Modern hirondelle

Discussion in 'Multihulls' started by guzzis3, Nov 18, 2016.

  1. Mr Efficiency
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    Mr Efficiency Senior Member

    That boat in the pic is 8' beam, or trailer is overwidth ?
     
  2. guzzis3
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    guzzis3 Senior Member

    No that's a crowther international 23. It's very close in length to what I'm proposing, but it's an open deck expanding cat not a bridgedeck. It's got LAR keels.

    I was thinking of getting a rough one and chopping it into the mini bridgedeck, but the purpose of the picture is to show the impact the 6' headroom would have. They are about 4'6" standard. The red line shows how the new cabin top would go.
     
  3. CT249
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    CT249 Senior Member

    Doesn't the Int 23 have low volume hulls and trouble taking cruising gear and retaining a reasonable bridgedeck clearance, like the SW24? I saw a cruise-equipped one of them a few weeks ago and it had less clearance than a 16' cat.
     
  4. catsketcher
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    catsketcher Senior Member

    You really don't need headroom

    Both my little cats do not have headroom and seem to be nice to live on. There is a bench seat along the insides of each hull that you can slide along easily. On top of this you can also have a nice large hatch somewhere so that you can stand up to have a look around and put your pants on. As long as there is a hatch somewhere I can stand up and stick my head out I never missed headroom on a small boat. Small boats should be fun to sail and headroom at 7m will kill them stone dead.

    As Ct says you have to be very careful about the donor boat. I love Loch Crowther's work but no one would ever accuse him of designing fat boats. The International 23 has the payload of a small coracle and is not really suitable for cruising.

    If you are set on headroom then there was an 8 metre cat called the Freedom 8 that was built in the 80s. There may be a few of them around. Can't find any on the net at the moment. IIRC they sailed a bit like a dog.

    cheers

    Phil
     
  5. cavalier mk2
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    cavalier mk2 Senior Member

    I'd suggest a poptop as a more seaman like solution. I agree with Phil though, you really don't need headroom in small sizes. I have a poptop on the 23' mono complete with the canvas work and rarely used it. The reason? Every time you leave the cabin there is standing headroom, lots of it. The sky is the limit.
     
  6. jamez
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    jamez Senior Member

    Guzzi, yes splashed back in 2013. http://www.boatdesign.net/forums/multihulls/nicky-cruz-7-6-launched-47897.html

    The shortest cat that successfully had 6' headroom that I know of was the 8 metre Simpson Backslash. If you can do without trailering the production version in aussie was the Formula One, a nice foam/glass number with 'snug' doubles and a separate toilet compartment. Otherwise you might be looking at a custom design to get exactly what you want. I wouldn't muck around modifying something like the I23 which won't handle the extra weight.
     
  7. redreuben
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    redreuben redreuben

  8. redreuben
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    redreuben redreuben

    Oh forgot to say, I have a mate with a Crowther 23, forget it, bad idea.
     
  9. guzzis3
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    guzzis3 Senior Member

    Thank you again for the comments.

    Sounds like everyone thinks my idea is a bad one.

    I had suspected the inter was not a load carrier. As said Mr Crowther did love to drawer narrow hulls.

    I was not aware that seawinds were terrible load carriers. I thought they were wet as a submarine with fly screens out of the box, no cruising gear required. I've not sailed on one, but they are the only boat I have ever encountered where absolutely everyone I have ever heard discussing one starts with a mention of how wet they are. I have always found it odd that the seawind page has mention of the 24 but nothing on the 31. It's like they don't want o acknowledge it ever existed...

    I am aware of fish and chips. I don't know about the freedom 8, unless it is the bridgedeck cat I saw for sale in WA a few years back.

    Jamez: Great news on your boat. I was busy avoiding death when you were launching so I was a tad preoccupied...
     
  10. RHP
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    RHP Senior Member

    Ref headroom, my Achilles 24 monohull has a 4'6" headroom and I wouldn't have it any other way. I say that being 6'7".
     
  11. cavalier mk2
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    cavalier mk2 Senior Member

    The thing about Mother Nature is she has more of a target to knock you down if you are standing up. At anchor too there are times you'd want a low profile to avoid dragging. Nothing like going for a sail with the deck tent, they don't tack well!
     
  12. redreuben
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    redreuben redreuben

  13. guzzis3
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    guzzis3 Senior Member

    redreuben: Thank you for that. I'd seen the 27' simpson hadn't noticed the 24' boat. There is one for sale here:

    https://www.tradeboats.com.au/detail/simpson-breton-24-catamaran-308559

    Well it sounds like the consensus is that 6' headroom in under 8 meters is a bad idea. Back to the drawing board :)

    There are a few 24' and 26/27' bridgedeck cats about. Derek Kelsall has both:

    http://www.kelsall.com/Designs/KSS24s.htm

    I'll see if I can find anything on the freedom 8. There are some shorter bridgedeck cats that look pretty awful, and some like the simpson above that are pretty dear for what they are. I wonder how wide a boat you could fit in the 2.9 meter width if tilted at 45 degrees, given 6' headroom. Hm. I'll have to look at that, but it's getting bigger of course :(
     
  14. redreuben
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    redreuben redreuben

    Kelsall

    Kelsall has some great small cat designs particularly the older timber plans however all his plans are ridiculously expensive.
     

  15. guzzis3
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    guzzis3 Senior Member

    Yes that's true.

    Mind the simpson plans aren't cheap either and I'm not sure if you get any support with them. Oddly the 24' plans are listed as dearer than the 27' plans.

    I'm not a fan of boatcraft pacific. Personally I'd deal with atl or fgi who are just down the road from me...well 15kms :)

    Maybe I should have bought that cheap sango a few months back...
     
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