Mini Ocean Racing Scow

Discussion in 'Sailboats' started by Doug Lord, Aug 2, 2011.

  1. Doug Lord
    Joined: May 2009
    Posts: 16,651
    Likes: 322, Points: 93, Legacy Rep: 1362
    Location: Cocoa, Florida

    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    Mini Transat

    According to SA's front page David Raison's innovative scow 747 has regained the lead as of 12 noon today in the proto division. Begining to look like the scow is here to stay in the Mini class. Much more about the boat earlier in this thread.
    It's being skippered by Giancarlo Pedote and is named Prysmian.
    Lots of carnage in the race so far. http://www.minitransat.fr/?lang=en
    -----
    From Scuttlebut Europe:
    Mini Transat - A Fleet Caught Off Guard

    They say that the "Portuguese trade winds" rarely herald a walk in the park, and the passage round Cape Finisterre and the descent along the coast of Galicia have done nothing to disprove this rule. Instead of the expected winds of 25 knots, the fleet has been confronted by a gale. With varying degrees of success ...

    The accompanying support boat La Pampero, reported that their boat speed we peaking at in excess of 15 knots and they were being overtaken by some competitors. In these conditions its difficult to avoid broaching, sometimes with disasterous consequences.

    ====================
    Technical stops and retirements

    Yannick Le Clech (692 Diaoulic) dismasted. A support boat is 12 nm away and heading to him. Under jury rig, he is en route to Cascais at a speed of 2.2 knots.
    François Lamy (566 Guadeloupe Espace Océan) is heading to Cascais with a damaged rudder to try to fix it.
    Carlos Lizancos (431 Reyno de Navarra) is heading for Cascais with a technical problem.
    Maxime Salle (348 Bongo) has restarted from Baiona after solving his steering problem. Pilar Pasanau (519 Peter Punk) and Richard Hewson (816 RG650.org) are also due to leave the Spanish port following technical stops.
    Yann Le Pautremat (483 Prep Nautic Sea Echo 1% for the Planet) and Sébastien Picault (198 Kickers) have confirmed their retirement.
     

    Attached Files:

  2. Baltic Bandit

    Baltic Bandit Previous Member

    2 boats with rudder problems and 2 protos with keel problems plus one dismasting is hardly "carnage" Doug. This is about normal for the first 48 hours out in rough seas since this is when the gear really gets tested.
     
  3. sharpii2
    Joined: May 2004
    Posts: 1,913
    Likes: 111, Points: 63, Legacy Rep: 611
    Location: Michigan, USA

    sharpii2 Senior Member

    -----

    Not surprising. The scow is a great idea for a down wind race. And it exploits a major loophole in the box rule. It increases initial stability without increasing Beam. Great thinking--inside the box.
     
  4. Doug Lord
    Joined: May 2009
    Posts: 16,651
    Likes: 322, Points: 93, Legacy Rep: 1362
    Location: Cocoa, Florida

    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    Mini Transat/ Mini Scow

    From the mini transat site: (read full article here: http://www.minitransat.fr/actualites/charbons-ardents-et-vagues-lames )

    Giancarlo Pedote (Prysmian) was determined that his position as leader of the fleet when the Douarnenez to Sada leg was cancelled would not be usurped. In conditions that are not particularly favorable to the hull shape of his prototype, the Italian navigator is keeping the competition at bay. In the series boats, Aymeric Belloir (Tout le Monde Chante contre le Cancer), has been highly motivated initially and must now contain the onslaught of a furious chasing trio.

    Breakages and lessons
    The Portuguese trade winds have already pulled the rug from under a number of competitors, include two podium contenders in both the series boats and the protos. Ian Lipinski (Pas de Futur sans Numérique) paid the price for coming off a big wave. Bad luck struck when Ian, just out of a nap, was about to go on deck, he was caught by a wave that filled the interior of the Pogo in no time. At the same time, the boat turned turtle sitting with its keel in the air for a long time before coming upright dismasted. Ian was collected by a cargo ship that was en route to Sfax in Tunisia. Later that night, it was Gwénolé Gahinet (Watever / Logways) requesting assistance from the race organisation, when one of his keel bearings broke. The navigator, who could have lost his keel at any time, was finally able to board a Portuguese fishing boat. Other soloists who have thrown in the towel are: Joel Garcia Miro (Argo 650) who will not leave Camarillas where he had taken refuge. Yann Le Pautremat and Sébastien Picault have confirmed their retirement, alongside Bert Bossyns (Netwerk) who took refuge in the port of Peniche. Finally, Gilles Avril (Evolution Marine) hit a log in a surf. The bow of the boat did not survive the crash. He is now safe aboard one of the support boats.
     
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2013
  5. Doug Lord
    Joined: May 2009
    Posts: 16,651
    Likes: 322, Points: 93, Legacy Rep: 1362
    Location: Cocoa, Florida

    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    Revolution 22

    I didn't look at each page of this thread but I used the search function and this did not come up. A production (cruising) version of Raison's super fast scow:
    http://www.afep-marine.com/info_revolution22.html

    edit: added qualifyer to "production"
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2013
  6. HydroNick
    Joined: Apr 2010
    Posts: 87
    Likes: 3, Points: 8, Legacy Rep: 38
    Location: British Columbia

    HydroNick Nick S

    This is not exactly about the scow but is about MiniTransats. Does anybody know if there is one of the Dudley Dix designs in the 2013 race, or how they fare against the other 6.50s?

    DD has several designs, the latest is http://www.dixdesign.com/didiminiMk3.htm

    Thanks
     
  7. Baltic Bandit

    Baltic Bandit Previous Member

    no - no Dudley Dix boats in the fleet. Fleet Roster is here: (I've turned on English for you in the link - you have to go through each of the skippers bio's by hand to figure out who the designer is) www.minitransat.fr/skippers/portraits?lang=en

    Basically all the protos are carbon -fibre boats, only one is "homebuilt" and that is buy a guy in the industry.

    Note the Pogo 3 renderings look to be moving in the direction of a "scow bow" but I could see someone doing a full on scow bow Series boat. Commission Raison to do the design, see if you can line up 3 pre-buyers.

    that then means you only have to sell 3 boats But the question would still be as to whether or not the "scow bow" could work as well without the canting keel and offset Daggerboards.

    It might not be as effective
     
  8. HydroNick
    Joined: Apr 2010
    Posts: 87
    Likes: 3, Points: 8, Legacy Rep: 38
    Location: British Columbia

    HydroNick Nick S

    Thanks

    Thanks Baltic Bandit
     
  9. salglesser
    Joined: Apr 2012
    Posts: 58
    Likes: 3, Points: 8, Legacy Rep: 47
    Location: Colorado, USA

    salglesser Junior Member

    Thanx for the update Doug. The long delay was a drag, but safer to be sure. Great race.

    sal
     
  10. Doug Lord
    Joined: May 2009
    Posts: 16,651
    Likes: 322, Points: 93, Legacy Rep: 1362
    Location: Cocoa, Florida

    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    Mini

    ===============
    You're welcome-neat little boats....
     
  11. Baltic Bandit

    Baltic Bandit Previous Member

    Not exactly. A "production version" of something typically is the same design with some minor mods for production.

    This instead is a completely new design, the bow volume is similar and the length is similar, but

    • the rig is very different
    • the hull is AL and hence the boat is much much heavier. (1.5 Tons vs about 0.8 Tons) in fact this makes the 22'er heavier than a J-24
    • The shape is quite a bit different with a lot more freeboard and hence slower upwind
    • no canting keel, thus the sail carrying area is dramatically reduced - again making it a lot slower

    So a lot slower, a lot heavier, a different hull shape... seems to me to be a different boat rather than "a production version" of 747
     
  12. Doug Lord
    Joined: May 2009
    Posts: 16,651
    Likes: 322, Points: 93, Legacy Rep: 1362
    Location: Cocoa, Florida

    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    Mini Scow

    The new scow-#865:
    click-
     

    Attached Files:

  13. Tom.151
    Joined: Jul 2009
    Posts: 194
    Likes: 10, Points: 18, Legacy Rep: 38
    Location: New England, USA

    Tom.151 Senior Member

    Thanks Doug,

    This design is new to me, finally found more info... according to Davy Beaudart (the skipper, on Facebook) "Maximum alias M2.0 is David Raison's new plan".

    I like it, a lot. Looks much less 'blunt' to my eye - even though the flat above the chine now wraps all the way around the bow. Guessing it will be even stiffer that Raison's first (747) attempt.

    Very encouraging that Raison has the experience with 747 and has gone to the next evolution. Gives confidence in this new (865) direction for shapes.

    Would be very interesting to see heeled-waterline comparo to those posted above.

    Will now be hard to not build something like this as an unballasted raid boat (okay, maybe slightly water-ballasted) - just for fun. With a Cox's Bay Skimmer rig of course.
     

    Attached Files:

  14. Skyak
    Joined: Jul 2012
    Posts: 1,194
    Likes: 25, Points: 38, Legacy Rep: 152
    Location: United States

    Skyak Senior Member

    I am surprised there isn't a freaky large articulating bow sprit. With all that buoyancy forward I expected a huge head-sail.
     

  15. Tom.151
    Joined: Jul 2009
    Posts: 194
    Likes: 10, Points: 18, Legacy Rep: 38
    Location: New England, USA

    Tom.151 Senior Member

    No doubt for Classe Mini events there will be the classic HUGE downwind rags.

    One of the pictures (on FB) shows some semblance of hardware for the pole mount - but none show the pole rigged yet.

    If I remember, there was discussion of possibly trying a different way to better control the pole, other than the typical (demountable) struts, due to the useful extra width for staying forward.
     
Loading...
Forum posts represent the experience, opinion, and view of individual users. Boat Design Net does not necessarily endorse nor share the view of each individual post.
When making potentially dangerous or financial decisions, always employ and consult appropriate professionals. Your circumstances or experience may be different.