High Performance MPX Foil/Self-righting Trimaran-The Test Model

Discussion in 'Multihulls' started by Doug Lord, Dec 28, 2010.

  1. Doug Lord
    Joined: May 2009
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    Location: Melbourne, Florida

    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    WOLF daughter of fire arrow
    News Flash: Discovered a way to simultaneously adjust the angle of incidence of the ama planing surface on both sides. Added below under #12.
    ==================
    WOLF specs(tentative) :
    LOA 14.8' changed 6/2/18
    Max Beam 16'changed 6/14/18
    CL ama hull to CL ama hull*-14' added 6/14/18
    *Two stage ama consists of ama hull+ curved piece for extra buoyancy

    Target weight 175-190lb
    SA-
    --upwind: 149 sq.ft
    --downwind: 249 sq.ft
    --max pressure before depowering/reefing: 1.58lb/sq.ft*
    * NOTE-see previous page-post 2697- for max pressure comparison with an F18.
    Cost about 60% of WOLF
    ------------------------------------------------
    Advantages:


    1-Singlehander-will not have the capability of taking two people for a ride with high performance upwind. Downwind will foil with a crew weight around 340lb in 6.5-7.5 knots of wind. Excellent upwind performance with 200lb crew. changed 6/14/18
    2- Will foil in 5 knots of wind with 200lb crew . changed 6/14/18
    3-Carbon rotating wing mast, carbon cross arms and carbon foils.
    4-Retractable foils(from cockpit).
    5-Extremely comfortable.
    6-Uses the Fire Arrow Foil System(like Fire Arrow, Gitana 17, Banque Pop and Maserati)-- the same as the original system first used on the Test Model. Two UptiP ama foils-one used at a time-and one wand controlled mainfoil for very early takeoff and capable of substantial downforce all working with a single rudder T-foil. Downforce can be virtually
    instantaneous adding RM in response to gusts. expanded 7/6/18
    7-Foiling throughout the wind range -including very light air-the essence of 3D SAILING!
    8- Assy Spin/Screecher retracted under the front deck.
    added 6/3/18
    9- Boat folds from max beam to trailerable width in about 4 minutes. No waterstays. added 6/14/18
    10-Mid (wish)boom mainsheet so sheet is always in forward hand and extention tiller always in aft hand. added 6/14/18
    11-Quickly self-draining cockpit-large scuppers with backflow flap. added 6/14/18

    12-Adjustable angle of incidence of planing surface of each ama simultaneously. Angle of incidence of ama foil has to be changed when this is done. Planing surface starts at +4 degrees. added 6/29/18
    ==================
    Fire Arrow-inspiration for WOLF:

    MPX_Fire Arrow-3D SAILING-7-24-14 009 (2).JPG
     
    Last edited: Jul 6, 2018
  2. Doug Lord
    Joined: May 2009
    Posts: 15,537
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    Location: Melbourne, Florida

    Doug Lord Flight Ready

  3. Doug Lord
    Joined: May 2009
    Posts: 15,537
    Likes: 211, Points: 73, Legacy Rep: 1362
    Location: Melbourne, Florida

    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    WOLF daughter of fire arrow-- Finally painted and mostly assembled. Going to try two or more basic paint schemes to see which color or combination works best. See specs above:



    Wolf 14 concept model-white 7-9-18 001.JPG

    Wolf 14 concept model-white 7-9-18 002.JPG

    Wolf 14 concept model-white 7-9-18 004.JPG

    Wolf 14 concept model-white 7-9-18 003.JPG
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2018
    David Cooper likes this.
  4. Doug Lord
    Joined: May 2009
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    Location: Melbourne, Florida

    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    WOLF daughter of fire arrow-- exact scale foils:

    WOLF 14 concept model-foils-7-10-18 002.JPG

    WOLF 14 concept model-foils-7-10-18 006.JPG

    WOLF 14 concept model-foils-7-10-18 003.JPG

    WOLF 14 concept model white foils-7-10-18 003.JPG
     
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2018
  5. Doug Lord
    Joined: May 2009
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    Location: Melbourne, Florida

    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    WOLF daughter of fire arrow- Almost every boat I've designed and built and/or raced has been red or orange since I was 14-until this one. I've spent some time studying how the thing looks white and I'm liking it. I decided to touch up the crossarms and paint the cockpit black(temporarily) and the details of the paint job matter.
    There are some detailed additions to be made that I'm thinking will show up better with a simple, probably white, paint job.
    Ran out of light with this picture:

    WOLF 14 cockpit black 7-10-18 002.JPG
     
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2018
  6. Doug Lord
    Joined: May 2009
    Posts: 15,537
    Likes: 211, Points: 73, Legacy Rep: 1362
    Location: Melbourne, Florida

    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    WOLF daughter of fire arrow(update 7/11/18)
    --News Flash: Discovered a way to simultaneously adjust the angle of incidence of the ama planing surface on both sides. Added below under #12.
    --Added more on retractable foils under #4 .
    --Aerodynamic surfaces to be added to forward and aft crossarms-see#13.
    --Planing amas-see #14

    ==================
    WOLF specs(tentative) :
    LOA 14.8' changed 6/2/18
    Max Beam 16'changed 6/14/18
    CL ama hull to CL ama hull*-14' added 6/14/18
    *Two stage ama consists of ama hull+ curved piece for extra buoyancy

    Target weight 175-190lb
    SA-
    --upwind: 149 sq.ft
    --downwind: 249 sq.ft
    --max pressure before depowering/reefing: 1.58lb/sq.ft*
    * NOTE-see post 2697- for max pressure comparison with an F18.
    Cost about 60% of WOLF
    ------------------------------------------------
    Advantages:


    1-Singlehander-will not have the capability of taking two people for a ride with high performance upwind. Downwind will foil with a crew weight around 340lb in 6.5-7.5 knots of wind. Excellent upwind performance with 200lb crew. changed 6/14/18
    2- Will foil in 5 knots of wind with 200lb crew . changed 6/14/18
    3-Carbon rotating wing mast, carbon cross arms and carbon foils.
    4-Retractable foils(from cockpit). Mainfoil retracts flush* with bottom and tips are designed to not dig into sand. Rudder foil retracts above bottom. Ama foils retract above waterline when boat is level.
    * See picture below. expanded 7/12/18
    5-Extremely comfortable.
    6-Uses the Fire Arrow Foil System(like Fire Arrow, Gitana 17, Banque Pop and Maserati)-- the same as the original system first used on the Test Model. Two UptiP ama foils-one used at a time-and one wand controlled mainfoil for very early takeoff and capable of substantial downforce all working with a single rudder T-foil. Downforce can be virtually
    instantaneous adding RM in response to gusts. expanded 7/6/18
    7-Foiling throughout the wind range -including very light air-the essence of 3D SAILING!
    8- Assy Spin/Screecher retracted under the front deck.
    added 6/3/18
    9- Boat folds from max beam to trailerable width in about 4 minutes. No waterstays. added 6/14/18
    10-Mid (wish)boom mainsheet so sheet is always in forward hand and extention tiller always in aft hand. added 6/14/18
    11-Quickly self-draining cockpit-large scuppers with backflow flap. added 6/14/18

    12-Adjustable angle of incidence of planing surface of each ama simultaneously. Angle of incidence of ama foil has to be changed when this is done. Planing surface starts at +4 degrees. added 6/29/18
    13- Aerodynamic surfaces to be added to forward and aft crossarms. Adjustable flaps to be added on rear cross each side. Jib foot and forward part of main foot to be sealed to deck.
    14- Planing amas designed for incidental contact with water at speed and for inadvertent contact at slow speed. added 7/11/18
    -------
    Flush mainfoil recess in hull bottom:

    WOLF 14 ccpt model recess-7-12-18 002.JPG

    ==================================

    Fire Arrow-inspiration for WOLF:


    MPX_Fire_Arrow-Port Tack 7-24-14.JPG
     
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2018
  7. Doug Lord
    Joined: May 2009
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    Location: Melbourne, Florida

    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    Fire Arrow Foil System-- I was re-reading the thread and found this detail page(p110) shortly after the boat first flew(page 106)--


     
  8. Doug Lord
    Joined: May 2009
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    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    Fire Arrow Foil System--- A classic from Magnus Clarke on how UptiP foils work:

     
  9. Doug Lord
    Joined: May 2009
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    Location: Melbourne, Florida

    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    WOLF daughter of fire arrow WOLF aero mocked up: Leading edge/spray guard will be fixed on each side of the forward cross. One trailing edge adjustable flap on each side of the rear cross.
    HydroTurf in cockpit:

    WOLF 14 concept aero  7-15-18 001.JPG
     
  10. Doug Lord
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    Location: Melbourne, Florida

    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    WOLF daughter of fire arrow Name added to sides of "curved piece" . Probably should have had the lettering done in red--oh,well:


    WOLF 14 concept name-7-18-18 003.JPG
     
  11. Doug Lord
    Joined: May 2009
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    Location: Melbourne, Florida

    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    Glide Free Foils-- I discovered the other day(in a post by Trevor Jack on another thread) that Ian Wards Glide Free foils do not develop downforce. It had previously been pointed out to me that there are some Moth set-ups that also don't develop downforce. The Glide Free foils were a surprise, though. So I wrote to Ian Ward and he sent me some info(links below). For Fire Arrow or WOLF downforce from the main foil is essential but both of these boats have in common with the Glide Free System that rudder foil adjustment while flying is not necessary.
    So, thanks to Ian for the info below:
    https://docs.wixstatic.com/ugd/c8ef4f_6b6e865ba122418dbf3fc046d9a97b14.pdf


    https://www.glidefree.com.au/


    Trevor Jacks post : Need your thoughts- Hobie Trifoiler/Dared Kiteboat/Self Design Frankenstien https://www.boatdesign.net/threads/need-your-thoughts-hobie-trifoiler-dared-kiteboat-self-design-frankenstien.60667/page-2 post 27
     
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2018
  12. Doug Lord
    Joined: May 2009
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    Location: Melbourne, Florida

    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    WOLF daughter of fire arrow I've been working a little almost every night for weeks to figure out how to do the seats(one on each side). Well, I've come up with what I want-just not exactly how to do it. The number one ingredient from the start of this project is comfort-extreme comfort. The number two is to be able to easily slide the seat outboard. Tonight I almost have it figured out: the crew CG will be able to move outboard 1.75' from its "normal" position-and do it very quickly. The seat will have a head rest. The last two problems are 1) the details of making it work while being very light, and 2) making it work in such a way as it doesn't obstruct folding. Stay tuned........
     
  13. David Cooper
    Joined: Jan 2015
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    Location: Scotland

    David Cooper Senior Member

    Folding inwards or out? I'd look at opening it out into a flat sheet to fill the gap between the beams to minimise drag when not in use.

    How quickly do you need to move the seat out? Downforce should keep things level regardless, so moving out should just be for fine tuning to reduce drag and needn't be rushed. Getting back quickly to the middle is likely to be more important. Rope, pulleys and cleat could provide a simple way to pull the seat outwards and lock it in position (optionally aided by leg power if you have anything to kick against), while a bungee could pull it back in, but that won't be enough to get it back in again if the wind dies and leaves you sitting lower than the main hull (while your weight could outpower a bungee to move the seat further out too), so you may need another way to pull the seat back to the middle, and a better way to lock it to prevent it sliding in either direction.

    Not sure how you can avoid gradual erosion of the beams either unless you have a fitting holding multiple rollers to run against them (most above, some against side and some underneath), but that ends up being an awkward component to make or acquire unless it's already in production for something else. Maybe there's a simple low-friction track that can be glued to the beams instead, but it needs to be able to slide with over half the weight of a potentially hefty person pressing down on it. There are some boats out there with sliding seats already though, so there may be an off-the-shelf solution available.
     
    Doug Lord likes this.
  14. Doug Lord
    Joined: May 2009
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    Location: Melbourne, Florida

    Doug Lord Flight Ready

    WOLF daughter of fire arrow -- Thanks for the suggestions, David. The primary reason for moving the crew is getting started from zero speed. Once flying the crew can sit on the edge of the cockpit depending on his or her weight. A 200 pounder won't have to move a lot, a lighter person will have to move further and probably faster.
    I'm leaning toward experimenting with having the seat supported by a tramp and incorporating slick material between the seat and tramp. The seat will be adjustable fore and aft but that will, initially, only be done when the boat is not moving or moving slowly. Because of the great pitch control provided by the foils it's doubtful fore and aft movement will need to be frequently adjusted. Side to side movement a bit more frequently depending on weight.
    ------
    The outer 4' on each side will fold on top of the inner 4'. Viewed from the front the stb side rotates clockwise, the port side counter clockwise. The system will be the same that Eric Sponberg and I discussed for the Dream flyer: sliding insert, hinge on top, latch on bottom.
    See illustration here:

    Folding System-Wolf,Dream Flyer.jpg
     
    Last edited: Jul 22, 2018

  15. Gary Baigent
    Joined: Jul 2005
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    Location: auckland nz

    Gary Baigent Senior Member

    Build full size the fargo trucking thing and stop these endless and beyond bonkers postings.
    Yes or no?
    The latter, I'm afraid ... most definitely the latter?
     
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