Just have to ask...About sailboat cabin height.

Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by SoNew, Dec 1, 2012.

  1. tom28571
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    tom28571 Senior Member

    Steve,

    I raced a S2 Grand Slam 7.9 against a Lindenberg 26 quite a lot and can say that it is a good boat. Neither of these could be called beautiful but the 7.9 is a much better looking boat and a highly functional design. I never had an issue with the lack of headroom but we never made long cruises or lived on it for more than a few days. When under way, especially at sea, I find that crouching a bit is normal moving through the boat and the big comfortable cockpit was great at anchor or the dock. I also had a Catalina 22 and a Catalina 25, both with pop tops. The pop top made these boats much more usable and comfortable. This is a far better solution than an ungainly dog house or overly high topsides for me. The pop top has other advantages over full headroom. When at anchor and when sleeping they are much cooler in hot climates. We would always have raft up mates to come aboard our boats rather than have to sit below in their hot, stuffy cabin, even if they did have full headroom.

    There is one Lindenberg 26 sailing in our local races. I think the boom has been lowered as the visual aspect is better than the others I've seen. A really high boom does not help the looks of the L 26.

    There is a 30 something boat with considerable beam under construction locally that has only 4' headroom and a big CB trunk down the middle. Worse of all worlds in my opinion.
     
  2. daiquiri
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    daiquiri Engineering and Design

    Tom, (or whoever feels like doing it) for us who are not native english speakers - could you please explain the difference between the terms:
    - doghouse
    - coachroof
    - pop top?
    Please excuse my ignorance. :)
     
  3. TeddyDiver
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    TeddyDiver Gollywobbler

    Doghouse, a raised companionway hatch possibly with a couple of dead eyes on the sides. Gives adequate head room in a boat othervice too low to stand straight. Some older pilot cutters with flush decks had it.

    Coachroof is a bit raised deck like you cant say it has barely anything called cabin sides..
    Thats how I understand them...
     
  4. michael pierzga
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    michael pierzga Senior Member

    Attached Files:

  5. daiquiri
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    daiquiri Engineering and Design

    This dictionary defines the doghouse as a part of the coachroof with standing room: http://oxforddictionaries.com/definition/english/doghouse

    So, in your opinion, is this correct:
    Coachroof - enclosed structure raised from the deck, which purpose is to increase the interior cabin height, but not sufficiently to allow a person to stand upright;
    Doghouse - as above, but with height sufficient for a person to stand upright;
    ?

    And what about pop top?
     
  6. Steve W
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    Steve W Senior Member

    A doghouse is what we now call a hard dodger, basically covering the companionway hatch and forward part of the cockpit, just like a folding dodger. A coachroof is the cabintop and a poptop is a large section of the cabintop which lifts up enough to give you headroom at anchor while retaining a lower profile with it down while sailing.
     
  7. daiquiri
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    daiquiri Engineering and Design

    Damn... :eek: Any explanatory pics would be really welcome. :)

    Edit:
    The dictionary says something like this:

    Coachroof.jpg ?

    Which again is different from what Steve W says... :(
    Anyone has a pic of a pop top?
     
  8. michael pierzga
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    michael pierzga Senior Member

    And just to confuse the issue.....Marketing people and brokers prefer to eliminate the Dog in Doghouse. Don't want boats called dogs. and have remaned it a......... the BEAUTIFUL DECKHOUSE SALOON WITH A LUXURIUOS WINE FILLED INTERIOR, SLEEPS 8 IN FOUR CABINS...

    A suppose you could design a boat with a coachroof ,deckhouse saloon and a poptop doghouse .......
     

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  9. tom28571
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    tom28571 Senior Member

    Any attempted definition of these terms runs into opinion and local usage. They all do fit under the term superstructure, which seems to universally accepted. Dog house is usually a small elevated structure on top of the larger house, intended to give either headroom or an exterior view for navigation or whatever. The Cal 2-27 would be a good example.

    A poptop is a portion of the house that usually raises up evenly but sometimes only the aft end raises. Both can be fitted with a weatherproof skirt or left open. Once in the Florida Keys, we left the Cat 22 poptop up and enclosed for several days while we motored about the underwater Pennycamp State Park.

    House, deckhouse, cabin, pilothouse, doghouse, coachroof and poptop. All part of the superstructure on some boat.
     
  10. PAR
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    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    I'm not sure which I like better. I have a Lindenberg 26 and it's a pretty good sailor. The 7.9 has a more conservative look about her, which some might find appealing. Both look better in 3D, than in 2D profile.
     
  11. tom28571
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    tom28571 Senior Member

    They are both good boats with equal PHRF ratings Paul, but there are so many significant differences that making a choice for a given use should be simple. Several things make the 7.9 a trailerable boat. Daggerboard, kick up rudder and deck stepped mast mean that launching and retreiving is not such a big deal. Fixed ballast keel makes the L26 stiffer so it can carry on after the 7.9 has needed to change headsails or reef. The 7.9 has a relatively much larger main and smaller jib. I know the 7.9 can sail fairly well under double reefed main and no jib and will not hesitate to tack in 35 kts in this condition. I loved the high crown of the deck aft which made sitting up there when heeled comfortable. No better small combination racing and cruising boat if you have shallow water at your dock, which I do. Very comfortable down below but a workable galley is not part of this boat. I built a slide out galley over the port quarterberth which worked well. That boat is now in Florida.
     
  12. Steve W
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    Steve W Senior Member

    what you have there is what is commonly reffered to as a pilothouse design, of course in NZ when we were done racing we would sit and have a beer in the saloon whereas here in the US its the salon, after 30 yrs i still cant come to terms with that one,bunch of pooftahs. Ive noticed a lot of folk reffering to everything above the sheerline as the topsided where ive always considered the area of hull between the waterline and sheerline as the topsides.
     
  13. yipster
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    yipster designer

    [​IMG] left: one of the first pics that popped up in google on "poptop sailboat cabin"
    Checked 22 25 250 and other poptops and found a variety in brand, size, systems, weight and more.
    Catalina's with trailer may go for as low as 2k. Ian Ferrier's F22 is gettin one too.
    was thinking of the new almost flush vw campertop but missed the nautic ones
    thanks for the eye opener Tom
     
  14. Frosty

    Frosty Previous Member

    I prefer the one on the left.


    I don't fancy yours much.
     

  15. tom28571
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    tom28571 Senior Member

    The Catalina 22 is the most numerous small cruising sailboat on the planet and always available for sale or easy to sell. In England I think they are called Jaguars. Not wonderful perhaps, but we loved ours for its virtues and ignored any drawbacks as it introduced us to the many advantages of a trailerable cruising boat. Newer models are much prettier but also offer much less utility. I like the older poptop ones best.
     
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