Low price Catamarans

understand.... a difficult customer!!

 

As RB indicated in this thread: The skeg of this boat is a kind of sacrificial appendix and not a backbone as originally foreseen.

This would seem to be a suitable thread to discuss the implications; especially as RB seems to be 'advertising' that there is a great Tiki 38 for sale.

There must be a significant reason why the customer refused handover of the boat (and money is not likely the issue as Mr. O'Hanlon is a very successful entrepreneur). As this design modification / improvement was made by RB - what are the implications for the sea worthiness of the boat.

There were other comments / concerns on the Tiki 38 blog which is now password only regarding the steel mast step - is this also a seaworthiness issue.

Certainly there have been some positive improvements in construction materials to reduce the overall weight. However this means little if the customer feels the boat cannot safely handle offshore use.



Regards,

Ian

 

Are You sure about this? Nothing with Mr. O'Hanlon, but ...

 

All the modifications in this 38' come from customer, not from RB. The builder (and the designer - James Warram) can not be responsible for any modifications of original design in this situation.

But having seen the boat myself during the construction and prior to launching, I have no doubt that boat is well built and realiable.

There is no point to discuss keel, rudder, mast step, etc. with those armchair sailors and boat dreamers who have never seen this boat.

Besides, as it is common knowledge, original Tiki/Pahi designs do not comply to CE/RCD standards, so legally they can not be considered 'seaworthy' or 'offshore'.

 

http://www.celebrityspeakers.com.au/brspeaker_bio.asp?Speaker_Index_Text=339

 

Yikes!!

 

As I lived part of the story at the end, knew Mr. O'Hanlon, discussed about the boat and his projects, I am quite sure that the issue it is just ..."paperworks"...
About http://www.celebrityspeakers.com.au/...Index_Text=339... that is the web !! he was on this kind of business sure... but does not mean nothing. Money could be made and lost as well in the same easily way. Those are texts probably good for boat dreamers.

 

Alik,

I had not realized that you were involved in this project and privy to all the modifications to the design?

Your comment about armchair sailors is frankly insulting to the intelligence of the readers of the forum and seems to be the usual tactic used to avoid a rational discussion on simple and fundamental issues.

Whether the boat is 'legally' seaworthy is not the point. If this boat has sacrificial skegs - why? What do you see about this as making the boat well built and reliable - you are a designer what is the explanation?

What are the implications for the integrity of the rudders when offshore if e.g. a log tears away the skeg / rudder?

In these circumstances would it be safe to consider a long ocean journey on the boat?

Regards,

Ian

 

khunian

 

I am not the designer of this boat. Again, it was built using Warram's drawings and customer's requirements.

This 38' boat was built at yard where we supervise some constructions, so I have seen the progress.

If You have any doubts on skegs, there are 3 ways to check it:
a) make the calculations of rudder and skeg strength;
b) test the skeg with test load;
c) test the boat in different conditions.

For Your information (take any Rules of Classification society - say, GL or ABS), the calculations of rudder and skeg are never done for case of grounding, it is always done for rudder side force (with some safety factor) as design load. From this point, RB is correct about skeg.

 

Sorry, but I think You judge this situation with prejudice. If there is a doubt form Your side, You have to prove You are right, not RB has to prove You are wrong. Correct?

 

tiki 38

There is not room for funny allegations and dreams of problems as the Tiki 38 is there , to be inspected , checked , and tested by everybody .

She has been already inspected , checked and tested by some experienced persons .

Whatever Creed says , now that the boat has been launched and tested , means just nothing . Fly overthere , have a look , if you are interested . Less words and more facts .

From a technical point of view a sacrificial keel is very common . Examples : our RB 34 / 38 / 50 / HK 40 and the new cat in construction , P 1500

The skeg of the rudder of the Tiki 38 is very heavily laminated and really strong . In his post Creed referred to another point anyway , and KhunIan misunderstood .

He referred to the bottom of the rudder , where we had a pin that he asked to remove and we removed it .


He can't be more then ok , and so it is : ok .



RB

 

Khunian

The scenario you are describing here could happen to any yacht, we all accept the risk when we sail our little ship out to sea and do our best to minimise the possibility.

My own personal nightmare would be to hit a submerged container at speed. I would sail the Tiki offshore with no qualms, the Tiki also has a certain amount of redundancy, ok if the skeg is torn off you still have 2 hinges that should survive the shock loading. Due to the width of the hull you will probably have another perfectly serviceable rudder. This is all conjecture and a hypothetical question. I have almost half a million miles in aircraft carriers and smaller ships and a little over 5 thousand in yachts under my belt, I also supervised a great deal of the build and yes I would have no hesitation in engaging in a properly planned and provisioned ocean voyage on Ahmad bin Majid.

I hope you aren't insulted by this question but have you ever tried rudderless sailing or jury rigging, it is an eventuallity that all should consider and practise, it's called seamanship. I stand 4square behind ***** on the seaworthiness and integrity of this vessel and all of the points you raise.

Regards

Chris

 

Still I don't see those people, like Fullcave and khun"Ian", writing their name, profession, contacs, address, etc... Always anonymous posters and that isn't right and fair in any forum.

 

Chris, You right. I have sailed on catamaran with one rudder before, the other one was broken due to hinge failure. Cat can be perfectly controlled, though a bit difficult to tack.