Maltese Falcon ... hit or miss?

Discussion in 'Sailboats' started by Stephen Ditmore, Jun 29, 2006.

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Maltese Falcon, hit or miss?

Poll closed Jun 29, 2007.
  1. A triumph!

    35 vote(s)
    33.7%
  2. Interesting

    58 vote(s)
    55.8%
  3. Uninteresting

    4 vote(s)
    3.8%
  4. A truly stupid concept and a complete waste of time

    7 vote(s)
    6.7%
  1. brian eiland
    Joined: Jun 2002
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    Location: St Augustine Fl, Thailand

    brian eiland Senior Member

    Speaking of Sailing Records...

    908 Miles in 24 Hours...!!

    North Atlantic - Pascal Bidégorry and the Crew of Banque Populaire V set out to break a record when they left New York a few days ago, right on the heels of Groupama 3, and that's exactly what they've done. When the two boats left dock, Groupama 3 held the 24 hour sailing record at 794 miles, and beating this was referred to as the 800 mile barrier. Last night, it became the 900 mile barrier, as both Groupama 3 and Banque Populaire V were able to soundly stomp 800 miles in their drag race across the North Atlantic. A few hours later, that too fell, as Banque Populaire V travelled an astounding 907.9 miles over a 24 hour period!*


    Before leaving, Pascal spoke with YachtPals about the 24 hour record, and the so called 800 mile barrier. The Basque skipper said "we’ll have to keep an average of over 33 kts during 24 hours. Can you imagine that? 33 kts during a complete day?" Apparently he and the crew could do more than imagine, as just a few days later, he and his crew crushed it, with an average speed of 37.79 kts, making Banque Populaire the fastest boat over 24 hours, and setting the new "barrier" at 1,000 miles.


    http://yachtpals.com/sailing-records-4192
     

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  2. Angélique
    Joined: Feb 2009
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    Location: Belgium ⇄ The Netherlands

    Angélique aka Angel (only by name)

    Just digged a bit further . . . . . .

    Formule Tag = Enza New Zealand = Royal & Sun Alliance = Team Legato = Daedalus = Doha = Spirit of Antigua

    French Wiki (Google translation) - - English Wiki - - Legato - - Daedalus, pics as Enza & Legato

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]


    Nigel Irens RACING MULTIHULLS ---> DAEDALUS at the bottom of the page..

    [​IMG] - [​IMG]
    Formule TAG - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Enza

    Nigel Irens info: lengthened to 32 m / 105 ft and a central accommodation pod was added as well as a new and larger rig.

    I guess that makes sure your memory served you well . . :D

    Cheers,
    Angel
     
  3. ancient kayaker
    Joined: Aug 2006
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    Location: Alliston, Ontario, Canada

    ancient kayaker aka Terry Haines

    I hope it will not be fission technology, the by-products are far too active and long-lived for large scale use on the ocean. It's going to be a long wait for a fusion power system that is suitable for a ship, but it will be safer and much less of a disaster in the event of a disaster. Main problem may be encapsulating the Tritium fuel since it is biologically active, but at least it has a relatively short (12 years I believe) half-life. By comparison wind technology of any kind seems much to be preferred.
     
  4. YuriB
    Joined: May 2008
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    Location: Russia

    YuriB Junior Member

    Hi Brian,
    i wouldn't be so optimistic about kites. Skysails exists already long time, but theres no rush about installation of kites on other than some few German vessels. I think there are more conns against the kites for commercial shipping. You can read them also on Peter Lynn site: http://peterlynnhimself.com/Kite_Power_For_Commercial_Shipping.php
     
    1 person likes this.
  5. Guillermo
    Joined: Mar 2005
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    Location: Pontevedra, Spain

    Guillermo Ingeniero Naval

    That's really astounding! Wow!

    And it is not only a matter of the boat physical limits but also the crew's. Keeping almost 38 knots for 24 hours looks like a lot of punisment for the crew, which could even suffer injuries due to excessive accelerations. And 1000 miles/24 h is almost a sustained 42 knots.....Of course those are not fast motor boats slamming into waves, but I'm wondering about the needing of wearing girdles and springed seats.

    Anybody has info on this?
     
  6. Guillermo
    Joined: Mar 2005
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    Location: Pontevedra, Spain

    Guillermo Ingeniero Naval

    Kites for commercial shipping are not intended at all as main propulsion, so all the first part of Peter Lynn's article is irrelevant. Regarding the second part (use as secondary helping propulsion) I would like to point out kite propulsion is conceived for its use in trade routes having a minimum amount of days of enough wind at 100+ m height (of course much more than Lynn's unsupported assumption of 1 in 25 days), there is not load capacity reduction at all, there is not need of special or extra crew to handle the kites, they are only used when away from ports or busy lanes and, last but not least, the feasibility of the system for commercial shipping has already been proved.

    Making shipowners to adopt radical concepts is not an easy task but, as Brian said, it will be only a matter of fuel price.
     
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2011
    1 person likes this.
  7. Guillermo
    Joined: Mar 2005
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    Location: Pontevedra, Spain

    Guillermo Ingeniero Naval

    Mike, have you worked out the SA/D and D/L ratios for both ships? That would be enlightening.
     
  8. MikeJohns
    Joined: Aug 2004
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    Location: Australia

    MikeJohns Senior Member

    Guillermo
    SAD is a bit of a nebulous figure for such craft.

    I'd be much more interested in the amount of sail that could be carried sensibly within say a 10 degree heel angle at a number of given wind speeds.

    Maltese falcon sailing at around 22 degrees heel before reefing in moderate winds shows a low stability for such a large vessel.
     
  9. Guillermo
    Joined: Mar 2005
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    Location: Pontevedra, Spain

    Guillermo Ingeniero Naval

    I agree about the "nebulousity", but perhaps we could consider a simple SA/D ratio being SA the area of the full amount of sails able to be hoisted by each ship excluding, perhaps, yards' wings for the clippers.

    I think comparing such SA/D ratio jointly with the D/L ratio would serve to better judge (roughly) the relative performance of MF against Clippers.

    I would not take into account stability. I do not know when clippers needed to begin reefing when going to windward and I think this is not very important for the comparison here, as they were rather conceived for beam/broad reaching. We should try to compare apples to apples.
     
  10. MikeJohns
    Joined: Aug 2004
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    MikeJohns Senior Member

    Guillermo here are the figures I have:

    Maltese Falcon
    Sail area 25791 ft2
    Displacement t 1240 tons (2200lb ton)
    Beam 42 ft
    L Deck 278.5
    LOA 289
    LWL 258.4 ft
    Cargo capacity 0 tons
    Complement 18


    Cutty Sark
    Sail area 32292 ft2
    Displacement t 2100 tons (2200lb ton) (laden)
    Beam 36 ft
    L Deck 212
    LOA 280
    LWL 213 ft
    Cargo capacity 950 tons
    Complement 30

    Note that sail area for the cargo ship is the sum of everything they could put up not just the lateral area of the sail 'space'.
     
  11. ancient kayaker
    Joined: Aug 2006
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    ancient kayaker aka Terry Haines

    I think I read near the beginning of this thread that the hull used for the MF was not a custom design, just left over from a cancelled contract or some such thing. Anyone recall that?
     
  12. Doug Lord
    Joined: May 2009
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    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    ------
    Yeah, I do. I think it was a hull from a cancelled Perini Navi project-thats about all I remember.
     
  13. BATAAN
    Joined: Apr 2010
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    BATAAN Senior Member

    Here's a screen grab with some history.
     

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  14. BATAAN
    Joined: Apr 2010
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    Location: USA

    BATAAN Senior Member


  15. Guillermo
    Joined: Mar 2005
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    Location: Pontevedra, Spain

    Guillermo Ingeniero Naval

    Thanks Mike.
    Pretty busy these days, I'll work out the numbers and post results here asap if someone doesn't do that before.
    Cheers.
     
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