Is it possible to combine a sailboat, motorboat and submarine?

Discussion in 'Motorsailers' started by tahroo, Sep 14, 2012.

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  1. tahroo
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    tahroo Junior Member

    Hi All....

    Sorry if this is a totally a newbie question and I confess that I know nothing of boat designs but after reading lots of posts on here, y'all know your stuff so I thought I would ask this question.

    I was recently inspired by Virgin Oceanic's dive using positively buoyant, winged submersibles. I often oogle US submarine's class of luxury submarines with 1000 nm range diesel and 300 m dive depth with 24 hr lifesupport.

    Most of my life I have owned various speed boats on lakes and oceans. I have an affinity for sailing but I'm not as good as I like.....I am not a big fan of rough seas.

    My question to the knowledgeable people here is this: Could you in theory design a positively buoyant winged submersible with a cabin that could operate above and below the ocean and could be powered by sail with some sort of retractable mast?

    Please tell me if I am crazy.....
     
  2. Submarine Tom

    Submarine Tom Previous Member

    Sure, anything is possible.

    Is it likely? No.

    You are not crazy but awfully close to it.
     
  3. tahroo
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    tahroo Junior Member

    Thanks Tom. Being crazy motivates me. Being dead wrong stupid usually makes me think of something else.
     
  4. rwatson
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    rwatson Senior Member

    Your biggest design decision is to define what you call a 'submarine'

    Some just skim below the surface, and the occupants have to wear breathing gear.

    Some are capable of much deeper dives, and others head for the centre of the earth.

    The cheapest solution is to have a luxury yacht, with a small submarine and sailboat in the 'hanger', next to the gyrocopter.
     
  5. tahroo
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    tahroo Junior Member

    You may be right, but I am still not convinced my concept is not feasible. The sub offered by U.S. Submarine is a hefty price tag at $4M for 65 ft. capable of depths of 300m. I believe the mark up at $4M might rival any defense contractor. It is the winged design of Graham Hawkes that intrigues me. Why can't the wings act as outriggers to stabilize the vehicle to sail? The positive buoyancy of his design could address the displacement. Now all you need is a way to assemble mast. Think of the possibilities. Bad weather? Who cares when you are 300 m down. Want to sail around the Horn of Africa? Pirates? Good luck boarding me underwater. While I do like your idea, I'm afraid that my attempts to sue Mark Zuckerberg claiming that I invented Facebook have been unsuccessful. hahaha
     
  6. PAR
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    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    Why would you want to do this? Any device that's asked to preform multiple roles, especially highly conflicting ones, such as these, will usually suck at all of them. So, why would you want a sub that sucks as a sub, a sailboat that is a lousy sailor and a powerboat so incumbered, it can't get out of it's own way? Flying cars suck as aircraft and as cars, amphibious cars suck as boats and as over the road transport . . . From an engineering point of view it's 5 pounds of boob in a 1 pound bra.
     
  7. Wavewacker
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    Wavewacker Senior Member

    Was Cpt. Nimo crazy?

    I'd think if you just invented a telescopic mast that worked well, you'd make history!
     
  8. rwatson
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    rwatson Senior Member

    Like I said, you need to define 'concept'

    If you want to go 300m, the weight to withstand the pressure is going to severely cramp the motoring, sailing concept like Par mentions.

    If you are happy to go down say, 30 m, below the pirates but well within visual happiness to see wrecks, fish and coral, then you have a much different project.

    Sneering at defense contractors is a waste of time - you never know what they are supplying. Look instead at some of the amateur sub forums, for some 'cost effective' solutions.

    Your technique of thinking you can do it cheaper, before you even state you design requirements is real 'newbie think'

    Fill in the missing data first :

    1) Maximum passengers
    2) Maximum motor speed
    3) Sailing speed
    4) Maximum cargo/gear load
    5) Maximum depth
    6) Maximum length of stay at max depth
     
  9. rwatson
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    rwatson Senior Member

    There was no Captain Nemo - he was a fictional character invented by Jules Verne.

    All of Jules Vernes science fiction stories have come true, but not using any of the methods he invented mentally.

    The power of the mind cannot overcome the power of reality ( physics)
     
  10. Wavewacker
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    Wavewacker Senior Member

    I suppose there was no Santa, Easter Bunny or Tooth Fairy then! :mad:

    :D
     
  11. pbmaise
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    pbmaise Senior Member

    It is most certainly possible if you consider the fact a submarine is already a motor boat when it travels on the surface. To get it under sail all you need to add is a kite sail. This can be stored on deck. No mast required.
     
  12. rwatson
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    rwatson Senior Member

    Lets not go overboard - I have seen all of those other three, they were chatting with Jules Verne on the morning after the big party.
     
  13. rwatson
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    rwatson Senior Member

    OK, so you put a big kite on a U boat - how fast would it have to sail to make the owner happy ?

    The likelihood is that it would make 1, maybe 2 knots in a strong wind. A U boat has a surface weight of 1,051 tons.

    Sure it sails, but is it worth the expense of even building a $25,000 kitesail and rig ? That would buy a lot of diesel for a U boat.

    Maybe a smaller sub ? You could go for a 2.1 home made sub
    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10510691

    Trouble is, it is a tight fit for one person, and doesnt have the stability for any kinds of sail.

    Hey - maybe what we are missing here, is a design brief ?
     
  14. hoytedow
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    hoytedow Wood Butcher


  15. tahroo
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    tahroo Junior Member

    Thank you everyone. I think I am going to throw some money at this one and see if it floats. :)
     
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