Thanks JEH for figuring out that picture for me, now that I know it I can't understand how I've misinterpreted it, but I saw it as one boat and couldn't make sense out of it. For myself and for the ones I've lured into the same trap I've now kinda outlined the boats. At mid of the picture the MV Conception in front, and starboard of her stern the Firefighters boat, who have the MV Conception on port in front of their bow.

    burnt out dive trip boat MV Conception and firefighters on another boat behind it.jpg
     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2019

  15. Sparky568
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    Sparky568 Junior Member


    Interesting video. Not to derail the thread but for those interested here's the aftermath and explanation I guess, can't understand whatever language that is. An expensive day for sure.

     
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