Looking for cabin re-design advice

Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by Homesteady, Sep 25, 2014.

  1. Homesteady
    Joined: Sep 2014
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    Location: Bellingham, WA

    Homesteady greenhorn

    True. 0.0 gph gasoline consumption. About 1 gph diesel. Cruises at about 7 knots.

    I'm searching the library for books on boatbuilding for tips and visuals on framing, dimensions, how-tos and the like. Also ordered the Glen-L dory cabin designs. They are somewhat cryptic but offer some insight on construction. I'm going to try modelling the cabin on a modified version of their dory cabin B.

    Scouring the web for basic plans/visual representations of cabin wall and roof framing is pretty fruitless. Many of the builders blogs and forums show a boat with a cuddy, then some shots of plywood main cabin mock-ups, then next slide BAM! there's a cabin. No mention of framing technique, type of wood being used, how the roof camber was achieved, how the sawn roof beams were made. It just seems like it's unstated that building a main cabin is the easiest part of the job and a no-brainer. Well, for someone just starting out it's not that crystal clear.

    I guess there are many ways to skin this cat. Each vessel being a bit different. Can anyone recommend a good book or website that actually shows how to frame-up a main cabin and sheath it in 1/4" ply?

    Thanks for everyone's replies. I'll post some pics of my sketches soon. Cheers
     
  2. PAR
    Joined: Nov 2003
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    Location: Eustis, FL

    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    Considering your needs, desires and skill sets, you'd be best advised to have a pro sketch up some plans for you, with a solid set of scantlings you can employ to advantage. Something like this wouldn't cost much as is a common thing for a designer or NA to perform. The end result will be more than strong enough, will save materials, probably labor too and it'll not only look good, but will function the way you want as well.
     
  3. LP
    Joined: Jul 2005
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    Location: 26 36.9 N, 82 07.3 W

    LP Flying Boatman

    Ok. I'm going to be a smart A here so be forwarned. 7 kts? Isn't that a planing hull? Isn't 7 kts in a planning hull a little inefficient? I suppose fuel consumption is still lower than full on plane. Maybe the bow down trim is intentional. Perhaps the previous owner wanted to raise the transom clear of the water so it could operate in displacement mode. :p

    So sorry. To make it up, here is some cabin details from one of the Svenson plans. These are OLD plans plans, but they might give you some insight into your cabin construction. Looks like a fun not so little project. Hopefully, you won't ding me rep points. :eek:

    CabinFraming.jpg

    This photo was taken from here.

    http://www.svensons.com/boat/?p=CabinCruisers/flight

    So you can see that it is a very old design.
     
  4. Homesteady
    Joined: Sep 2014
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    Homesteady greenhorn

    I'm going to be a smart A here so be forwarned. 7 kts? Isn't that a planing hull? Isn't 7 kts in a planning hull a little inefficient?

    Smart A, indeed. Should I upgrade to twin 350s instead? Sounds way more efficient! At least my remains will get there real fast!

    The boat is meant for enjoying being on the water, no hurry. Trim tabs help, too

    Thanks for the link
     
  5. PAR
    Joined: Nov 2003
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    Location: Eustis, FL

    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    Damn LP, if you think that is wise *** stuff, I'm pretty much screwed. Cabins can be as simple or as hard to make as you like. Mostly you should think light enough to get the job done, as this boat is overburdened as it is now. Foam core is an option, though lots of "goo factor" involved. 1/8" or 1/4" plywood over light frames an option as would be 1/8" or 1/4" plywood over foam or honeycomb. It's really easy to over engineer something like this or over build it, just offering what you have, a big heavy box o the front of your boat. Maybe just a light aluminum tubing frame with vinyl or canvas curtains and a windscreen. You can fold it down when trailering, it will not weigh much and it would be in keeping with the boats style.
     
  6. LP
    Joined: Jul 2005
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    Location: 26 36.9 N, 82 07.3 W

    LP Flying Boatman

    Damn, PAR. Sounds like a hit nerve. :p My wise A remark was about the boat being intentionally trimmed by the bow to make it a displacement cruiser by lifting the stern out of the water. i.e. intentionally planned to be burdened by the bow. That's all. Yup, lighter is definitely better. I can't believe the guy took it offshore in that condition. I Just re-read the drawing I posted. I didn't realize they were putting a 1/4" mahogany over the plywood....on both sides!. That's 1" of wood WITHOUT the framing. Jeez. Slap my hiney and call me names. :eek::eek::eek:

    Homesteady, I understand slow. I'm a sailor first and a putt- putt guy second. My jokes and humor typically fall flat don't bear me any ill will. ;) With such grand scenery up there I would think that a few more windows could benefit your craft if interior accommodations warranted.
     
  7. boatbuilder41
    Joined: Feb 2013
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    boatbuilder41 Senior Member

    ,he,k out this boat in my personal gallery. The yellow boat. Its only 28 ft. and the cabin is real light. I can give you some pointers on framing it up.... There is still a lot of issues to calculate into any build .
     
  8. JosephT
    Joined: Jun 2009
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    Location: Roaring Forties

    JosephT Senior Member

    I worked on a 30ft Stamas a couple of years ago. It was re-engined with twin Steyr 236 diesel engines. Light, powerful, efficient and reliable.

    Depending on how much engine bay space you have & fuel capacity, you may be able to re-engine that boat. Then again, you may be better off selling it and putting your money on a newer model with the specs you want.

    Ref: http://www.steyr-motors.com/marine-diesel-engines/2-4-and-6-cylinder/marine-diesel-engine-mo-6-cylinder/
     
  9. Homesteady
    Joined: Sep 2014
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    Location: Bellingham, WA

    Homesteady greenhorn

    That's a great looking boat (and cabin). I also like the way you built-up the bulwarks in the bow. Gives it a nice look.

    Yes, if you're willing to share I'd like to see any pointers you have on construction. What materials did you use? Framing or just plywood?

    Thanks
     
  10. sdowney717
    Joined: Nov 2010
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    Location: Newport News VA

    sdowney717 Senior Member

    I agree with the roof construction being too heavy.
    Likely should make a wooded arch from sawn frames of a light weight wood like AYC or even white pine and lay down thin 3/8 type of plywood, glued with a construction adhesive and screwed on.
    I would overcoat with something that is resilient and waterproof that wont crack. Maybe a rubber paint, coating with Black PL polyurethane roof coat, etc...something that will move and then wont crack and leak in the rain.
     
  11. kapnD
    Joined: Jan 2003
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    Location: hawaii, usa

    kapnD Senior Member

    I'm in favor of the aluminum frame and canvas solution, you could get the entire structure down to less than 100lb. In your location, you probably need at least one windshield panel that is rigid enough to run a wiper on, but the rest of the windows can be vinyl.
     
  12. Homesteady
    Joined: Sep 2014
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    Homesteady greenhorn

    Refreshing the discussion

    Trying to re-boot this topic. See images for finished paint job. Adding some new colors to the mix did do a lot to smooth out her lines and disguise the doghouse cabin. Thanks for the tips!

    I'm still toying with the idea of rebuilding/re-working the cabin on this boat but I'm also concerned with the overall trim. As you can see in some of the photos she sits in the water a bit bow-down. This may be from the re-power to diesel and engine weight/placement which I'm not going to mess with in this lifetime (I hope!). I'm wondering if anyone has advice on the easily addressable issues around center of gravity, weight distribution and trim.

    The engine is located about midships, the batteries forward of engine, 100gal fuel tank is just forward of the stern, gear is mostly stored in the bow area other than basic stuff and seating in the wheelhouse pretty much around or just forward of the engine box. I'm thinking of relocating the two batteries astern of the engine to help with the bow-down tendency of the boat. Any other recommendations?

    Also, what are the risks of running at this trim-state? Should I be trying to level out the boat more? Thanks for any offering of advice. Cheers
     

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  13. Jammer Six

    Jammer Six Previous Member

    My suggestion is to carefully lift the docking lines straight up, suspend them so they don't move, drive a new boat under them, and re-install them.
     
  14. FMS
    Joined: Jul 2011
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    Location: united states

    FMS Senior Member

    You can get an idea of the effect of moving batteries aft by running with a few passengers first in the cabin and then on the aft cockpit and comparing performance. Human weight is the easiest to shift.

    You can also use water tanks to roughly approximate some weight changes.

    How much total weight in gear do you carry near the bow?
     

  15. PAR
    Joined: Nov 2003
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    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    Unhooking the batteries and placing them on the deck, aft of the engine box is simple enough and will tell you how much it affects trim. As usual Jammer's advise isn't worth paying any attention to. This is his specialty.

    The images aren't clear enough to tell her actual trim state, but other than eating more fuel, you'll likely be fine.
     
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