Minimum Passagemaker/Cruiser

Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by mydauphin, Sep 29, 2010.

?

What is minimum that you can handle?

Poll closed Oct 29, 2010.
  1. I can only live in a proper yacht

    2 vote(s)
    6.1%
  2. Need: Size between 40 and 50 feet

    8 vote(s)
    24.2%
  3. Need: Size between 30 and 40 feet

    15 vote(s)
    45.5%
  4. Need: Size smaller than 30 feet ok

    8 vote(s)
    24.2%
  5. Need: Power

    22 vote(s)
    66.7%
  6. Need: Sail

    19 vote(s)
    57.6%
  7. Need: Single Engine

    24 vote(s)
    72.7%
  8. Need: Twin Engine

    5 vote(s)
    15.2%
  9. Need: Head and holding tank

    26 vote(s)
    78.8%
  10. Need: Air conditioner and Generator

    7 vote(s)
    21.2%
  11. Need: Watermaker

    15 vote(s)
    45.5%
  12. I don't care if interior looks like my garage

    8 vote(s)
    24.2%
  13. Need: DC Power Only

    15 vote(s)
    45.5%
  14. Need: Carpeting

    4 vote(s)
    12.1%
  15. Need: Wood floors

    9 vote(s)
    27.3%
  16. Need: Satellite TV

    3 vote(s)
    9.1%
  17. Need: Internet

    13 vote(s)
    39.4%
  18. Need: Hot Water Shower

    18 vote(s)
    54.5%
  19. Need: Manual Bilge pumps

    17 vote(s)
    51.5%
  20. Need: Propane Stove

    16 vote(s)
    48.5%
  21. Need: Freezer

    12 vote(s)
    36.4%
  22. Need: A boat that won't shame me at the marina.

    12 vote(s)
    36.4%
  23. Need: Windlass

    18 vote(s)
    54.5%
  24. Need: Dingy

    26 vote(s)
    78.8%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. mydauphin
    Joined: Apr 2007
    Posts: 2,164
    Likes: 52, Points: 48, Legacy Rep: 575
    Location: Florida

    mydauphin Senior Member

    So we all can't afford the perfect passagemaker. What is the minimum level of comfort that we can handle or feel safe in. At the end there will be a prize someone will get to design it...
     
  2. mydauphin
    Joined: Apr 2007
    Posts: 2,164
    Likes: 52, Points: 48, Legacy Rep: 575
    Location: Florida

    mydauphin Senior Member

    To me depending on a mix of coastal crusing and island hopping. A 35 foot boat with a range of 400 miles. With one room AC, ac inverter, 4kw generator, hot water for shower, dry bunk. I believe a watermaker is essential since I don't trust the water in many places I go to. Also kind of need internet.
     
  3. yipster
    Joined: Oct 2002
    Posts: 3,486
    Likes: 95, Points: 58, Legacy Rep: 1148
    Location: netherlands

    yipster designer

    o yaeh, anaother boat design competition, ah well, who knows what comes of it :p

    as thrue things were said elsewhere, it also gotta be a liveaboard and 99% a marinabird as well
    so today needs grey and black water tanks, yek. i'll check your safety and luxory list above later mydauphin

    did you boy's check my rough ladybird design ( in my gallery ) was thinking of minimising that a bit
    make some new drawings of her, wont be the most minimal concept tho witch must be a bathtub or so

    glad you opened this thread under boatdesign as i ddont think it has to be neccesarely as a motorboat
    this boat can be sail, motor or motorsailor alrite? like to see and hear thoughts and samples

    here a big water boat doc i dont want to post at the other tread anymore :(
     
  4. mydauphin
    Joined: Apr 2007
    Posts: 2,164
    Likes: 52, Points: 48, Legacy Rep: 575
    Location: Florida

    mydauphin Senior Member

    Clarification, this statement was a joke. I have no intention of building another boat - too poor for that now. I was being sarcastic as a lot of people come promising to build a boat trying to catch a unsuspecting designer or get free advice. I am trying to make a priority list of what is important in a passagemaker separating need from want.

    Thanks yipster for your attachment I will read later.
     
  5. apex1

    apex1 Guest

    Thanks for keeping it here Yipster! It is so full of flaws, wrong conclusions and misinformation, it should not have been published.

    Regards
    Richard
     
  6. mydauphin
    Joined: Apr 2007
    Posts: 2,164
    Likes: 52, Points: 48, Legacy Rep: 575
    Location: Florida

    mydauphin Senior Member

    What is wrong with it?
     
  7. apex1

    apex1 Guest

    In short: All

    The guy going from a 40ft boat to a 70ft, being disppointed with the sailing performance (pointing) and then comes his conclusion that "having all this accommodation" was wrong. idiotic......

    The chapter on Beebe and Leishman (cheap adverts for Nordhavn) calling that pamphlet valid for Passagemakers. idiotic......

    Beebe did create (or used) the word passagemaker for the first time, thats true. But the boats he referred to have never been ocean crossing vessels! These were just fast coastal cruisers. Same is valid for the Nordhavn range. They are NOT capable oceean cruisers as advertised. They are coastal cruisers with a long range.

    And so on.
    Amateurs drivelling along about stuff they don´t know.
     
  8. yipster
    Joined: Oct 2002
    Posts: 3,486
    Likes: 95, Points: 58, Legacy Rep: 1148
    Location: netherlands

    yipster designer

    i take it you esspecially mean the big blue water sailing cats
     
  9. apex1

    apex1 Guest

    No, of course not. I did say what I was referring to.
     
  10. yipster
    Joined: Oct 2002
    Posts: 3,486
    Likes: 95, Points: 58, Legacy Rep: 1148
    Location: netherlands

    yipster designer

    mydauphin:
    "At the end there will be a prize someone will get to design it... Clarification, this statement was a joke"
    as understood, nevertheless this poll also allready shows interesting results

    apex1:
    "No, of course not. I did say what I was referring to"
    i'm not alway's that clear on you but than my excuses for the presumptionous reply
     
  11. MatthewDS
    Joined: Mar 2010
    Posts: 104
    Likes: 3, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 48
    Location: Juneau, Alaska

    MatthewDS Senior Member

    Recently I started planning a trip that I really wanted to make upon retirement. I don't need to live extravagantly, so I felt that a 40-50 ft steel power yacht finished to fishing boat standards would suit me just fine. I started working up basic sketches of my boat, and was having a great time.

    Until...

    I worked out the distance between the closest two ports with available fuel, and realized that I would have to carry 5500 miles worth of fuel. This quickly put an end to my 40 footer.

    My Point? Instead of asking if people can live without air conditioning, perhaps a better question would be what is the maximum length of passage that people feel a passagemaker should be designed for. Otherwise, we are kind of talking apples to oranges.
     
  12. apex1

    apex1 Guest

    Believe me, the 20m ballpark I mentioned so often, is about the minimum size for a ocean crossing motoryacht. No matter AC in the loo or not.
    Everything below is just not sensible.
     
  13. TeddyDiver
    Joined: Dec 2007
    Posts: 2,570
    Likes: 119, Points: 73, Legacy Rep: 1650
    Location: Finland/Norway

    TeddyDiver Gollywobbler

  14. WestVanHan
    Joined: Aug 2009
    Posts: 1,374
    Likes: 56, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 746
    Location: Vancouver

    WestVanHan Not a Senior Member


    Curious about Richard's proposed boat....

    ....I quickly looked up a few nm ranges,these are straight shot runs: NO stopping for fuel,diversions for bad currents,avoiding lows:

    Sydney to Los Angeles: 6500
    Sydney to Honolulu:4400
    Sydney to Hong Kong:5000
    Honolulu to LA:2200.
    LA to Panama:3200
    NY to UK: 2800
    Perth Aus to Capetown 4600
    Capetown to Miami:4200
    Vancouver to Japan: 4200


    To make a straight run from Sydney to LA-@ 9.1 knots he wouldn't make it,and at 8.1 he'd be hoping there were no unfavourable currents or winds.

    I guess that's why:

    So if you have 4500 nm and have 15% reserve,with maybe a stop to top off if needed,it should be more than enough to do the common runs.
     

  15. waynep
    Joined: Aug 2010
    Posts: 31
    Likes: 1, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 11
    Location: United States

    waynep Junior Member

    It's really unfortunate that a boat design forum could be limited because the primary thought in the back of one's mind is "I don't want to give away free advice". This way of thinking makes a strong forum a weaker one. As for me, size smaller than 30 feet OK, so long as I can show it may be done safely. How can I begin the process of proving the design is viable? By researching the tons of great information available on boat design and boat building, and the great advice from others who have been there and done that.
     
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