The quest for a specific kind of cruising boat

Dear all,

After 10 years on my current monohull, I had a lot of time to ponder what I want in the next boat...
The problem is I do have some very specific (sometimes odd) requirements and I cannot find such boat!
By making a list of such requirements I am hoping you can point me to the right boat.

I'd like to start by saying I am still undecided but tend to lean toward a catamaran although I am not against a monohull or a trimaran if it suits the criterias.
Lenght between 33 and 38ft or 10 and 10.99meters but catamaran in the higher sizes are really expensive.


1)Shallow draft, able to dry out without legs. I like daggerboards in catamaran, and daggerboard in amas on a trimaran to save room inside the main hull. I don’t like v shape catamarans

2)Small but spacious for its size. Better to have a smaller but clever design than just a bigger boat.

3) Forward view when inside so that means wheelhouse for a mono/tri or bridgedeck saloon for a cat. Need full standing headroom in wheelhouse/bridgedeck.

4)Good average speed under sails. Too slow is boring, but too fast lead to accidents. Somewhere in the middle.
5)Insulated. No condensation. I'd rather have a foam sandwich multi than plywood. One thing I don’t know is how well those electric dehumidifiers work in a plywood boat?
6) 10-15hp Outboard powered. I dislike diesel engines and if the boat is built light enough/sails well it wouldn’t need a heavy engine. My current boat is 6tons with a 10hp outboard and I'm very happy with it. I know it's not everyone ideal setup but it works for me.
7) Minimal cockpit, can be flush or can be sugar scoop open transom with safety door for easy boarding for a monohull. I like a L shape cockpit on a multihull with a small table


I am posting a few inspiration boats below and list what I like and what I don’t like about them

Monohulls

Pete Goss 's Oddity
I like : shallow draft,drying out ability, 360⁰ view when inside the boat, walk in cockpit with the foldout transom door, compact size and overall clever design
I don’t like: a bit of an ugly duck, perhaps slow compared to a multi? Not sure if insulated

Dudley Dix Cape Charles 32
I like pretty much everything about the boat. Classic looks. Still light enough to be outboard powered. Raised topsides give more room down below as well as room on deck.
I don’t like: none have been built yet. No wheelhouse. If plywood the lapstrake could make the boat louder than need be. Would love the boat made of foam but not possible with the lapstrake.
Slower than a multihull

Nick Skeates Wylo 2
Similar as the Cape Charles above. No cockpit. I like the clever details of the design.
I don’t like the steel construction. No wheelhouse

Catamaran

Piana 30
I like the overall look of the catamaran, and the fact that it is possible to look forward when in the bridgedeck saloon
I don’t like: non insulated plywood, too small for cruising, non standing headroom in bridgedeck

Pete Hill's Oryx KD860 stretched to 10m
I like the compactness of the design, the simple design,and the light construction. I like the cockpit with the seats and table.
I don’t like: non insulated plywood, non standing headroom in the bridgedeck saloon

Trimaran

I have been looking at Farriers . I do like the folding systems of the amas but they have very little room for what they cost!
Also been looking at the Scarab 32 especially since the plans are cheap but very little info about the Scarab 32 that Ray Kendrick built. From the few photos online it seems very small inside.

Everyboat is a compromise but I am sure the ideal boat exists somewhere.
There are things I don’t know such as if the electric humidifiers would prevent the plywood from dripping inside.
I have been on a friends's plywood catamaran and it would piss down inside in the winter. Putting insulation and backing would be a pain and a loss of space due to the way it was built.
Anyway it's quite a long post but if you know of any boat that fits my demanding criteria please list them below!

 

Welcome to the Forum Periwinkles.

What is your current monohull, and what do you not like about her now, to make you want to buy (or even build?) a new vessel?

Re your 'inspiration' boats, here are some links.

Pete Goss' Oddity - here is a gentleman who has owned a wide range of sailing craft, from a 34' GRP Snowgoose catamaran to a 45' aluminium Garcia expedition yacht, and many others in between.
Oddity the yacht designed by a legendary yachtsman - Yachting Monthly https://www.yachtingmonthly.com/yacht-reviews/oddity-the-yacht-designed-by-a-legendary-yachtsman-94683

Re Dudley Dix's Cape Charles 32, I can see the general theme here - she is similar to Oddity, although she has a 'square top' mainsail rather than a conventional gaff like Oddity.
Cape Charles 32 & Cape Charles 32TC boat plans https://dixdesign.com/cc32.htm

Re Nick Skeates Wylo II, I met him and Wylo here almost 30 years ago, and I was very impressed by the boat. Others were as well, as a number of other boats have been built to this design.
NICK SKEATES ON WYLO II: The Ultimate Barebones Cruiser and his Ultimate Dirt Simple Boat - Wave Train https://wavetrain.net/2018/10/17/nick-skeates-on-wylo-ii-the-ultimate-barebones-cruiser-and-his-ultimate-dirt-simple-boat/

I must admit that I have not heard about the Piana before, but she does look rather neat - maybe @oldmulti can give you an opinion on her?
Here is one for sale on Yachtworld -
https://www.yachtworld.com/yacht/1998-naval-force-3-piana-30-10057850/

In comparison to the Piana, the Oryx designed by Bernd Kohler is VERY left field and unconventional!
Duckworks - Something New from the ORYX https://www.duckworksmagazine.com/13/projects/oryx/

And you are also looking at trimarans - from unorthodox monohulls to cats to trimarans, I can appreciate your dilemma - which do you choose?
Here is some info about the Scarab -
Plans for the Scarab 32 folding trimaran http://www.teamscarab.com.au/Scarab32Des.html

And Farrier trimarans - their website no longer exists, but here is some general info on Wiki -
Farrier Marine - Wikipedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Farrier_Marine

 

Periwinkles. You said a 10 meter version of the 860 Oryx built by Peter Hill could be of interest. Try $75,000 NZ, has sailed half way around the globe. The web site is: Bernd Kohler Kd860: Sailing Catamaran for Sale | Timber Sail Boats | Boat | - Auckland NORTH ISLAND, North Island | BoatsOnline NZ
Piana has 30 foot and 40 foot versions originally built in ply. These are not seen on the second hand market often as they are held tightly by their owners. Good boats that can sail well.
Oldmulti

 

Current boat is 1970's design 32ft full keel with 5'6'' draft and that is one of the reason I'd like to change.
There is a lot to be said for accessing shallow places as well as being able to beach the boat.
I found that many times I could not reach safer anchorages in a blow due to her depth.
And also I just need a change.

I have met Nick on Wylo II as well and sailed in company with him. Like you I was impressed with the Wylo II design!

The Cape Charles also exists in gaff rig, with a high peak gaff to avoid having to raise a topsail.

Like you say there is a kind of a theme here. Flush deck, raised topsides...makes sense on smaller boats, it gives enough deck space to store a good dinghy as well as giving a sense of space down below.

When it comes to rigs I am not dogmatic about them.
I sailed on marconi, gaff, junk, and lug rig and can appreciate each rig for what they are.
I was surprised by the cambered junk rig, less so by the gaff ketch. I guess it depends a lot on the boats too.

There is another cat that is really interesting. It is the Kurt Hughes 36.
Kurt Hughes Multihull Design - Catamarans and Trimarans for Cruising and Charter https://www.multihulldesigns.com/designs_stock/36bdcat.html
It seems to ticks all the boxes, 1.73 headroom in the coachroof, easy access forwards to the decks, daggerboards, and at least one has been build out of foam.

The other contender is Bernd Kohler KD1000.
KD1000page https://ikarus342000.org/KD1000page.html
Not sure what he means by this:
''The hulls have a multi chine cross section with rounded side panels.''
Does he says the side panels are tortured ply?
The geodesic coachroof is awful to look at, and how on earth do you go forward of it? Seems very dangerous!


The Piana 30 coachroof shape is so much more elegant



Regarding Oryx, I found a website last week and she was listed at 95k NZD. Quite a difference from your website! I'll try to find the link.
There are a few of things I don’t like about it, the sitting headroom in the coachroof, the non insulated plywood and the low bridgedeck clearance.

 

Periwinkles. This is a response to an enquire on another Blog which I am dual posting here. The Piana 30 performance cruising catamaran was built by Naval Force 3 shipyard in France. It is capable of Atlantic crossings with a good crew and moderate conditions.

The Piana 30 is 29.5 x 16 foot with a weight of 4480 lbs. The rig is a sloop of unknown area. The draft is 2.65 foot over the low aspect ratio keels and rudders. The power is 2 x Honda 10 HP outboards.

The accommodation has a double berth aft in each hull. In the port hull is a galley and in the starboard hull is part of the toilet area and toilet. Forward in both hulls is a single berth. The bridge deck saloon has a large dinette capable of 6 people. The headroom in the main saloon is 5.75 foot The cockpit is comfortable. There is storage in the forward wingdeck lockers.

The build is mainly plywood and timber. I do not know the structure but imagine EG 6 mm for hull sides, 9 mm for hull bottoms and decks and 12 mm for underwing and some bulkheads. Internal furniture acts as structural stiffeners throughout. A well thought out structure.

From the limited comments I have seen about sailing performance the owners were happy on all points of sail.

The jpegs give the idea.

 

Really nice boat this Piana!
@oldmulti I am currently reading your Multihull structure thoughts thread. It's a goldmine of information and definitely my favorite thread on this forum.
Have you collected and stored information about multis over the years? How do you find out about hull thickness and laminates as it's not something always given in the specs.

Do you have in your database of any sub 33ft cat built in foam sandwich, decent bridgedeck clearance and with minimum 5’7’́’ ft headroom in the bridgedeck saloon?

It is asking for the impossible and all would be solved by adding a few feet/ meter more on the LOA but I rather like the compact multis.
No designer ever done something like this?

 

@Periwinkles would a Smart Cat be suitable for what you have in mind?
In the photos in the link below there appears to be an option to have an enclosed deck saloon (rather than an open bridgedeck) which might have your minimum headroom requirement?
Smart Cat S280 - SMART CATAMARANS https://smartcatamarans.com/smart-cat-s280/

Here is a photo I saved a few years ago, when she was called the Smart Cat 880.


She now appears to be built in South Korea by these folk
28ft Catamaran Yacht https://s-comtech.com/product/catamaran/28ft-catamaran-yacht/

 

Periwinkles. I have been interested in multihulls for 50 plus years plus and personally know/knew several designers. It helps that I have built and project managed several cats and a tri plus have access to many boat yards and material suppliers. But I am not a naval architect or designer. The index on page 1 of Multihull Structure Thoughts will give a guide to sub 33 foot boats that may be of interest. Look at the Raku 32, it may be of interest.

 

@bajansailor In theory yes, that seems to fit. It looks like a catamaran version of Pete Goss's Oddity but holy cow this is ugly
Due to work commitment my cruising ground will be northern Europe for the next few years to come.
I am lucky to have 2 weeks on 6 weeks off.
With this current situation I have considered building but will resort to it only if I can’t find a suitable boat.
You hear it is easier to buy an already built cat and restore it but affordable multihulls are hard to come by!

 

Heading over to your thread to find out more about Raku
At a quick glance the boats looks good!