How much epoxy?

Discussion in 'Materials' started by cruiserbill, Apr 18, 2012.

  1. cruiserbill
    Joined: Mar 2012
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    Location: Indiana

    cruiserbill Junior Member

    Hello all,

    I have a couple of years to really come up with a good plan of attack on building an ocean going cat. My plan is to build a Peter Snell 12M Sarah. www.easycatamarans.com

    The boat will be made out of Joubert Okoume Marine ply with Douglas Fir timber.

    After reading a lot on epoxy in this and other forums I have come to a possibility of epoxies that I think will fit the bill. I have also read the Gougeon Brothers book.

    I am considering Silvertip for glassing the hulls and possibly the structural frames and MarinEpoxy for everything else to include the glues.

    So my question is two-fold: is this a good plan, and, how much epoxy will I need for the hulls - how much does "X" amount of epoxy cover?

    The designer calls for 300kg (36 gals) of epoxy and 300 meters (325 yds) of 200g (6oz ??) glass cloth for the whole project along with q-cell and microfibers. I figure that I will need a little more epoxy than that though.

    If there are any pros out there I would really appreciate your input as I would from anyone with experience.

    I have worked with bondo in autobody, but never tried fiberglass.

    Thanks for your help!

    CB
     
  2. Frosty

    Frosty Previous Member

    I would politely explain that you may well be biting off more that you can chew.

    Beside the fact you will probably be aware of and that is it will be worthless on the second hand market you will be able to buy one--possibly cheaper than build --AND get your money back.

    Not what you want to hear I know but Now is the time to buy a second hand boat and if its sea going boat you can look at any country for one where they are cheap.
     
  3. cruiserbill
    Joined: Mar 2012
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    Location: Indiana

    cruiserbill Junior Member

    Frosty,

    Is there a reason you think I am biting off more than I can chew? I mentioned I had not worked with fiberglass, but I certainly am experienced in wood, electrical, plumbing, mechanical etc...

    My plan wasn't to build it and sell it, it was to sail it.

    Appreciate your input, it is it often candid.

    CB
     
  4. Frosty

    Frosty Previous Member

    I think that because I too am experienced with bondo on cars,-- tons of it in my life time. Epoxying a boat together --and Ive done a bit of that too is not the same. Not when you off shore at 4am in a storm.

    The most important point of my post was the financial implications.

    Ille bet you that one day sometime during your build you will sit down and remember this post.

    Good luck.
     
  5. FMS
    Joined: Jul 2011
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    FMS Senior Member

  6. cruiserbill
    Joined: Mar 2012
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    Location: Indiana

    cruiserbill Junior Member

    Thanks, I bought Pure Majek's CD/DVD. It is pretty informative, but of course not inclusive. I have also emailed them from time to time to pick their brains. They are very helpful. Right now though, they have other commitments that are pressing so they are not really available.

    I will check out the other site though.

    Thanks again!
     
  7. CatBuilder

    CatBuilder Previous Member

    No point fiddling around with small containers of epoxy and wasting your time and money. Just buy a drum, even if they say 36 gallons. You will be amazed at how difficult it is to even hold onto all the epoxy you need once people know you have a large amount. They will be offering to buy some for the entire length of the project.

    Plus, the per gallon price makes a drum and 40 gallons in small containers the same price.

    Silvertip is a great laminating resin with a very long open time. Good stuff!
     
  8. cruiserbill
    Joined: Mar 2012
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    Location: Indiana

    cruiserbill Junior Member

    CatBuilder - Thanks, sounds like good advice to get a drum. Any guidance on who to get it through?

    Also, does anyone have an opinion on Frosty's comments?

    CB
     
  9. ddrdan
    Joined: Mar 2009
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    Location: Raleigh NC

    ddrdan Junior Member

    I'm in no way a pro, but I have to agree with Frosty on the cost factors. With a lot of help from the members on here I built a small houseboat to get the experience for my larger and final build that I planed for this year. But guess what? In checking the prices on used vessels, for the last 3 months, I've found I can buy bigger than I had planed to build and for less money.

    And if I just buy one of those good deals I'll have no one asking me, "What's that stuff all over your hands?" (epoxy), "Is that an Arc in your yard, need two cats?", and my favorite question from a close neighbor, "If it sinks, will you go down with it? :D:D

    Either way, I had a great time on my first build, and I wish you luck on yours. And the pro's on here are a wealth of information you'll find nowhere else.

    PS: Take Catbuilders advice on the epoxy, I was one of those people buying epoxy from a guy across town that had 2 drums for his build. I used 15% more than I planned on. I had cloth left over.
     
  10. cruiserbill
    Joined: Mar 2012
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    Location: Indiana

    cruiserbill Junior Member

    I am sort of scratching my head here. I am looking for a blue water cat in the 39 to 45 foot range. I can't touch one in the budget range I have, at least I haven't found any. Even the very same cat I am considering is way out of my price range without building it. I have conversed with several builders and not only are they satisfied with their boats, they didn't spend near as much as they can and are selling for. The particular series of boat I am looking at, Easy Catamarans, have well over 100 builds and around 30 currently in the works.

    I have seen Priviledge 39s in my range, but I am concerned about the cost over that to get them ready to shove off.

    So, I am trying to figure out what I am missing or where the good deals are.
    I also looked at one to build that used DuFlex (balsa core). It is a bit more than the Easy (perhaps 30k to 40k more) to get to fitout, but they sell for $400k +

    Please, don't take this as an argument, I'm a rookie and need some proper guidance, that's all.

    Thanks a ton for all the input. A mistake with a build such as this I agree could be very costly (Frosty, you've got me thinkin'!).


    CB
     
  11. CatBuilder

    CatBuilder Previous Member

    Bill, the usual "just buy one" logic that is true for nearly all boats does not apply to 12 meter sailing catamarans. They are the only ones that are cheaper to build than to buy, given the same quality boat in each situation.

    If you can buy one, it's always a much better option. If not, realize it is about the same time commitment as going to college.
     
  12. hoytedow
    Joined: Sep 2009
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    hoytedow Carbon Based Life Form

    Yes, that was good advice on the drum. :)
    We all have varying opinions on Frosty's comments, depending on the comment. :D

    As Catbuilder can attest, it will be a tough go and for a boat that size the comment by Frosty has merit based on no previous knowledge of your abilities. If you are very capable and energetic you can "get her done".
     
  13. KnottyBuoyz
    Joined: Jul 2006
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    Location: Iroquois, Ontario

    KnottyBuoyz Provocateur & Raconteur

    I've been using the Aeromarine epoxy from e-Bay.

    http://stores.ebay.com/aeromarineproducts

    As good as some of the others mentioned here. If you contact the seller he can quote you on a drum if you like. It'll be two drums actually or a bunch of 5 gallon pails.

    I knew very little about epoxy & fiberglass work when I started. You learn quickly after you've wasted a hundred bucks or so of goop. :p
     
  14. groper
    Joined: Jun 2011
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    groper Senior Member

    I know a guy who built an easy as his first build...and as since done a few others since, all 40ft + cats... he recommended I do the same and start with an easy... he made a reasonable profit on the sale of it which was fair pay for his time to build it... however if the boat was a full foam cored composite, he would have fetched much more for it... hence I decided to build in foam core despite his recommendations , although he has never built in foam or balsa core so perhaps I can change his mind :D
     

  15. cruiserbill
    Joined: Mar 2012
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    Location: Indiana

    cruiserbill Junior Member

    Groper, May I ask which design you went with?
     
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