Large sharpie for the Adriatic

Discussion in 'Sailboats' started by Igor, Jul 1, 2022.

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  1. mirkosebastian
    Joined: Feb 2012
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    Location: Hamburg

    mirkosebastian Junior Member

    PET foam core: less internal structure, thermo forming, buoancy, insulation, low cost & footprint, no rot, resale value: anyone used it?
     
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  2. mirkosebastian
    Joined: Feb 2012
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    mirkosebastian Junior Member

    Would never put a small, light wooden boat on a mooring in the Med.. Boats will bump into it, they sail at anchor out of tune with other boats, you can't put a cover.
    When I left mine in a very protected place for a few days, friendly locals warned me.
    Ply boats even if sheathed are delicate. Good old ply is resisting water, repaired my Tiki with ply I found on the beach, but haven't seen any ply at the beach lately..
     
  3. Igor
    Joined: Jul 2022
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    Igor Junior Member

    Amazing boats, some of those I have seen on Pinterest but have not been able to find the designer. The Musketeer looks especially intersting, lot of space, inteligent outboard well solution, modern hull and simple unstayed rig to boot. I wonder how this boat is not more popular. The closest to this is Presto 30, production boat which sells for 145000$.
     
  4. Igor
    Joined: Jul 2022
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    Igor Junior Member

    There are not other boats on the mooorings in my area, the things I would hate to do is to leave the boat to fresh westerly and 8ft waves with very short period. Even worse would be the nights when the Bora howls well over 100 knots per hour, I would not sleep well.
     
    Last edited: Sep 3, 2022
  5. Igor
    Joined: Jul 2022
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    Igor Junior Member

    To me they look like skiffs disguised as bateaus and skipjacks to look more "ship-like".
    Good boats for taking your kids out on the lake for a pirate-themed birthday, with Jolly Roger and all. Kids would love it for sure.
     
  6. Milehog
    Joined: Aug 2006
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    Milehog Clever Quip

    How many good small boats have a full-length keel that is actually deeper at the bow than the stern? I'll wait...

    Listen carefully, I built a Stevenson Projects boat; it was the crappiest boat shaped object you can imagine. It was not a competent vessel, not even close.
    They also sell boat trailer plans which, by the way, aren't DOT approved! Do you see the pattern?

    As far as being good for taking your kids out for a day? For the same effort and expense, you can build a competent boat.


    [​IMG] [​IMG]


    [​IMG]
     
  7. sharpii2
    Joined: May 2004
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    Location: Michigan, USA

    sharpii2 Senior Member

    I agree. But this is not what I am proposing.

    What I'm proposing is a boat that self-rights, but needs to be bailed out.

    There is a difference.

    Now, I would never want to sail a vessel, like the one I propose, across an ocean. Nor would I want to sail it across a sea. But, for a long day sail, in good weather, I would not have a problem.

    I think it would be safer than a decked over boat, with a cabin, but that is unable to self-right from a capsize.
     
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  8. tane
    Joined: Apr 2015
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    tane Senior Member

    this is, what the Croatian coast can dish out...why have a boat there, that you have to bail, when you can have one that has AVS >120° & a downflooding angle >120°? an AVS > 90° does not preclude a high DFA.
     
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  9. tane
    Joined: Apr 2015
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    tane Senior Member

    [​IMG]
    ...little reminder...a Bora with force 6 can come up quite quickly, even in the summer months
     
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  10. tane
    Joined: Apr 2015
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    tane Senior Member

    more on AVS & STIX:
    https://ircrating.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/stix-avs-faq.pdf
    I cannot quickly find something on the minimum DFA for cat. C, but wonder what use an AVS > than DFA would be.
    "self righting" but having-to-be-bailed sounds about right for our "Neusiedlersee" (Lake "Neusiedl") here in Austria, with a maximum depth of 1,5m
     
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  11. sharpii2
    Joined: May 2004
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    sharpii2 Senior Member

    Here is a design that is available. It is mash up of a sharpie and a dory. At least that's what its designer says. But really the only dory influence I see is the immersed stem post and maybe the tiny transom. But I think it meets most if not all of Igor's SOR. If the enclosed cabin is not wanted, a shorter cabin could be built that is just big enough to enclose a head.

    See attachment.


    FancyFsharpey.png
     
  12. tane
    Joined: Apr 2015
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    Location: austria

    tane Senior Member

  13. tane
    Joined: Apr 2015
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    Location: austria

    tane Senior Member

    idle thoughts while looking at the "bluewater" boats in my - 1970!! - edition of Hiscocks "Voyaging under sail".
    These designs (Kochab, Waltzing Mathilda, Rena, Omoo,..) sure look very pleasing to my eye, very! Elegant, "flowing" lines, overhangs front & back. long keels (o so seaworthy...), but I am convinced we were better served, in all aspects, by our fin-&-skeg sloop of 1982 vintage (plan: Gilles Vaton)-2rtw-, & our 40' fractional fin && spade sloop (plan: Rob Humphreys)-.1/3 rtw:
    speed
    weatherliness
    motion
    comfort
    ease-of-handling
    ...
    & I am pretty sure the same applies when comparing the "traditional" & the modern designs in this thread. Elegant as some of the "old" designs may be, one is better served in all aspects by the modern designs
     
  14. Igor
    Joined: Jul 2022
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    Igor Junior Member

    Looks like a self steering device, one that steers where you do not want it to, at the worst possible moment.
    I have read about that one, it is in the same venue as sharpie 600, altough the latter is self righting as the designer claims.
    It can be seen here that careful planing is the mother of seaworthiness, here we can see that when the **** hits the fan it is too late no matter the boat, some of these yachts have twin diesels counting thousands horsepower.
    You do not want to be stuck on the lee shore in Mediteranean gale, or in any gale. On the Adriatic you must never anchor overnight in bays open to NE where the Bora can slam you against the coast or in channels where the westerly has got a lot of throw to build big waves.

    One more thing i see repeatedly are roller furling genoas that unfurl when they should not. Most likely operator error but at 90+ knots gusting wind anything gives.
     

  15. tane
    Joined: Apr 2015
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    tane Senior Member

    @Bora: luckily the worst that we saw of it was a rough-ish Kvarner crossing in, say, 30kn, but working at a charter base in Marmaris, Turkey, I had a collegue that had previously been working at a base in Tucepi, now Croatia, & he told of the full size motorbike, standing on it's stand, being slowly pushed along by 100kn or so of Bora.
    Of course in conditions like these no boat will make way to weather, no matter AVS & DFA or engine size, but, first, it does not always blow like that, & at 35 kns the "angles" will make a difference, & second, as thunderstorms very often blow over in quite short a time they will make a difference: at sea under bare poles, gives a little sea room & at anchor, given that you have a sufficiently well set one & nobody drags into you, the "angles" will make the difference between being swamped & getting away fairly unscathed. As one saw in the video: there were boats that survived at anchor.
    Imho "floodable" boats with an AVS of <90°, Sharpies or others, on your coast will sensibly be limited to a "circle of operations" of max. 2nm from a safe haven/marina.
    On our trip down your coast I do not remember drawing advantage of our draft of 70cm, btw.
    very nice looking [​IMG] very nice. (Somehow I have this "flash" of a desktop (not the PC desktop;)) - model with no "underbody" though...I wonder how the sailing abilities would compare to the Birvidic)
     
    Last edited: Sep 5, 2022
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