Monohull Speed: Speed Dream by Vlad Murnikov

Discussion in 'Sailboats' started by Doug Lord, Jan 8, 2010.

  1. Alik
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    Alik Senior Member

    Usually multihull is defined as boat having depth of bilge increasing from CL to sides. Yes, it can be tricky due to definitions.

    On the same baisis monhull's keel with bulb canted to windward can be treated as hull also. So it is a proa! :D
     
  2. Doug Lord
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    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    I think there will be a lot of "foil assisted" or full flying monohull keel boats trying to beat multihulls at the speed game. And you're 100% right- it could get tricky with definitions...
     

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  3. Munter
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    Munter Amateur

    Why do you say bureacrats? Afaik it was just the class making an interpretation of their class rules.
     
  4. Paul B

    Paul B Previous Member

    This type of claim always makes me smile. Yes, Fazisi finished 11/23 in that race. What is not mentioned is there were multiple classes in the race and Fasizi was basically crushed by almost every one of the boats in her class. She had to expect to finish before the smaller boats in the classes behind. The project was a failure, if the goal was to be competitive in the race they entered.

    It is no surprise that the Lord of All Puffery takes the claim hook, line, and sinker. We will undoubtedly be seeing him post these same pictures for years after this project is long dead, just as he continues to post the same kind of puffery of long defunct/never were projects that "prove" his other whackiness.
     
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  5. Paul B

    Paul B Previous Member

    None of the boats depicted in your post are "foil assisted" or "full flying" as shown. None of them were ever built, or will ever be build. The rest of the world has disregarded these pictures as vapourware for the past 5 years. That is everyone but you, who seems to think they are "real" and "prove" some deranged idea of yours.

    Yet somehow you can't post any photos of your new non-foiler. Something tells me the pictures of these long ago defunct works of others are more "real" than your "design" (that you can't even draw).
     
  6. Alik
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    Alik Senior Member

    Was Fazisi a breakthrough? No. Was it unique experience? Yes.

    The boat was desigend by engineers who have never seen maxi yacht before; built at yard building commercial alloy craft; crewed mostly by amateurs and... passed all legs of the race, showing reasonable results. They came to race for experience and they got it.
     
  7. Paul B

    Paul B Previous Member

    Everything you say is probably true.

    Except the "showing reasonable results" part. You are right, they were not "a breakthrough", in fact they were not competitive.


    I made my comments to point out the way the press release is written it seems to be a bit misleading, as press releases often are. I guess it would be more difficult to sell this maxi boat project to potential investors if it was written as you stated.
     
  8. Alik
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    Alik Senior Member

    Yes, but they completed all legs without accidents, not being the last boat on all legs. Good for newcomer, or not?

    I don't think this project is sellable even with this press-release... :D
     
  9. Paul B

    Paul B Previous Member

    Not impressed. Neither was their sponsor.


    I think we agree. However, we need to keep in mind what P.T. Barnum has to say on these matters.
     
  10. Doug Lord
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    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    Just received the following pdf from Vlad Murnikov that illustrates how he intends to develop the RM for Speed Dream as well as utilize foil assist for RM and wetted surface reduction with a system similar to DSS. He expects the foil to lift 30-50% of the boats weight.
    Foil assist has been used in multihulls for sometime but its use in monohull keelboats has been very limited to non-existent until DSS and now Vlads version.
    He also points out that his canting keel system is designed to cant far enough to sail 100% clear of the water, further reducing drag.
    Vlad says that this is a preliminary version of the system.
     

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  11. Chris Ostlind

    Chris Ostlind Previous Member

    Does anyone here believe that any idea like this one should be first built as a 30 footer... and then a 50 footer... and so on, before trying to fly a 90+ footer with absolutely no reference point, whatsoever?

    I like that Vlad is a dream-schemin' kind of guy. But, that's one heck of big leap into the mist when you are looking to grab-up someone's money for a never before assembled bunch of concepts... and you propose doing so at serious maxi proportions.
     
  12. Doug Lord
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    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    Speed Dream

    Vlad says today: "The plan is to build a
    40% scaled prototype first, run it through a series of tests, comparing
    the findings with the CFD and VPP modeling, make design adjustment as
    necessary and only then start construction. "


    He hopes to build the final version in 2012.....
     
  13. Doug Lord
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    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    From tonight's(3/4/10) Scuttlebutt-featuring new renderings by Tyler Doyle of Doyle sailmakers:
     

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  14. bistros

    bistros Previous Member

    And therein lies the source of the perception problem surrounding Mr. Murnikov. Reading through the material, at the end there is a claim the MX Ray can do 27 knots. I'm sure this claim is absolutely true - if you find a large enough building to drop it from.

    I'd accept a claim that a MX Ray could possibly reach 20 knots burst speed on a GPS, but not anywhere close to that of a foiling Moth. And yes, I've seen one and a good friend sailed it for years until he sold it to buy a 29er for singlehanding.

    Some people just never learn that underpromoting and overdelivering can generate more interest and credibility than overpromoting and underdelivering. I just hate people who try to enhance their own credibility by name dropping someone else's (i.e. renderings by Doyle) on a hypothetical unfunded project.

    --
    Bill
     

  15. Doug Lord
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    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    --------------------------
    MX-Ray: 115lb 162 offwind SA
    1) This is what Vlad says:
    "Just like the Moth guys, we used to have an informal speed contest using
    GPS, and 27 knots was one of MX-Ray sailor's claims. Of course, there's
    no verification, but I tend to trust people. Besides, the actual speed numbers are not as relevant as the fact that MX-Ray is a very fast, simple and easy to sail boat.


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-XUlHahNMvE

    Another fact is that her design was way ahead of time and only recently
    was her performance surpassed. Several manufacturers has followed in her
    wake and now a concept of a single-handed dinghy with an asymmetric is
    widely accepted. But 15 years ago I was widely ridiculed for introducing it.
    There are, of course, people that would never accept facts. For some the
    only way to establish themselves is by diminishing other's achievements.
    Exercising own arrogance is these people's favorite pass time and,
    sadly, you cannot change this
    ."



    2) This is really unfortunate combination of the the things Vlad refers to above. If I were him I'd be ecstatic at having Doyle Sailmakers take this kind of interest in my idea. What should he say-"No thanks, I like my rendering better". Just silly.....
    I wish Vlad the best of luck and I think it is the heigth of arrogance for someone who knows nothing about this project make such *unfounded comments!
     

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