how do we save Global Dream II from breakers?....

Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by Squidly-Diddly, Sep 11, 2022.

  1. mitchgrunes
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    mitchgrunes Senior Member

    I assume a major issue for such ships is the cost of fuel. With less Russian petroleum in the market, fuel costs are high. My assumption is that the U.S. intends the Ukraine conflict to last for decades, so Russia concentrates its efforts there instead of on our NATO allies. And many of the current powers that be want to have reasons to push for "renewable energy". In the very long run, petroleum costs could go up anyway, as we run out of economically attractive sources. So fuel costs will likely stay high for decades, maybe forever.

    Maybe it was the right ship for the wrong era.

    I think they would refuse it because it was not built to mil spec! :)

    BTW, the U.S. Navy often uses old battleships for target practice. Perhaps they could use at it that way. But in shallow water, it would constitute a hazard to navigation. If it isn't complete, it might not be safe to take to deep water.

    In the Ukraine, major population centers keep getting hit. The ship would be an obvious attractive target, and when it was hit, a lot of people would die. Besides, how would you get it there? Would it have to steam past the Russian controlled Crimean bases? It's not designed to withstand military attack.

    As refuge housing outside the Ukraine? But ships require a lot of maintenance. There are much cheaper ways to run a refuge camp. Besides, it might be too luxurious. The U.S. and it's allies need to emphasize how awful the refuge situation is, to hold together it's anti-Russian alliance. And the number of refuges it could hold would be a relatively small drop in a very large bucket. And again, it would be an attractive terrorism target. The conflict in the Ukraine has created motivation for terrorism on both sides.

    Big cruise ships that use a lot of fuel in general may fall victim to current superpower conflicts, along with the hesitation for crowded travel that Covid created.
  2. wet feet
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    wet feet Senior Member

    I don't quite get the fixation with the US Navy.
  3. comfisherman
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    comfisherman Senior Member

    Well the last time billions were put into a dead end project scrapped even before completion in the marine world are us navy projects.

    Ove the last 20 years it's been a contractor gold rush of failed projects that go so far over budget it almost seems like nobody is trying. Not a chance the navy wants to requisition a boat like this. They would prefer to start their own project, get two years into it and then cancel and scrap billions in effort.
  4. mc_rash
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    mc_rash Senior Member

    For me as a young NA who cares about the earth we live in and tries to keep care about the environment may it air,land or sea, a big issue is that there are so many resources put in this ships which may never be used as the chance is high that these ships get scrapped. Same has happen to other cruise ships which were not profitable and it was cheaper to scrap them as there were no cruises while Covid.
    Isn't it kind of an useless, unnecessary, unsensible dealing with the world we live in and the resources we have available? For me it's something very disappointing in the maritime sector, especially the cruise ship industry is in any direction not good for environment.
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2022
  5. Squidly-Diddly
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    Squidly-Diddly Senior Member

    No one else does frequent ongoing major ops for months in distant regions, or could make use of a massive new helicopter carrier.
    USN more than any other branch also seems to have big housing issues. No one else has all these bases in other nations with lots of troops stationed and there will be "surges" during exercises. Guys are committing suicide on the USS Stennis super carrier because its undergoing years of upgrades with around the clock metal cutting and hammering but lots of crew are forced to live-aboard not for work related reasons but due to lack of other quarters. This one too. More than 200 sailors moved off aircraft carrier after multiple suicides - CNNPolitics

    Who else would hire a small army of Nautical Architects to remodel/redesign a mostly built cruise ship to slightly new purpose and some new requirements? Cruise ship already use their huge motor-lifeboats as routine ship to shore since many cruise ships are too damn big to dock at hot port of call destinations, but I'd guess the USN would want at least some other types of launch-able boats, like something much faster.

    Also the whole German Govt involvement/ownership of the ship and their lagging NATO contribution. Typically ship breaking only works if getting the ships for next to nothing but if they donate it to USN at least diplomatically they can pretend they are paying their tab, and since USA knows they will never really pay why not at least get a nice big new ship? Not sure that would qualify as "Win/Win" more like "it is what it is".

    Not sure why they can't finish the ship outside of the massive indoor covered shipyard, but I guess everything was planned to do it that way. I don't see why it couldn't be fitted out at some nice weather US port on the East or Southern coast.
    fallguy likes this.
  6. Squidly-Diddly
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    Squidly-Diddly Senior Member

    Fancy hotels seem to do purely aesthetic re-models at a manic pace just for the sake of "new look" and there is a big customer base who will book "just to visit" after a remodel. I guess its like getting the dopamine hit of a successful remodel of your own home but without the headaches, and for much cheaper.
    I'm sure Cruise Industry has that on 'roids and its all about seeing the new ship's new features.
  7. fallguy
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    fallguy Senior Member

    I like the idea. But, unfortunately, it is not likely going to happen. The planners are not much into refurbs.
  8. Squidly-Diddly
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    Squidly-Diddly Senior Member

    USN bought a fleet of 8 very high speed 30+knots civilian German built large cargo ships decades ago and heavily modded them to operate with fast carrier groups and destroyers, and still in service.
    Many WW2 era carriers of USA, UK and Japan were laid down as battle-cruisers, cargo ships or battleships before being finished as carriers. In USN and maybe Royal Navy these were later heavily modded to land jets on stronger decks and angled deck and cat launchers added.
    Not just tankers or bulk freighters but cruise ships have been "jumbo-ed" by cutting them in half and inserting large new center section. AFAIK all these projects have been successful.
    USN is said to have "wasted over a decade" building ships that don't work (Zumwalt and LCS, both classes of LCS no less). Already rumors of new class of super-duper carriers needed to go immediately back to the yards for several years to change out the new cat launch and few other systems.
  9. seasquirt
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    seasquirt Senior Member

    Give it to Doctors Without Borders, Doctors Sans Frontiers, to use as a hospital ship. With lots of rooms it's half way there already, and compared to some poor countries, it's already better than what they've got for a hospital, as it is, un finished.
    Set up a recycling plant inside and send it to one of the great floating garbage dumps out in the seas.
    Give it to the Sea Scouts.
  10. mitchgrunes
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    mitchgrunes Senior Member

    You need to find an incredibly rich person who wants a really, really big yacht. :)

    I can't even imagine how much fuel it requires to cross an ocean, or what it would cost to park it in a marina.

    Maybe the environmentally responsible thing to do is to recycle the steel - but I guess that is what you want to avoid.

    FWIIW, the Covid scare seems to be winding down.
  11. jehardiman
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    jehardiman Senior Member

    Anyone else remember ex-RMS QUEEN ELIZABETH?

    (edit for memory slip Liz not Mary)
  12. alan craig
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    alan craig Senior Member

    Back in about post 11 I suggested that GD2 could be used to house asylum seekers or as a town and was half joking. I've just discovered that the Netherlands has a cruise ship for asylum seekers and is getting another one; Scotland has a cruise ship for Ukrainian refugees (I think their hosting system didn't work) and our UK government is considering the idea for asylum seekers (although the courts will probably tell them it can't be done).
    So this is really political news but it does suggest that it's possible to use a cruise ship for longer term accommodation.

  13. Squidly-Diddly
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    Squidly-Diddly Senior Member

    Latest is that "The Mouse" is front runner to buy it for its intended purpose, and intended Asian market.Disney Negotiating to Buy Genting's Largest Cruise Ship Global Dream
    I guess that makes some sense, but I was hoping for "something diff" just for New Design fun, leveraging its low selling price and whatever state of incomplete/materials pay for but not yet installed state of affairs exist.

    If not USN/USMC accommodation/command/training/R&R ship, maybe a rugged more Adventure oriented ship. Shave the roller coasters and water slides and a couple decks off the top and slap on a flight deck for big helicopters and even fixed wing for Adventure Tourism doing Arctic/mountains in summer and jungles and deserts in winter.
    bajansailor likes this.
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