max beam

Discussion in 'Option One' started by gonzo, Jul 4, 2003.

  1. Fanie
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    Location: Colonial "Sick Africa"

    Fanie Fanie

    Who wants to eat in bed anyway :D

    (Who-ever is hungry :D)



    Why doesn't he put up some pics then ? It really would be very nice to see how it progresses. There is much to learn from the interior's build, one normally just see the hulls (as if that's the whole boat).
     
  2. tom28571
    Joined: Dec 2001
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    Location: Oriental, NC

    tom28571 Senior Member

    OK Fanie, I dug around and found a few shots sent to me by the owner this year at various stages. The first is a shot of the aft chines that I use to get the boat onto plane at low speed and for a smother ride in chop. The others are the steering station, forward cabin, dinette seat and crew seat pedestal and the head.
     

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  3. Willallison
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    Location: Australia

    Willallison Senior Member

    The one crowd who do take notice of the various regulations are the insurance companies. Run oversize, or overweight, and you will likely find yourself seriously out of pocket if you need to make a claim....
     
  4. dskira

    dskira Previous Member

    I didn't thought of that. Good point. I will remembered.
    Thanks
    Daniel
     
  5. marshmat
    Joined: Apr 2005
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    Location: Ontario

    marshmat Senior Member

    The insurance companies will have your head served on a plate if you need to make a claim and it turns out your rig was illegal. I wouldn't even think about chancing it.

    The same goes for trailer weight- in Ontario at least, any trailer over 4.6 tonnes requires a Class A trucker's licence. A lot of folks pull five-tonne RVs with only a Class G, ie. the standard car driver's licence- the cops don't much care, but the insurers will kill you if they find out.

    I might add that an additional advantage of keeping beam at 8', besides not running into width issues as you move between jurisdictions, is that it allows you to make full-width bulkheads out of standard plywood sheets, no splicing.
     
  6. kim s
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    Location: essex, uk

    kim s Junior Member

    trailor width

    Here in UK I bought a boat that was 9'4" wide. I walked into the local police station and they basically did not have a clue. They phoned the head of the local traffic police to ask.
    I have not converted to metricsohere you are
    I was told

    Behind a CAR----trailor max wheel base 7'6" width--- with 1ft overhang either side MAX.
    I had to remove all the stanchions as this made the boat 9'8"

    got stopped by the local police and they where right snotty. I was told I should have an escort vehicle. and I was almost definatly over weight.
    I got the tape measure out to prove the size and it took them 20mins to contact the traffic police to check. Once I proved I was right, I was asked to take the lot to the public weigh station.
    Once it was confirmed I was NOT over weight by 230Kilo (short but fat light weight racing boat) They then went through the car with a fine tooth comb and where quite upset that all they could give me was a 7 day wonder for producing the insurance/mot/liscence etc (we dont need to have them in the car at all times).
    The boat I bought was available in UK with a tilting trailor to conform to the euro roads.

    Kim
     
  7. Fanie
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    Location: Colonial "Sick Africa"

    Fanie Fanie

    Write a letter to the trafic dept head and explain to them it is not nice to be harrassed when you try to do everything within the law. It is unreasonable behaviour.
     
  8. kim s
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    kim s Junior Member

    Fanie,

    Its not so much as being hassled, Its more worriing that they dont know the laws?? mind you I suppose 2 guys cant know everything and all the laws. The rest was just cos they dont like smart asses who know a bit of law better than they do.

    Kim
     
  9. marshmat
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    Location: Ontario

    marshmat Senior Member

    I had a fun time a few years ago with a cargo trailer.... 8'6" wide, completely within all limits for that class of trailer.

    But nobody had told the road work crew on King Street that 8'6" is a legal width. I managed to simultaneously whack the pylons on both sides of the lane for about a 50-metre stretch. Needless to say, the following day, the temporary lane was set to the proper width ;)
     
  10. SeaJay
    Joined: Jun 2007
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    Location: Sacramento

    SeaJay Senior Member

    I did a bit of research a couple of years ago for my project and can report my parameters and findings.

    1. I'm in Sacramento, CA and wanted access to all West Coast cruising grounds, including Lake Tahoe. I wanted the maximum siz boat that could be "conveniently" trailered. I started with a LOA of approximately 40'.

    2. With the exception of Lake Tahoe, I could access virtually all areas via the Interstate highways which are much more accomodating to over-width loads.

    3. I would likely move the boat once or twice a year (Puget Sound in summer, San Diego in winter), so weekend trailering was not a requiremnt.

    4. With my limited trailering requirements, it was very questionable if I could economically justify the ownership cost of a tow vehicle and trailer. (This was a big disapointment to me as I was all excited about having a good story to tell my wife why I just had to have a new beefy diesel PU.) I think you have to take a very critical look at the cost associated with a trailer and tow vehicle. For me, and I believe a lot of other people, it is not only the direct costs of the tow package, but you also have to consider storage costs. All of a sudden I was going to be facing both dock fees and trailer storage fees. It started making a lot of sense to just hire a trucker to move the boat when required.

    4. I started with an 8'-6" beam as no permits seemed to be required on the roads I wanted to travel. (Each state PUC website will post oversize load requirements)

    5. The design spiral soon indicated that a 10' beam (as noted earlier in this thread) offered a more realistic interior layout as well as side decks. 10' feet seemed like a reasonable compromise as although over-width permits were required there were no pilot car requirements and minimal restrictions over smaller highways.

    6. It was a short jump from 10' to 12' in that while I would be more restricted on smaller highways, no pilot cars would be required on the Interstates and the access roads to the ports I was considering.

    I now have to recues myself from this thread as I ended up buying a hull with a 14' beam and shipped it down from Canada. The shipping / permits weren't really a problem, but the pilot house I'm building will be much more of an issue as it will likely push me beyond a 13'6" overall height. From what I determined, overheight is much more of a problem. I haven't ruled out the possibility of highway transport, but it will be a big infrequent project and in no way could be considered "trailering".

    Best Regards,

    SeaJay
     
  11. FAST FRED
    Joined: Oct 2002
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    Location: Conn in summers , Ortona FL in winter , with big d

    FAST FRED Senior Member

    IN the USA at this time large tractors are almost a giveaway.

    Pre EGR (before 2003) is most reliable

    A unit that has a sleeping area , small stove ect can be registered as an RV.

    Since its cheap only RV liability , $100 or so from Progressive .

    Now you can tow almost anything , max LOA 65 ft (front of tractor to end of boat).

    NO CDL (its an RV ) no problem with going up or down hills!

    8,6 wide is a restriction I would observe (no overwide permit) but a 45 ft boat would be pretty easy to have a fine interior in

    The Brit canal boats seem fine to me.

    FF
     
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  12. u4ea32
    Joined: Nov 2005
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    Location: Los Angeles

    u4ea32 Senior Member

    I continue tweaking the design to decrease beam, and now I'm down to 7 feet.
     
  13. Easy Rider
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    Location: NW Washington State USA

    Easy Rider Senior Member

    David,
    Just got to say this. As I recall your boat is 32' and no hassle trailer/load widths of well over 8' is fine in your area .. why in god's green earth would you want to reduce your beam down to 7 feet??? That's a L/B ratio of less than the Atkins rule of thumb (4-1) .. and they are from the old school gravitating to quite narrow boats.

    Easy
     
  14. u4ea32
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    u4ea32 Senior Member

    The biggest reason for narrow beam is for a smooth ride. Second biggest reason is for efficiency. Third is to eliminate the resistance hump above hulls peed. And finally, the narrower, the lighter for a given hull depth.

    Smooth ride: Note that peak vertical accelerations are what cause people to want to slow down. And vertical accelerations are correlated with the cube of the beam. So a small decrease in beam is a large decrease in peak vertical accelerations.

    Efficiency: In glass smooth water, a wide beam is good for planing hulls (effectively increasing the aspect ratio (beam/length) to increase lift over drag). In all other conditions -- displacement, semi planing, and planing in anything but glassy conditions -- narrow is more efficient. And the aspect ratio can be improved even on very narrow planing hulls by steps or "shingles" if one goes far enough back in history for one's terminology.

    Narrow hulls have so much less resistance at speeds below full on planing that the hump resistance is negligible. At about 7 to one (like on high speed naval monohull vessels) and higher length/beam ratios, the hump is gone, the resistance is almost linear up until planing begins, at which point the resistance curve gets flat (horizontal). So one is much less constrained to speeds at some "sweet spot" and able to simply go whatever speed makes sense for conditions, tidal gates, noise, whatever.

    And regarding displacement, consider this: Savitsky tests found a D/L of 20 is optimal for transport efficiency. But even lighter is still even less energy. So ultimately, its all about minimum displacement.

    I don't know where Atkins gets his rule of thumb, but it sure is not based on any performance models I have ever found, nor on results of competition.
     

  15. Fanie
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    Location: Colonial "Sick Africa"

    Fanie Fanie

    Cheeesss David, I would want my hulls as wide as possible, it adds stability. The smoothness can have a lot to do with shape. Wider boats tend to have better draft, which offers less weight vs depth, and relative less displacement per area.

    Your vertical accellerations is relative to what you've got there, but trust me, a boat has to go vertical or you're in for a surprise in the next swells :D

    Width also means space and space ia usually directly proportional to comfort. Sits pretty high in my book.
     
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