Improving handling in following seas

Discussion in 'Powerboats' started by journey, Dec 20, 2009.

  1. journey
    Joined: Dec 2009
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    Location: Victoria

    journey Journey

    Hi: I am considering purchasing a Bayliner 2670. It is a 26 foot semidisplacement hull with an 8' beam and quite high freeboard.
    It originally had a small I/O but the one I am looking at has been converted to a 50hp OB on a bracket. Maximum speed is 9kt with a cruise of 7kt.
    Everything I read about this boat is that the wide transom causes it to handle very poorly in following seas.
    Would the addition of a flotation outboard bracket that tapered in at the stern present a smaller stern to the seas and improve handling?

    I am no engineer and this might be a really dumb ides but I appreciate your input.
     
  2. Kay9
    Joined: Oct 2006
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    Location: Central Coast Oregon US.

    Kay9 1600T Master

    No.
    This is a pocket cruiser. They are designed for flat lake water. Adding additional floatation in the rear makes them even worse in a following sea and makes them allmost impossible to dock in any kind of current.

    K9
     
  3. journey
    Joined: Dec 2009
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    journey Journey

    Kay9 - Thanks for the response. Do you know of another boat that would be approximately this size, is trailer-able and would have better stability in semi protected water? I would be in the Straight of Georgia and other pacific northwest waters.
     
  4. mark775

    mark775 Guest

    The Straight of Georgia gets gnarly. Not as nice of a boat boat but better suited for a bit more weather are the Trophy series (The one I have been around is the 28'. I have never been aboard, tho. you can outrun more and they do okay in following seas). Whatever you do, you are going to have to pick your weather. IMO, no 20somefoot sportboat can handle some of the wind against tide scenarios there.
     
  5. tom28571
    Joined: Dec 2001
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    Location: Oriental, NC

    tom28571 Senior Member

    All boats and particularly powerboats depend on good seamanship in following waves. There are advantages and disadvantages to the outboard in this installation. The good part is that the outboard can be steered and a lot of thrust directed to the side to prevent broaches, which is the problem in following waves. The bad part is that it may be possible for the outboard to be swamped. Lots of outboard powered boats handle waves well so that may not be an issue here.
     
  6. Fanie
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    Location: Colonial "Sick Africa"

    Fanie Fanie

    Think that full speed is enough to prevent a broach ? I've had it with small boats on the sea, just good for good weather.

    How far do you have to trailer the boat ?
     
  7. journey
    Joined: Dec 2009
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    Location: Victoria

    journey Journey

    thanks for the input

    I really appreciate the comments you have all contributed.
    If adding more flotation in the stern will make the performance worse, will adding weight low in the stern, or ballast in a central location in the bilge, make it handle better in rough water.

    I realize that the straight of Georgia can produce some nasty conditions and I don't intend to push the limits, but sooner or later everyone gets in weather they prefer to avoid.

    thanks again
     
  8. journey
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    journey Journey

    Fanie: I forgot to answer your questions.

    I don't know if the 9 knots this boat is capable of is enough to avoid a broach? I welcome input from more knowledgeable boaters.

    I will usually only need to trailer the boat between15 to 150 miles, depending on where we put it in. With the slow boat speed, I prefer to trailer it closer to the desired cruising destination.
     
  9. TollyWally
    Joined: Mar 2005
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    Location: Fox Island

    TollyWally Senior Member

    If your boat handling skills and your systems ( electrical, pumps, tanks, etc.) are up to snuff you'll be ok, scared maybe but ok. Most boats can take more than most boaters. Your biggest vulnerability is getting your glass punched out taking green water, and you're probably not going to be out in that sort of stuff. Where people get in trouble is much more often a case of small things going wrong until it adds up to something very bad than something extremely traumatic. Hence the mention of your systems. Keep away from crossing bars at the wrong time etc. etc. etc.

    You'd probably be better off with more power, that gives you more options but your boat handling skills are going to be the weakest link. You might run into problems stuffing that outboard but you probably have enough buoyancy aft. LOL it'll be easy to tell on a rough day. What you really need is a good diesel stove to stay warm and toasty in nasty weather! :) Good luck and enjoy your boat.
     
  10. Fanie
    Joined: Oct 2007
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    Location: Colonial "Sick Africa"

    Fanie Fanie

    I have exactly the same problem - too far from the friggin water.

    You cannot go on the sea with only one motor. Lakes (we call them dams) you can if you have another way of propulsion.

    I kicked the idea of a power only boat, it is too expensive. A sail boat offers a 'free' means of going places but it's a whole new kettle of fish. Fun though.

    I'm building a 10m x 6m foldable cat that is trailable. Beeg job - no I don't look, I just carry on. One day I can hook it and leave for the water.
     
  11. tom28571
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    Location: Oriental, NC

    tom28571 Senior Member

    You have to look at the particularly water condition. Steep and short period inshore waves call for a different approach than long offshore waves. Many advocate riding the back of a wave downwind. OK in long period waves if your boat is fast and powerful enough to do that. Riding the back of short period waves in shallow water is probably not possible most of the time. In this case I like to run slower than the waves to avoid surfing into the back of the wave ahead, which is the greatest cause of broaches.
     
  12. Zappi
    Joined: Oct 2008
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    Location: Puget Sound

    Zappi Senior Member

    Never been aboard one but have seen many on the water and off. If the 2670 is the Explorer version then she is almost a pocket trawler. The bow is the same design as the 30+ buccaneer sailboats with a small fullish keel. Typically came with Volvo Penta 140hp. I'm not a Bayliner fan but have always admired them.
     
  13. Commuter Boats
    Joined: Oct 2006
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    Location: Southeast Alaska

    Commuter Boats Commuter Boats

    As designed, the CG was quite high on those boats, and in your case the four-cylinder engine block/ ballast has been removed from the bilge and replaced with an outboard with its power head significantly higher although weighing less. Bayliner's target with that boat was, economical operations, maximum living space, and easily treatable. I don't think sea keeping was a very big piece of the pie.
    Some years ago I had a client with one ( it still had the stern drive) and I almost convinced him to allow me to attach about 12 feet of 3 or 4 inch shafting to the bottom of the keel with the hopes of lowering the center of gravity and increasing directional stability. The client sold the boat before we got around to it but I think Bayliner gave up too much in trying to keep the boat light and shallow enough for easy trailering.
    For those not familiar with this model,Bayliner further insulted the design by encouraging all passengers to the relatively tall raised pilot-house as there is no seating low in the boat. So in summary you have a shallow hull with soft bilges, no ballast, very little directional stability, and seating for half a dozen people with their mass centered between 4 and 5 feet above the water line ( And maybe an 80 pound inflatable on top of the house).
     
  14. TollyWally
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    TollyWally Senior Member

    "You cannot go on the sea with only one motor. Lakes (we call them dams) you can if you have another way of propulsion."

    Not trying to be argumentative but many boats routinely work in pretty bad weather with a single screw. The bayliner in question is no fishboat of course but a well found single isn't out of the question.
     

  15. apex1

    apex1 Guest

    Right,

    the entire world of commercial shipping and fishing does!
     
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