Joining longitudinals to the frames

hi!i'm a new member here..i'm a naval architecture graduate from the philippines. just want to know if what is the best way to have the right calculation of the gross tonnage coz here in the phil we just simply rely on an imperial formula.

 

The story goes on

Thank you all - for answering.

Sometimes I talk like I´d think that my opinions would be the
next "ten commandments". I don´t - it´s just my bad english and
not managing the nuances of the language.

So - thanks again.

MikeJohns the Scow is beautiful. I will be hunting the
Internet for more pictures and info.
I must confess that I´ve got every book imaginable on boatbuilding
and design from Chapelle and Skene to Larsson and Eliasson and everything
in between.
Propably not understood half of it and forgot the rest.

Waikikin I´m not going to build the boat ugly on purpose
what I really mean is that I am not trying to build the
boat beautiful in the traditional Fife or Herreshof way.
I´m looking for an air of "minimalistic- industrial- purpousness- kind of look"
(if you didn´t understand that don´t worry ´cause I´m not sure I did either)

Willallison You really scared me with your story.
Ofcourse You are right as everybody else, so I´ll "cave" (=give in?).
This is what I´ll do. I´ll draw a plan for the boat. Then I´m going to upload it
to my website and let you all take a look. (and have a laugh)
Before I start the building I´ll pay to get some pro. designer to look at my plans

Gilbert I would be very happy for a chat with the guy you are mentioning.

The drawing of my "design" and writing down the scantlings will take
a couple of days until then " don´t worry be happy".

regards
Kaj Westergard

 

If I may suggest.... since u r not sure ..... why not use cement hull boat that will last and easy mantained.....easily transport great feelin like livin on the ground...... quick to built.......think about it yeh...!

I am also builting my own small pontoon for my outlandish hidaway party in the Mahakam river...... then it be diffent from wat u had in mind....he...... wild party ....... n.........wild.......wild.......wild........HIC***........wild........HIC****

 

Ferro-Cement is not for me.

Well - Wellydeckhand.
Ferro-Cement is not suitable for me.

Ferro can be a very good choice , especially for a location like
Mahakam river.
(I´m supposing you mean Mahakam river in Indonesia)

For me, here in Stockholm, - Ferro is more expensive than steel.
For the size of boat I´m planning I can build a steel boat and buy
a 100hp. diesel for the same amount of money as I can let somebody build me a ferro-cement boat shell.

Furthermore channel-cruising is a "contact-sport" and ferro boats
are not known to be very "abrasive tolerant"

Anyway...
Thanks for the suggestion and good luck with your small pontoon.
(Jay R. Benford is a boatdesigner who knows a lot on Ferro-cement boatbuilding if you ever need some advice.)

I´m occupied with the drawing of my boatplan, when I´m ready
I´ll upload the drawings to a website and at the same time
I´ll upload some houseboat pictures from Stockholm, several of them
are built on "cement-boxes" so keep in touch.

regards
Kaj Westergard

 

Kaj

Looking at the way you want to go with this 'boat' a couple of points must be borne in mind!

1) If it looks good it generally is!
2) if it looks sh** it genrally is!
3) If you get this 'thing' built don't leave the wharf!
4) If you do consider who will PAY for your rescue? somebody will need to
5) If you don't care consider your family
6) If you don't care for your family consider the families of the guys who you might kill engaged in your crazy, anti social ideas!
7) If this don't put you off don't whinge, theres plenty of guys above trying to say in a nice way what I've just said!

DON'T BE A BLOODY FOOL, TAKE WELL MEANING ADVICE SENSIBLY

 

Hello safewalrus,
1. "if it looks good..." : I couldn´t agree with you more.
but... I´ve said it before: The beauty lies in the eyes of the beholder".
and I mean it in every way, meaning: what looks good works good and what works good looks good" if you get my meaning

2. "if it looks **** it..." : I wouldn´t know

3. ..."don´t leave the wharf" :Thanks for your concern

4. Nobody will never ever be asked to pay any money for my rescue. I´d die of shame.

5. Well , that´s a hard one, but I´m 56 years old, I´ve been a "good husband" and "a good father" for thirty years.
Time to think about myself. (I think)

6. "Antisocial ideas"? My main interest for fortyfive years has been women and boats. I own hundreds of books on every aspect of boating. I´ve read literally thousends of boat magazines. "Never understood half of them and forgot the rest".
I´ve owned five boats of my own (plus one 40feet steel hull that never got ready because for the last ten years I´ve been working more than eighty hours a week)
Kill somebody ? do you mean by burying them under my books or by asking them to show the same guts I have but they don´t ?

7. yes - and I would like to underline that they are trying to say it in a nice way.

Fool - No
Stubborn - I´m afraid so.
however - I´m really listening to what everybody says and I´ve promised to
publish a drawing of my plan to show to all the nice people.
Stay tuned you might learn something.

I know that there is a show called "Dr.Phil" and I think this is a discussion for him, but I still have to ask: " Dear safewalrus, what´s your problem - why do you feel threatened when somebody tries to find their own way, express their own personality (or in my case "lack of")

You may recall that Practical Boatowner twenty years ago run a series of articles of a guy who built a small (30feet) junk rigged longkeeled steelboat.
He built it like a "Rommel Panzar". "Submarine" doors and all. Somewhere in southAmerica his anchor chain chewed through his mast.
He juryrigged the "thing" and sailed it back to England.

I always kept wondering:" if he´s so afraid that he must build a boat like a tank why is he sailing at all".
Maybe you SAFEwalrus have an answer.

Kind regards
Kaj Westergard

 

Kaj
Now that we have a better understanding of your boating knowledge and experience, I for one say go for it!
Having someone qualified check your design is a good idea...
I'm looking fwd to seeing the drawings when you post them

 

Kaj

Have u been to mahakam? Cheap wood good grade......

If u got the time should try builting it from good timber.....No problem......the authority probit any export of timber, not ship or boat made out of wood...

AnyBody wanna come to Mahakam can contact me........... 3 Days car usage free of charge...... depending u fill in my thread or not he.......X100

 

Willallison thanks for your words.
Reading and Dreaming doesn´t make me nowhere near
a boatdesigner although I hope to avoid some of the most
common pitfalls when carrying out the business of building.

"stupid men build boats for wise men to buy" as those "in the know" say.
or
"when building a boat - begin with the dinky" which I won´t so... well - what can I say - stubborn, stubborn thinks he knows all

My plans and some boatpictures from a grey vintery Stockholm will be uploaded at this hour tomorrow.

Wellydeckhand I´ve never been to Indonesia but through Woodenboat magazine I know that you guys build beautiful boats.

I´ve chosen steel as building material,
because steel happens to be what suites me best.
I have a temporary building permit for a boathouse in conjunction to a
"metall-welding-company" where I have hired my own workspace.
I´ll be able to use their metallshaping machinery but I´ve only got two years time to build the hull, thats way I´m calling my project: " The BoxBoatProject ".

until tomorrow
kind regards
Kaj Westergard

 

Kaj, from your first few 'posts' it appeared that you were a silly wee boy who would put others at risk! From your reply to my comments it would appear that you are a silly old boy, with some experience, so as Willallison says
'Go for it'. Be an individual, drown yourself in your own sweet way after all now that you've reached the amasing age of 56 you must be an old greybeard that knows everything - sounds like it!

My only concern is that in the process of being an individual you would appear to want to put others at risk (when they come out to rescue you when you get into trouble.... and if your anything of a seaman you know they WILL come to help no matter what the consequances to themselves - thats what seafarers do!)

As for your stupid comment about bravery all I can say that is spoken like a true idiot, with little concern for his fellow man!

If that's the way you want to go then go and do it, don't just boast about how clever you are!

My problem? numpties is all!

 

You might consider checking out the origamiboats site.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/origamiboats/
With that building method you would not need to worry about frames. If you want to take it to the limit just make a larger version of the paper model posted on the site. Design charges would then = $0.00.
It would be interesting to hear the details behind the boats that sunk at launch. How damn dumb would a person need to be to build a steel boat or steel box that wouldn't float?
Gerald

 

Dont be too sure about Indonesian beautiful boats....... The world is sure that Indonesia is left behind 30 yrs in boat design............ I am sure I dont feel a thing.........Trust me.

 

Dear safewalrus,
I´ve got no idea where your loathing is coming from,
but I think it is a question for you and your therapist.
(I don´t think it has nothing to do with me)

This is a forum for people who are interested in boats,
not for people with fathers who never had time to cuddle them.
(Dr. Phil - remember )

If you want to criticize my person please do it by email not on this thread.
and...if you need some new "ammunition" please take a look at my site:
http://www.thebox.kajwestergard.com
I´ve uploaded my "planless boatplan" at the site.

jerryniff thanks for the tip on origamiboats.
It´s good to know that even "a know-it-all" (according to safewalrus)
like me has a few things left to learn.

Really - I would like to hear more about the boats that sank too - because it worries me - things that I don´t understand tend to do that.

As I just told safewalrus: I´ve uploaded my "plan" to:
http://www.thebox.kajwestergard.com
I´m not entirely satisfied with the scantlings. I think I have a serious dissimilarity between what I call the "center-plate" and the "pontoon-unit"

I think there is a serious weakness , along the weld line between the two units.
The floors on the center-plate will be welded to the girder of the pontoon-units but even then I have a feeling that I´ve created a weak spot there.
I suppose that the big problem is that I´m in love with my plan.
(It would be so convenient to fabricate the pontoon-units in the shop.- aah well)

Wellydeckhand the boats were more beautiful thirty years ago and fifty years ago and seventy and...
Indonesian boats are beautiful, take it from a "WoodenBoat-addict" and a "know-it-all".

regards
Kaj Westergard

 

Well what a nice man! First he asks for comments! Gets them! but in the manner of a little baby he doesn't like them, because they don't tell him what a fantastic person he is; so he throws his teddy out of the pram and stamps his little feet in temper!

Just the right sort of attitude to get others killed trying to rescue him from himself! I wish you luck for your project little man, but in future if you want comments please ensure that you state that adverse ones will not be welcome and anybody with real comments on the advisability of your dreams should not waste his time. But it's probably OK because that's all they are - dreams!

Unfortunately there are others who also are like minded (but not as rude) who would attempt to set off across the world in a sieve - it might work in fairy stories but unfortunately not in real life! Thus they need a timely reminder that some things are not possible! Most of them learn from this, modify their plans accordingly and set off carefully, thus enjoying themselves, reaching their goals, safely; and return to tell the tale (and some good ones they are)!

Nothing personal Kaj, unless of course you want there to be: in which case you are sailing into deepwater, little man, and need to be careful, you might not like were you fetch up!

 

I´ve made a fool of myself.
I had my two different plans mixed up
when I posted my boatplans to my site.

http://www.thebox.kajwestergard.com


I mixed up the scantlings from my "floating frames" plan
with the scantlings from my "notched frames" plan.
The spacing of the frames is far too tight.
I think one frame every 60cm. (2 ft.) could be about right.

I´m really really embarrassed

regards
Kaj Westergard



Personal Remainder to safewalrus:
Dear safewalrus, don´t forget to print out
this thread and take it with you, next time you go and see
your therapist.

Kind regards
Kaj Westergard