Hurricane Sandy

Discussion in 'All Things Boats & Boating' started by Leo Lazauskas, Oct 29, 2012.

  1. michael pierzga
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    michael pierzga Senior Member

    I dont have the abilty to monitor the Bounty, call sign WDD9114, past AIS track . From what I see the vessel was on a coastal passage and Hurricane Sandy has been forcast for almost a week. Why did the skipper not put into port ?
     
  2. Submarine Tom

    Submarine Tom Previous Member

    They wouldn't have left the boat unless it was sinking.

    It is lost no matter what the alleged reports.
     
  3. Stephen Ditmore
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    Stephen Ditmore Senior Member

    I don't know what report you're referring to, Tom. My understanding is that the Bounty sank several hours ago.
     
  4. DCockey
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    DCockey Senior Member

    Bounty in Block Island Sound, May 2010
     

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  5. PAR
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    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    Bounty has been reported sunk, though this isn't confirmed yet. 2 are still missed, being swept from the deck while boarding lifeboats. They're in survival suits, but considering the time they've been in the water, not a good outlook. 3 where reported swept from the decks, but one got to a boat. 15 have been reported plucked from their lifeboats. USCG cutters will not arrive on station until Tuesday morning.

    I don't have issue with the skipper's decision to put out to sea, though I do have issue with his route. I would have headed towards the Flemish cap, then south to avoid the storm. He took the inside route, then ran into bad luck (always the case). I would have preferred to let it get shredded by landfall and the Midwestern system moving east, before turning south. It would have added a few days to the tip, okay, maybe as much as 6, but it would have been the safe, deep water route.
     
  6. DCockey
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    DCockey Senior Member

  7. ancient kayaker
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    ancient kayaker aka Terry Haines

    Paul, I question the decision to sail. The Bounty was no large, fast, modern vessel, just a small, slow-moving boat with a mountain of top hamper and what seems like a small crew. She left Connecticut 4 days ago when the hurricane - already dubbed "Frankenstorm" - had devastated the Carribean and smashing Cuba. It could be expected to build intensity while over the ocean, and most likely head up the eastern seaboard.

    Once at sea the safe course for the boat, as you noted, was straight out to sea, but staying in harbor makes more sense. A Florida destination would take her through the storm unless it headed into the Gulf - not the usual behavior of such storms. I can understand staying close to land in range of USCG rescue assets. The Sikorsky HH-60J Jayhawk can reach a vessel 300 mi offshore.
     
  8. PAR
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    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    Staying berthed means a storm surge will likely lift you and wash you ashore, probably bouncing you off every building and rolling you over every dumpster. You'd be able to find the wreckage easily enough, in someone's back yard, but it would still be wreckage. Conversely, as I mentioned heading towards the Flemish cap and hanging a right after the storm gets broken up, would have been my choice, but the inside route was also something to consider.

    Personally, I can't see the Frankinstorm remarks, as little more than attempts to have Weather Channel program supporters, sell more plywood and bottled water. I've predicted this storm's likely outcome, to several friends and family member in the mid Atlantic area. They bought into the hype, but sure enough 'ol Paul was right and it's a nor'easter, which they've all seen before, maybe bigger than usual, but none the less the same deal.

    As to the decision to run the inside passage, the storm was too close to shore to run this course. When he made the decision to ship out, she was far enough off, but quickly straighten up, more northward the next day, which was enough time to change course and get some distance. Ultimately, the skipper has to think about ship and crew and screw how close air/sea rescue might be. This generally forces the hand of a prudent skipper and he takes the ship out of harms way. It looks like he was lost in this incident, but Bounty was poorly managed for a long time. There was some hope recently, but she wasn't in the shape she should have been, particularly driving into the teeth of a category 1.
     
  9. watchkeeper

    watchkeeper Previous Member

    I'm not familiar with the eastern sea board but there must be rivers or an estuary offering sheltered waters within safe sailing run to make for.
     
  10. Ad Hoc
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    Ad Hoc Naval Architect

    I tend to agree with this. The storms or rather Typhoons we get over here, on average between 10 -20 a year, are generally far more powerful.

    We had one last year dumped 841mm of rain in 24hours...huge!..and the one last month, can't recall its name now, was blowing over 300 km/h winds!!

    Saves having to keep repeating the same tired mantra of the elections on the US channels too :eek:
     
  11. Stephen Ditmore
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    Stephen Ditmore Senior Member

  12. ancient kayaker
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    ancient kayaker aka Terry Haines

    - I haven't yet seen images of ships being bounced around in harbor like the 2011 Japan tsunami: I don't know where she was berthed or how vulnerable it would have been, but the crew would be safe ashore.

    The original Bounty started out as a collier and would do well to achieve 150 kn per 24 hours IMHO. I'm not sure how fast the 120' replica would have been under power with 2 John Deere 375hp diesels, but if she had headed out into the Atlantic I doubt she could have cleared a storm of the size shown in satellite images; not even a crack sailing frigate of her era could maintain the necessary speed. Whatever the plan it was an unjustifiable risk . . .

    Interesting detail: the replica was for sale according to a web record dated Oct 13, price US$4.9m see http://www.boatshop24.co.uk/QVNUTzAxK0JvdW50eX5BU1RPMDE=-Replica_of_HMS_Bounty.html
    (although Internet service is currently very poor for me at least)
     
  13. tunnels

    tunnels Previous Member

    Thems were the days when men were men and every female was glad of it !!
    Press gangs and taken to sea to learn what life was really meant to be out on the briney blue !! aaah me hearties thems were the days .:mad::eek::confused::(

    I can remember the days going fishing with me father and sitting in the back of the 12 foot plywood boat soaking to the skin from head to toe wrapper in woollen jersey my mum made shivering me heart out with teeth chattering so much i could talk ! me bare feet up to my ankles in freezing cold water sloshing in the bottom as i bailed water ! slowly motoring home in the pissing pouring rain after a days fishing !! by the time we reach the beach and where the car and trailer were parked the sun had come out again and warmth at last !!! was so cold sometimes i crawled up the beach on all fours cause i couldnt stand up ,lot of times it was warmer to just fall in the sea cause the water was warmer than being out in the wind .
    After a couple of days back at school had forgotten how bad it was and was itching to go fishing again the next weekend .
    Some times the fine rain would come and could only see a few yards in the mist !! its absolutly impossible to tell in what direction you could be facing untill it cleared and could see land again . we were usually about 3 miles off shore !! never took any more fish than we could eat for 2 meals , couple of Scnapper and a few gurnard and maybe a Kahiwai and while motoring home dolphins woilf come alongside the boat even managed to get close to a medium sized whale once . always used hand lines "big baits for big fish" !! didnt always work . life !!
     
  14. troy2000
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    troy2000 Senior Member

    I've been busy, and haven't been paying much attention to the storm. It isn't likely to threaten me here in California....

    But my understanding is that it was predicted to be a Frankenstorm because two separate storm systems are colliding: a nor'easter and a hurricane.
     

  15. Stephen Ditmore
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    Stephen Ditmore Senior Member

    This is more a hydraulic event than a wind event for us here in New York. What we are seeing is flooding along the lines of what global warming / sea level rise activists have been warning could start to occur. The way this hurricane came in, from the East, on the day of the full moon, is about the worst scenario for New York flooding.

    But Atlantic City, NJ was hit harder than we. That's where this photo was taken, made possible by good weather stripping.
     

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