K800

Discussion in 'Sailboats' started by Schoonner, Dec 19, 2011.

  1. Schoonner
    Joined: Nov 2011
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    Schoonner Senior Member

    Does anyone know how to translate from RUssian? I'm trying to guess.

    Humm... I just thought of something. I don't know the first thing about designing boats, but maybe the thick plywood would either make it so that you don't need so much ballast, or be a mistake and I'm reading the plans wrong.
     
  2. Perm Stress
    Joined: Sep 2009
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    Perm Stress Senior Member

    If amount of text is not big, I am fluent at it.
    If a text is big, it would be work...
     
  3. Schoonner
    Joined: Nov 2011
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    Schoonner Senior Member

    Okay, I finally figured out what I'm doing wrong. Good thing since I'm building a model and wasting wood if it is all wrong. I figured out that the frames are not equidistant. some are 500mm, some 800mm, some 1000mm apart. I thought that they would all be the same distance. Oh well live and learn right?
     
  4. Schoonner
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    Schoonner Senior Member

    Oh, and bigger is way better, unless you want thousandths of millimeters to matter much. I think I'll be doing good with half a mm tolerances.
     
  5. Schoonner
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    Schoonner Senior Member

    I decided that sheets of paper glued together should simulate plywood pretty well on small scale, be easier and faster to work with than other types of wood which would be too thick to simulate plywood anyways. So, I started the bow early this morning about 5 AM

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    I got tired of trying to figure out how to make it perfectly strait and decided that no matter what I did, it was not going to come out perfect and that since it is flexible I can straighten it out when I add the final layed up pieces of paper 'plywood' to the hull.

    I am surprised how strong this actually is once the wooden frames are all together! Aside from actually stepping on it, I think it would stand up to a lot with just one little layer of thin paper. Once I get the two ply card stock on it and bondo the heck out of it, I probably will be able to actually stand on it! LOL!

    I already straightened the front with a thin piece of paper.
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    I can still cut into the paper easily since it is just an ad from comcast about some business class junk. Finally, a good use for junk mail! ROFL!

    EDIT:: this is my first model from scratch.
     
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  6. Schoonner
    Joined: Nov 2011
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    Location: Washington State USA

    Schoonner Senior Member

    This is how we play 'connect the dots'. Don't forget to draw the lines all the way across the page because that's where the 1mm slots go for both sides after we cut it out.
    (Everything is staying metric cause it's a royal pain to convert everything over.)
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    I use GIMP (Gnu Image Manipulation Program) and have exported the frames from the cad program that comes standard with Ubuntu. (Linux computer operating system made in Africa) I crop and resize the pictures so that they overlap pixel for pixel in layers and I can use the cursor placement, and just move the decimal point to convert to millimeters so that all is scale.

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    Then I fold the paper along the center line and cut it out making it as close to symmetrical as I can at this scale. (tiny, about 16 or 20 inches LOD if I remember right)

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    Then I use Cyano Acrylate (Super glue) to glue it to card stock. I use medium weight so that it soaks in just a little, but bonds to paper almost instantly. (I can work with it really fast compared to other glues)
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    Then it all is glued to 1mm x 3mm hobby planks. I think they are basswood. Anyways, I messed up the longitudinal placement and have to redo loft 'D' so I'm taking a short break. Maybe start again tomorrow.

    EDIT:: somehow I just kept going...
     
  7. Schoonner
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    Schoonner Senior Member

    I guess that if I hollowed out the middle it would be lighter, but I want this thing to be a tank when I'm done so it will last forever.
     
  8. Schoonner
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    Schoonner Senior Member

    I guess the drawings are scale!?! I don't know what I was doing wrong, but now they line up perfectly. Maybe it was something I was doing wrong in blender?
     
  9. Schoonner
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    Schoonner Senior Member

    I messed up with the length between the major frames again so I took it all apart. I basically had to cut the paper away from the wood because the glue works so well. :D
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    I had to use a form of modeling fiberglass to make the wood pieces that get bent stay in place strongly enough. All it is, is rough and tough toilet paper layd up over the piece to hold it all the way around. The bottom of the prow area is covered with it. It becomes clear just like real fiberglass even after the glue sets so it is hard to see. The hull is upside down, so it is at the top of the prow in the picture. ( I think it is called the prow anyways....) Since it is squared off, maybe it is called something different?

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  10. Schoonner
    Joined: Nov 2011
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    Schoonner Senior Member

    I messed up because I missed a big glob of glue and tissue. The wood is warped over that spot. It is not good, but I don't have enough wood to cut the piece out. So, I decided to focus on not being OCD and just made the other side curve that way too. I will probably 'bondo' the hull anyways, but I bought light bondo so I could make it thin on a different model, and layer it better. We will have to see what it is like when it is done. I don't know that it will cause too much hull drag, and heck it's not a big enough boat to really displace much water anyhow. :D

    I was amazed to find bondo that was in a tube without needing a hardener, and it was inexpensive for my purposes, so I grabbed it.

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    It looks like close enough to me, and the wood is barely half a mm off. It just looks worse than it is because frame, 'D' squeezes the three center pieces together making more of an optical illusion than anything.

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    Overall, I'm pretty happy with it[​IMG]

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  11. Schoonner
    Joined: Nov 2011
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    Schoonner Senior Member

    I left out a frame by accident. so, I cut the wood to make a place for a piece to be fitted from outside. i shouldn't have because it will be weaker there now. Oh well shoulda thought it through a little better...

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    it fits!

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    now to notch the new frame...

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    That was easy... It is stiffer there too... but the glue will loosen over time...

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  12. Schoonner
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    Schoonner Senior Member

    I'm really starting to admire this design!!!:cool: It's really really sturdy. I imagine that it would be a little less sturdy if the frames were hollow, but once it was stitched and glassed it would probably not matter a whole lot. Now I see why the plywood is 8mm and not 6mm, it is over-engineered a little, but I like it even more after building the model.

    Makes me wish I had the means to build the real thing. :rolleyes:

    I do want different sails and I wish I knew how to design a wing like the catamarans in the America's Cup World Series have. Don't they have less heeling force and drag than a regular sail, but you have to know how to get the camber right or something... <Shrug> not too sure about all this stuff yet...
     
  13. Schoonner
    Joined: Nov 2011
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    Schoonner Senior Member

    I cut one of the slots in the frame a little too deep and just noticed that there was no glue on it. I needed the wood to bend outward, and was using the knife to pry it over after swamping the joint with glue hoping it will hold. I got tired of holding it while it dried, so I just stuck the tip of the knife into the next piece of wood at the perfect spot so the frame would be in the right place. You have to account for the knife and wood spring back before you leave it like that though. =0)

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    I think it's time to take a long break and maybe do something boring, like sleep. LOL I started at 5 AM so I should probably quit before it is 5 AM again. LOL!!!

    There's what she looks like in only 24 hours. *YAWN*

    [​IMG]
     
  14. Schoonner
    Joined: Nov 2011
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    Schoonner Senior Member

    I'm very happy today. I got up and sanded down the bow and the prow. Yeah, I had to take a lot off to make it within about 1/4 millimeter from perfect, but at least I made her slightly large and stood the wood in end so that it could be sanded a lot without structural problems. It does not look like much, but I think that when I get it done it will be a real beauty of a model because I had 3 mm to sand on, and it didn't take but a light sanding to eat up the 1mm wide sanding surface with 80 grit so it went really fast except my continual shoving the hull through holes in card stock to see if it fit now... How about now... over and over again. LOL!

    I would recommend doing it this way!!

    Next, I will finish the rest of the hull structure. I'm making the top of the cabin so that it will slide back and pop off. That way I can get to the servos and batteries and radio when I am done. It will have a rather large capacity for other stuff too if I decide that I want to gear the servos. I think I will be able to get 8 to 10 servos in there, but their weight might become a problem. I will just float test it for that when I get the clear aquarium I want. I will use transparencies and draw lines on it so I can look across the tank past the lines and see the waterline clearly as well as how she sits in the water.

    I'm a little worried about how to attach the keel, but I think I have a really good idea. LOL!

    EDIT:: How will I put a motor and prop on it? I need a toy outboard. One of the ones you wind up and play with in the bath tub should have gears and everything I need. I'm off to the store today since I got paid today. I have to get more glue, and I will probably browse the toy section to see what I find. =0)
     

  15. Schoonner
    Joined: Nov 2011
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    Schoonner Senior Member

    This is a 1 ft model. Roughly at 1:240 scale, if I'm saying that right. idk, I just kinda figured out the math for myself, but the full scale plans are for the boat shows 2416mm beam, and my model's beam is 10mm. 2416 divided by 240 = 10.066666667 Or something like that I think... I stopped after a few 6's.

    That means that I was altogether wrong with her dimensions length wise. I can fix that, but it is more work than it is fun. =0( I think I will leave it how it is and make another one when I can get to a real hobby shop with decent wood to see if it really makes that much difference. I don't think it will at all because on the full size boat it would be a difference of 8mm. That's 90% accurate on a 12 inch boat so I think I'm okay with 90%.

    The next model will be 100% accurate. This is my first scratch built model after all, and I didn't realize the complexity of the whole thing.
     
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