Is it a total loss or is there something worth saving

Discussion in 'Sailboats' started by infy, Jan 8, 2019.

  1. infy
    Joined: Jan 2019
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    infy Junior Member

    I had a look at a pretty nice 1980's sailboat. It's close to exactly what I'm looking for but with a small problem. The grid/liner appears to have completely separated from hull. In addition, the title is a total loss. Salvage. The title situation alone is enough reason to forget about it despite whatever the damage. Practically impossible to insure and any time/money for repairs would be a lost cause.

    But that hasn't stopped me thinking about it. I think it's just an interesting challenge. I've got a side of me that just enjoys doing things others have written off as too difficult.

    The grid is typically a structural component. It's partially what holds the keel in place. So this is no joke. The only sign of good news is I can't find any indication of impact. Impact is what I first thought for grid separation. If there was a collision, it must have been something fairly soft and didn't leave scaring.

    The worst of the story is when looking at the thru hulls. You can see the liner has disconnected from the hull and floats an inch or so away.

    Maybe getting a survey could be interesting.. staring down the rabbit hole.. Talk me out of it!
     

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  2. Milehog
    Joined: Aug 2006
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    Milehog Clever Quip

    Run, Forrest, run!
    The boat is a liability, not an asset. You would become responsible for it's transport and disposal after you had sold your soul and ruined your finances.
     
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  3. JamesG123
    Joined: Mar 2015
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    JamesG123 Senior Member

    Yeah, nope. Not even if it were "free".
     
  4. fallguy
    Joined: Dec 2016
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    fallguy Senior Member

    Core rot is what it sounds like, although I could not make out any balsa in the pics.

    The work is not worth the effort.

    Faster to build a custom boat.

    I had to dump a core rot purchase mistake I made a few years back. It cost $500 to landfill it. The boat was $3000. I recovered some money in the parts and trailer, but lost on the core rot miss.
     
  5. infy
    Joined: Jan 2019
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    infy Junior Member

    Hmm. Core rot would be a bit of a pickle eh.

    Grids are usually serviced from the interior.

    But if we're talking crazy...

    I wonder if there is any sense in approaching a grid repair from outside the hull? Cutting out a portion below the waterline for access. Stabilizing and securing the liner.

    All hypothetical
     
  6. infy
    Joined: Jan 2019
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    infy Junior Member

    Don't forget the divorce! I hear you.
     
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  7. JamesG123
    Joined: Mar 2015
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    JamesG123 Senior Member

    No because its likely the entire thing is rotted out and broken down. You would literally need to disassemble the boat's hull, carefully carve out the entire core, painstakingly (and perfectly) rebuild the core with new wood or preferably foam and new grid members, and then reassemble it all.

    An't no body got time for that when there are probably a hundred of that model boat for sale right now in better if not turn-key condition.
     
  8. fallguy
    Joined: Dec 2016
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    fallguy Senior Member

    Nope. I saw a core rot boat one other time and I told the guy I'd take the boat for free if he signed over the title. But glad he didn't offer.
    You forgot to hope the hull doesn't move when recoring. There is a youtube video on partial core repair like a 2x2' section at a time. Necessary if you hit something or something hits you, but they use vacuum, so a 2x2 section is a one day job or like 2 areas a day, etc. or you setup for like 6 places?
     
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2019
  9. Ike
    Joined: Apr 2006
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    Ike Senior Member

    Time to move on and look for something in better condition.
     
  10. infy
    Joined: Jan 2019
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    infy Junior Member

    Yeah it's a $26k boat when in good condition. It's not worth the time, money, and effort to repair it properly.

    If I got it for free... I would look in to a 2 part epoxy based expanding foam. I've seen some products that dry very hard and adhere extremely well.. Drill a grid of holes in the hull and inject it in to the false bilge... making sure to cover every nook. Adhere it to as much surface area as possible. only after bathing each crevice in some nasty chemicals to clean any muck and doing a high pressure wash. Glass it up and see how it handles. If it holds structurally there should be minimal flex and noise.

    Everybody will say this is a horrible idea. I agree with that.

    But this hull is dead. There's nothing anyone can do to "ruin" it... If someone can get a season or two after restoring it as a zombie... foaming at the mouth..

    That's an interesting experiment.

    Of course it's not free. They're asking a lot for it... as a parts boat.. mast, etc...

    Disclaimer... nobody should take this advice. And I'm not advocating that this is a good idea. It's a curiosity
     
  11. gggGuest
    Joined: Feb 2005
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    gggGuest ...

    Whereas if they put the same amount of time, effort and money at a better starting point they might get ten or fifteen seasons...
     
  12. JamesG123
    Joined: Mar 2015
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    JamesG123 Senior Member

    Yeah, the only reason to do such a thing would be if you were stuck with it and you needed to get it fixed just enough to slip past a survey inspection and sold to unwary/unlucky buyer for far more than its worth. But such a thing would be unethical to say the least.
     
  13. infy
    Joined: Jan 2019
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    infy Junior Member

    I'm sure any surveyor would find something sketchy in no time.

    The worst part about doing anything like this, I believe, is the safety factor. On one hand, there's a potential that the correct high density epoxy could make the structure more rigid than ever but there's no real way to know that. Doing a hack job repair on something that could catastrophically fail at sea at the worst time isn't smart... that's stupid.
     

  14. fallguy
    Joined: Dec 2016
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    fallguy Senior Member

    Not really.

    The worst part is the labor to recore is hundreds and hundreds of hours. You could technically end up with a better boat than the boat at the start of it's life.

    The problem is cost benefit. The hours and dollars are not recoverable. The boat will never be more valuable than the same boat in good condition.

    Boats don't vary enough in value on good bs exceptional condition. It just is not there.

    It is more about simple economics.

    The boat I had with core rot, I could have gutted and modified to solid frp. I could have spent say 3000 hours on it or say 1000 for fun. When done, the boat would have maxed out at a value of the engines. Say I put two 200s on an armstrong bracket at a cost of 30k (sematics). The boats value would have been 30k.

    Your boat as a sail rig has a market value. Find one in good shape for say 30k, you buy this one for 15k and you spend 10k on upgrades and 1500 hours. The boat is never worth over the 30k, so your 1500 hours has a value of 5k or 3.33 per hour work.

    For my boat project, I spent 3k on the boat. It would have required 1000 hours and say 35,000-40,000 dollars to be worth around 25k. My labor was of negative value.
     
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