Good reasons NOT to design

Hey, I'm all for doing things your own way. I dont need people telling me what is smart and what isnt, but this guy took it to the extream. He didnt even drop the thing in a pool, and door hinges?? WTF? I think his whole idea was to build a boat on the smallest budget he could. He should have painted Home Depot on the side. At least he might have gotton a few bucks out of it.

 

Rayaldridge. Figgy. Then I am wrong in my assumptions . Normally these crossings and round the world stuff is well funded by advertisers and the like. This guy is in serious need of pshyciatric analysis, or as the doctors would say --a nutter!!

 

Update: Harley has published a "set the record straight" piece in Duckworks today.

http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/06/outings/saga/index.htm


He says the boat tipped over on the trailer when they hit a pothole and damaged the keel. He couldn't find the leak when he beached the boat, so he had to abort his trip. He couldn't test the sails because his supplies were not properly stowed... apparently he doesn't know about sandbags or rocks.

Anyway, he's back home, though he had to leave the boat in Tofino, BC, until he can talk his "ground crew" into borrowing another trailer.

The most fascinating thing about the whole pathetic misadventure, to me, has been the feelings aroused in the bystanders. There seem to be two major factions, those who are dubious, and those who are whole-heartedly enthusuiastic about Harley's chances, and seem to bitterly resent any criticism of Harley's boat or preparations.

Human nature is hard to fathom, sometimes.

 

At least the man came to his senses...somewhat.
I'm glad he didnt leave in that thing, buys him some more time being ALIVE.

 

What worries me is that, with all the exposure, he may be pushed to do something he wouldn't otherwise do....

 

Sorry, I know this is an old thread but some of it is still valid.

Firstly, I agree with Tim. We're here to pick your brains (the little there is )to know what you do since you're supposed to know more than we do.

If you have the time please help. Understandably nothing is in black and white, but an 'I have found that' or 'look here' or a 'this happened to me' or 'this works well' does help a lot.

WRT designing your own boat. The saying the Titanic was built by professionals but the arc was built by amatures comes to mind. The difference was the one sank

If it wasn't for amateurs fiddling with stuff there would be heck of a lot of techologies much less advanced than what they are today. Take the TV you look at daily - there were studies on how a TV was one day going to work ? no.

I for one do not always take everything at face value. If the pro's are so good at what they do, (and some of them are brilliant) then why are there so may complaints still about cat deck clearances (after how many years) to mention only one aspect.

When building my workshop the engineer drawed up a very big and expensive beam that had to run the span of the roof. I questioned it at the time and decided to put smaller beams across instead. Later when he inspected he appologised and said he didn't think about doing it that way. Now unfortunately this didn't turn me into a civil engineer of sorts, but it does prove a point. Nobody is perfect. You ever woke somewhere in the night with the solution of a long time problem ? Me neither. I get my bright moments when I take a bi-weekly bath. Wife now refuses to take notes, she says she's not my blooming secretary .

So we all think a bit different from one another. Which is why we have meetings, we look at how or what someone else did, chat on forums, all just to maybe get a bit of extra knowledge. The real reason is we just may get that new feature concept or idea or a different perspective from someone else to put ourselves ahead. Yes, admit, it's all about yourself. You won't go on the forum soley just to help someone else. You go there to see if there's something for YOU !

I like designing stuff. Most I never bring to life due to time, money, the wife, the neighbor's cat or whatever excuse seems best at the time if I lose interrest.

You'll always get the idiot who design something without proper reserach, like a new boat in this case that is not going to make it. Reads a two line paragraph or see a picture, gets all excited and rush off to get the materials.

On the other hand there are probably a few people that designed their own crafts and got the first (or second) one to actually float, who later became 'designers'. I recall read someone's bio last night that did just that.

So, design away, just make sure (ask the experts here ) it stays the right side up and get yourself past the point of just enough knowledge where you're dangerous.

Toot, you ever saw a crowd encouraging a jumper to take the next step ?

 

I just joined this list and enjoyed surfing the various threads. I think the author of this thread had failed to articulate a reason NOT to build. I enjoy the designing part as much of the building. To me it is part of the creative process. I am an engineer with professional experience in automotive, aircraft and structural design, and consumer products. But unlike most I am a creative an experimenter, as well as a builder. I have built 8 boats, 6 are original designs (the first when I was 10 years old!), I have designed and built my own home, and have built many other projects (including rebuilding perhaps 8 or 10 cars for fun or daily use). When I was recently at the Port Townsend Wood boat festival I mentioned to a group of builders that I had built 8 boats, someone commented that I definitely got "it" (meaning the building "bug" I suppose). I have made my share of mistakes sure (fortunately on smaller craft that can be inexpensively corrected) but that is part of the learning process. You take the successes along with the failures, all go towards understanding the design and building process.

I think if an individual WANTS to design his/her own boat as part of the learning process we should encourage them to do it. But we should also steer them in the right direction to learn about what they are doing before they start ordering and cutting materials. And get more sailing/boating experience (even if crewing on other's boats) so they will know more about what they want. This forum is great for that, but also books and local club or workshops and elsewhere so they either gather the information they need first, or realize they are in over their head. If they come to the realization it would be better to start with plans on their first project, than yes we did them a big favor. OTOH, if they dive-in and self educate themselves, than we would have also did our job.

This is important, if you simply try to discourage someone without understanding their motivations or determination they may end up staying away from other designers and buildings thinking we are just a bunch of arrogant snobs (and sometimes they would be correct in that assessment), rather than helping educate them in the process.

If their motivation in designing their own boat is to save the cost of plans, or to get a different interior layout. Than that is when we should point out that this is a false economy, it is better to start off with a proven design and then make the changes to a known seaworthy design. It the plans and designers support are well worth the money in both time and materials savings.

So if they want to learn what goes into the design process to develope their own ideas as part of the building process, (and they are willing to invest the time and effort to do so) that is the correct motivation I think. If they are trying to save money or are egotistically going off half cocked with unsound theories, they should be encouraged to start off with something proven and work from there.

 

Planing amas?

I read a patent that discussed that. I have also heard about people using the design for airplane floats for that reason... does it actually work?

 

So the question seems to be: Who is a "good" designer?

Most designers never built most of the boats they design -- yet they are all out there selling plans and bragging about how well their boats will perform, even though they are completely untested and unproven ... until someone else takes the risk and builds the prototype.

Some new designers actually seem to prefer making "pretty pictures" in their design software rather than thinking much about the practical aspects of construction and performance of those designs. Nevertheless their pretty pictures attract a lot of interest (and money in plans sales) regardless of their possibly inferior designs.

I think most people new to boat building do not distinguish between designers with proven track records and designers who make pretty pictures. In this case the individual designer might do better with his own designs. At least he wouldn't get stuck with an expensive set of bad plans produced by a graphic artist rather than by a truly capable boat designer.

 

I disagree. It depends what one has at your disposal, and the skills you have.

Well, everything has to start somewhere. With designing everything starts off with an idea, then it becomes a drawing and then a picture before it is built. It is also a way of making the outcome of it real for the designer and of course the potential customer.

 

the new people to boat building,,dont know what they dont know . many sales people ,or so called designers , count on this ,,in the old days most designers at least had thier own yards ,,such as john brandlmayr in vancouver,everyone has dreams and expectations and think it will work because it does on paper,,the true masters are gone ,,it is strickly,,,buyer beware

 

I think this thread revolves around one main point. Amateurs design their own craft....badly....and then get into trouble on the water.
i'm just wondering what the true risks are. How many people manage to get home after a frightening time out at sea, with a boat that broaches and nose-dives. And how many people actually end up calling for a helicopter rescue. And how many people end up dead.
I am an absolute amateur but I am designing my own catamaran as much as I can (admittedly I will get it checked over by people with more experience).
For me, the fun of designing and sailing my own boat outweighs the risk of catastrophe. And I have many ideas on my boat which have not been done before as far as I know. I'm so crazy I won't even show those ideas yet....I want to protect them.....so I guess I'm a bit selfish on this forum.
- Richard

 

Richard -- Are you building your design(s) also? This is the part of the creation process that can be a bit less exciting.

regards

 

I don't want to do any building. I think this part of the process is best left to people with a lot of experience. Learning the basic principles of boat physics doesn't seem to overwhelming to me. But learning all the hands-on techniques for building a good strong boat.....that does seem very involved, and I can see myself making too many mistakes. I don't think my boat design will be dangerous though.
- Richard

 

I use software in my design work but I also have my own yard (if you can call it that) so at least I can build and test my own designs. I can build and test other people's designs too, and it is relatively cheap for me to do so given the characteristics of my location ...