Llyods vs BS 1088

Discussion in 'Sailboats' started by Gaffers, Nov 12, 2009.

  1. Gaffers
    Joined: Nov 2009
    Posts: 7
    Likes: 1, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 19
    Location: Farnborough

    Gaffers Junior Member

    Hi guys,

    Newbie here so go easy please!

    I have built my first boat, an 11ft dinghy, from plywood that met the BS1088 standard.

    I am looking to my next project which will be a nice big 22 footer but I am looking at plywood prices. The Llyods registered/approved stuff is quite expensive to put it mildly.

    Now my question is this. If I build a boat out of plywood made with BS1088 standard wood will I have problems insuring it as it is not made with Llyods approved plywood?

    Thanks in advance,

    Gaffers
     
    1 person likes this.
  2. apex1

    apex1 Guest

    Sure not.

    to make it short.
     
  3. PAR
    Joined: Nov 2003
    Posts: 19,133
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    Location: Eustis, FL

    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    Technically, Lloyds is no longer offering the BS-1088 certification standard. Is has been an industry standard for long enough to serve itself.

    In short, you'll see plywood panels stamped with a BS-1088 label or mark, but Lloyd's has nothing to do with it and it's a voluntary standard with no "plywood" police to reinforce intentional miss-labeled product. I've seen the BS-1088 mark on pieces of plywood that wouldn't rate being used for shelving. Most of this stuff is comming out of China and "western rim" countries.

    This said, several manufactures are well known for building to this standard, Joubert Plywood being one, and you can get this quality of plywood in spite of Lloyd's Register backing out of the standard. They know they have the good stuff and charge for it (that's how I found my wife).

    The bottom line is you get what you pay for. Some times you can get "lucky" with a few pieces of different grade plywood, but for the most part the differences among the panels is internal. Close visual inspection can sort out a high percentage of the bad ones, but you still can get "caught" with a bum sheet.

    In the end, you're best off using real quality plywood on the planking and decking, as it's the stuff that will keep your socks dry. If you'd like to save some money then use lesser grades on the bulkheads and furniture, such as BS-6566 or exterior construction grade.
     
  4. apex1

    apex1 Guest

    Farnborough I think is in GB PAR ?
     
  5. Steve W
    Joined: Jul 2004
    Posts: 1,824
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    Location: Duluth, Minnesota

    Steve W Senior Member

    We use a lot of BS1088 meranti plywood and have been very pleased with the consistent good quality pretty much regardless of where it comes from.We just burned through about 60 sheets of mixed thicknesses and not a void anywhere.Unlike Par i dont think ive ever had a bad panel with the BS1088 stamp.About the only country i know of that cant make a decent sheet of plywood is the US,at least we dont pretend and label them as BS1088.
    Steve.
     
  6. PAR
    Joined: Nov 2003
    Posts: 19,133
    Likes: 489, Points: 93, Legacy Rep: 3967
    Location: Eustis, FL

    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    A couple of the major US suppliers got a few batches of BS 1088 marked plywood, but it clearly wasn't when a skilled eye went through the stacks. Most are aware of it now and have changed vendors (all where western rim countries) or importers. When I personally purchase plywood, I'll go through each sheet, but when buying a large quantity with a coop, I can't be there all the time and have to trust suppliers.

    The USA doesn't have a regularity arrangement for plywood or lumber product quality control. We have a voluntary agreement with the producers in this country and a grading system to match, but again it's voluntary only. I have seen some exceptional 1-95 sheets come out of the US plants and I've had some custom stuff done, which also was exceptional. Of course you have to pay for it. On the other hand, the extreme vast majority of plywood needs in this country are warped crap that will sheath a chicken house in the near future, so it's quality doesn't need to be very good. With such a small market (marine grade plywood) and a market driven, voluntary grading system, it's fairly easy to see why the US doesn't produce much good looking stuff. In the same vain, how much OSB did Joubert import into this country last year compared to BS 1088? How much you want to bet the BS 1088 far out sold the OSB? It's what the market will bear folks, what the market will bear . . .
     

  7. Steve W
    Joined: Jul 2004
    Posts: 1,824
    Likes: 63, Points: 48, Legacy Rep: 608
    Location: Duluth, Minnesota

    Steve W Senior Member

    I cant inspect any of the marine plywood that i buy beforehand as i have to order it all in so i have to trust the suppliers and am rarely dissapointed, except with the teak plywood and teak and holly cabin sole where im always disgusted with the quality,but then its not to BS1088.Most of the ply we use is for structural purposes so we use Ocume if weight is a concern or Meranti either of which i find to be consistently good. Im always seeing people complain about the high price of marine ply but i find that BS1088 meranti is downright cheap and excellent quality,strong and moderately rot resistance(equal to Doug fir and better than ocume)
    Nearly 30 years ago we had a whole semitrailer load of 3 or 4 mm plywood custom made to our specs (of which we were VERY specific) by a large mill in the pacific NW,when it arrived and we inspected it on the truck we had to reject the whole batch as it was absolute crap,full of voids, they completly ignored our specs,to their credit they did replace it.I never touched US stuff for years but then about 5 years ago we got sucked in again,the stuff came and had marine stamped in small letters on the end but again,garbage.Never again,if its not BS1088 its not going on anything i build(except the T&H,no choice there)
    Steve.
     
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