I keep hearing about all these "cheap"(price) boats today, but.....

Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by Squidly-Diddly, Mar 7, 2011.

  1. Squidly-Diddly
    Joined: Sep 2007
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    Squidly-Diddly Senior Member

    with my inexperience I'm not able to see it, and boats either seem very expensive(due to low volume of production, no doubt) or expensive and still needing very expensive repairs.

    Can anyone post any actual "really good deals" and why?

    I know a little about cars, and I'm always seeing the ads with "$15,000 invested, my loss is your gain, sacrifice for $10,000" on a car that ain't worth $3000 even if everything was done right. I think in boating it is twice as bad, easy.

    Are there any particular types of boats that aren't junk selling for cheap these days? Gas Guzzlers? Do sail boats depreciate faster or slower than power?
     
  2. michael pierzga
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    michael pierzga Senior Member

    Yah..local guy recently purchased a few year old...lightly used, well fit out , Figaro 2 for 40 thousand euro. If you have the cash to act fast...plenty of good deals, the secondhand market is dead. Check with the banks and repo men.

    The Figaro was a bank job.

    Bareboat Charter fleets are also under stress due to oversupply and shortened seasons...
     
  3. Squidly-Diddly
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    Squidly-Diddly Senior Member

    could you tell me anything about the Water Ballast in these?

    "....circuit will grow rapidly with the arrival of this new design having seen no less than fifty boats hit the water in the first year. From initial research, the FIGARO 2 would also seem to be a competitive fully crewed racing yacht under modern handicap rules, once certain ORC-compliant modifications had been achieved and the water ballast system sealed off. She could thus also show great potential in two-handed races such as AZAB etc......"


    it says "system", is it like a MacGregor or is it able to be pumped from side to side?
     
  4. bntii
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    bntii Senior Member

    Given time one can find deals.

    A friend just purchased a Baba 40 for 50k. It had a few issues but is a going concern.
    I pick up boats whenever they appear at the right price & don't seek them out.
    A screaming deal comes by every year or so.

    You will not find the best deals through brokerage listings. One has to have an ear to the ground.

    The case is simplest for folks in the business. As in housing the best deals are often passed along to industry and never see the light of day. In the case of the Baba a broker was told by an estate to sell off the boat in a week-'price to go'. The boat was passed along to a marine trades guy in the yard. I will be told of deals entering the market that need to go away & will purchase if the margin is good.

    I am waiting for one to ripen on the vine as we speak- an older 44' sail- price at ~1/3 value.
     
  5. michael pierzga
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    michael pierzga Senior Member

    Sure , guys in the marine industry get the good deals. Last year a pretty little dCheoy Lee Clipper , dismasted and 2 years behind storage fees, was given to the bottom paint gang at the shipyard.

    Carefully scan shipyards for dead boats. Generally if you propose a trucking solution and remove the boat immediatly from the yard, they cost peanuts.
     
  6. PAR
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    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    Good deals require "leg work" without this searching effort, you're going to find full retail pricing.

    Currently I'm debating the purchase of a 65', 70 year old motor yacht of impeccable pedigree. Restored in the late 1980's and in fine condition, except for some rudder repairs, back slip and maintenance fees, plus 10K and it's mine. The owner has cancer and has to sell.

    The only way to find a deal like this, is working the marinas along the coasts in a regular and constant fashion.
     
  7. Carteret
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    Carteret Senior Member

    I have seen a "few" deals on Craigslist. And the funny thing is when you go to the marina to check on a lead you often times spend your time looking at a neighboring boat.
     
  8. bntii
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    bntii Senior Member

    The whole industry is under pressure. I don't know if a 'type' of boat is under more pressure than the rest.
    One of my broker friends told me the industry numbers nation wide had lost what 50% of sales in one year?
    They took a hit.

    Are you looking for yourself?
    For what kind of use?

    It is necessary to know something about boats- both pedigree and some knowledge of systems/structure in order to know when a given boat is under valued in the market.

    Say you are looking at two sail- one needs a re-power and the other is good to go- same price.
    If you don't recognize that the core is shot under that pretty teak on the one with the good engine you will loose if you purchase it.

    Re-power is easy and fairly cost predictable- the bad core boat might be a write off..
    Both jobs might be over what you are prepared to tangle with- know what you are getting into before purchase and how you will resolve issues.

    For your own use, a fairly rough boat might serve if the important bits are in good order- the 'diamond in the rough'.
     
  9. CatBuilder

    CatBuilder Previous Member

    See, the thing is, a "deal" on a boat is only a deal if you understand the entire cost, which is purchase price + maintenance + operating costs.

    While one boat might look like a great deal because it's cheap, it's going to hog fuel.

    Another boat might seem very expensive to buy, but sip fuel.

    Still another might be cheap to buy, but you can't afford the dockage or maintenance costs.

    What this really means is that there is no "deal" out there except a deal that fits your personal expectations. This is why it's difficult for people to buy boats... that and the emotions that get in the way of logic.

    So as an example, a retired shrimper from the Gulf that goes for about $100K will be the best example of a deal I know of on a power boat. Usually in fair shape, diesel well taken care of, can be a great find. However, you have to be able to afford fuel and maintenance on a 60' boat. If you can't, then no "deal" in the world will work for you.
     
  10. MastMonkey
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    MastMonkey Junior Member

    I guess it depends on the type of boat you are looking for. I find it amazing that for a 1-3k you can pick up a sailboat in good condition. It may not be in good cosmetic condition but you can still have fun with it and overtime make improvements.

    I also live in the Bay Area and I can second the advice that you have to work the marinas. Here are some examples I can think of:

    - One friend picked up an International Folkboat in good condition, minus peeling deck paint, for 1K. Over the last couple of years with new canvas and other repairs made to it it is a great boat. He probably has less than 5k in the boat and could sail to Hawaii tomorrow if he wanted.

    - Another picked up a Columbia for $100 dollars at a lien sale. It was in bad cosmetic condition, but it too is becoming more ship shape under the care of its new owners. While working on it they use it as a weekend gateway.

    -A few months ago I looked at a Frisco Flyer with new rigging, running diesel, good sails, teak decks, and all the carvings intact that I probably could have picked up for 3-5k.

    -On a recent trip to the delta I stopped off in Antioch. There was a large motorboat there, older, but it seemed well equipped. It's major problem was that it had a slight list, so maybe a major problem happening. It was going up for lien sale. I heard later that it went for less than a thousand.

    These all seem like great deals to me. It pains me to see the neglected boats around my marina. It especially painful to consider that most of them still have life in them if they were properly maintained or restored. But of course everyday they sit there that gets more expensive and more unlikely.
     
  11. PAR
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    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    You'll never find a deal on Craig's list, in the paper or through a broker. If it's good enough to advertise, they'll be asking for more then it's worth. The deals are had by talking with marina employees and owners. These are the folks that deal with and work on these boats yearly. They know who takes care of what and who doesn't.
     
  12. Petros
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    Petros Senior Member

    Most of the marinas around the Puget Sound area have auctions every 2 or 3 months to sell of abandon boats or boats with unpaid fees, likely similar in SF area. Go check with the maria office on auction dates in your area (some have them on-line, but it is not the kind of thing they want their current customers to know about).

    Also most boat yards and marinas both have list of boats they own for failure to pay back fees. I met one couple that bought large yachts, from a boat yard for back fees, moved on board and restored it. Than sold it for many many $ in profit, they were on their 3rd boat (about one a year) when I met them. Again just check with the marina or boat yard office. Many times the boats in the boat yards are projects started, but lack of income, health, divorce, etc. causes them to abandon the project to the yard. These have to be carefully inspected, often a lot of the equipment is missing and in the original owners garage (or sold on E-bay).

    I know of a customer of mine that has 4 large sailboats he either got for free or little money, stored on his property. Several just needed a lot of cleaning and TLC and would be perfectly sea worthy, others of course were major projects and I would say are hardly worth the effort unless they were classics. There are lots of low prices boats out there, you just have to be careful if they are worth taking. It helps if you have a place to put it, and a way to move them. I have been offered large sailboats several times for little or no money, but I did not have a place out of the weather to put them so I passed (around here the wet weather will turn a restorative hull into a salvage operation and a liablity in short order).
     

  13. bntii
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    bntii Senior Member

    Yep-Four or more go out each year here.

    For anyone on the east coast- I have a Yorktown 39 sail that I have been asked to pass along to a new owner.. going for yard fees.
    The price is right- contact me via PM

    [​IMG]
    Sistership...:p
     
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