From classic bow to scow bow

Discussion in 'Sailboats' started by Dolfiman, Feb 17, 2018.

  1. Konstanty
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    Konstanty Junior Member

    Extremal round bow and stern. :)
     
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  2. Dolfiman
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    Dolfiman Senior Member

    Veedol, the second Lift40 launched just late June 27 (here above quote) has won its first race, the 700NM Dreahm Cup, one of the warm-up races to prepare the next Route du Rhum), with Yohan Richomme as skipper, on a fleet of 29 Class 40. Sister ship Carac/ Louis Duc is 8th at 4 h. Very light winds dominated the first 48 h of race, but the final rush was speedy, with reaching at average 17 Knots and peaks at 22 .
    Complete results with rankings and times :
    https://drheam-cup.com/2018/07/28/r...s-de-la-drheam-cup-destination-cotentin-2018/
    *** Comments of Yohan Richome (in French) :
    Class40 : Yoann Richomme s’est étonné
    En CLASS40, la bataille aura là encore été incertaine jusqu’au bout, avec, comme sur toutes les dernières courses de cette série très homogène, une bataille de tous les instants entre six ou sept solitaires. Et c’est finalement Yoann Richomme, sur Veedol, un plan Lombard survitaminé mis à l’eau le 29 juin dernier, qui s’est imposé, le vainqueur de la Solitaire du Figaro 2016 ayant quasiment toujours été aux avant-postes, preuve de la vélocité de son nouveau Class40. « Je suis le premier étonné de cette victoire, a-t-il commenté une fois le pied à terre. J’ai certes une grande confiance dans le design et le potentiel du bateau, mais ce n’était que sa cinquième navigation ». Et l’intéressé d’ajouter, à propos de ses 4 jours 2 heures 7 minutes et 7 secondes passés en mer, avec notamment Phil Sharp à ses trousses : « Au passage du Fastnet, Phil est à 0,8 mille derrière moi, je n’ai alors aucune certitude sur le bord de près, mais je me suis rendu compte que j’allais un peu plus vite. Finalement, il est revenu une puis deux fois, je passe Wolf Rock juste devant le front et je réussis à creuser un peu. Je suis le premier impressionné par ce résultat, j’ai une machine de guerre entre les mains, mais qu’est-ce que c’est dur ! C’est parfois très violent, j’ai fait 22 nœuds au reaching, avec des bords à 17 de moyenne, c’était assez dingue. Sur cet événement, j’ai énormément appris, en couvrant plein de phases du bateau ». Phil Sharp (Imerys Clean Energy) a pris la deuxième place devant un autre Britannique, Luke Berry (Lamotte Module Création) pour un podium qui, comme en IMOCA, célèbre l’Europe de la voile !
    *** Comments of Louis Duc :
    Louis Duc : « Le bilan est bien sûr mitigé, J’ai trop insisté dans mon option ouest au début, et je l’ai payé cher… J’espérais faire un résultat sur cette course, ça a été très dur à vivre cette pétole.
    Je ne pensais en revanche vraiment pas pouvoir revenir sur le top ten ! Dès que j’ai pu retoucher du vent, j’ai été dans les clous tout le temps.
    Il y a eu beaucoup de manœuvres, de changements de voiles, sous spi, dans la brise avec une mer formée. Et là, tout est très bien passé ! J’avais toujours les bonnes voiles, une bonne vitesse et je n’ai pas fait d’erreur. Ca, c’est très positif.
    Je suis très impressionné par Yoann Richomme, il a navigué comme s’il connaissait son bateau depuis des mois alors qu’il n’a pu s’entrainer que quelques jours depuis sa mise à l’eau ! Ca confirme bien que le Lift40 est rapide ! »
     
  3. Dolfiman
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    Dolfiman Senior Member

    In the document here attached, the photos of Veedol showing the hull and its bow from various angles. Veedol and his skipper Yoann Richomme is of course qualified to the Route du Rhum since this brilliant first win in the Drheam Cup, and with its sister ship Carac, the boats to follow in this very competitive Class 40. Yoann Richomme was the 2016 winner of La Solitaire du Figaro and was during the last winter one of testers of the new Beneteau Figaro III prototype.
    On this link, you can see also a video of Veedol reaching at 18 knots during a training sail :
    Classe 40 “lift 40” https://marclombard.com/classe-40-new-design/
     

    Attached Files:

  4. Dolfiman
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    Dolfiman Senior Member

    News, photos and videos of this new David Raison design built by Idb Marine. The first one is named Williwaw (N°951), currently registrated in the Mini650 proto class but this design aims to be in the series class in the future :
    Maxi 650 – Le blog du chantier Idbmarine http://blog.idbmarine.com/?cat=52
     
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  5. Dolfiman
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    Dolfiman Senior Member

    Here is a new small day boat 6m long, " BE 6.0", with a hull shape, fore volumes, rounded bow and bow knuckle slightly above the waterline, which are typical of the current trend, similarities with the successful Lift 40 design. The boat aims just easy fast sailing balad, not racing at such, and first tests seems to prove it (see the video). To note also the very aft position of the mast. Loa 6 m, Boa 2,40 m, Draft 0,5 m / 1,8 m , Light weight 450 kg, Ballast daggerboard 120 kg, Upwind sail surface 27 m2 (Main 16 m2, Genoa 11 m2), Gennaker 34 m2 . Naval architect is Thomas Julien (the crew man on board, in the video).
    https://voilesetvoiliers.ouest-fran...s-rapide-ddb95f72-a3b2-11e9-a2d0-51d7fb7805e8
     
  6. Dolfiman
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    Dolfiman Senior Member

    Two new Class 40 design with a strong scow bow influence :
    158 Crédit Mutuel, the first David Raison design for this class I think, launched few days ago, skipper Ian Lipinsky (last winner of the Mini650 transat) :
    Crédit Mutuel, le Class40 de Ian Lipinski signé David Raison, mis à l'eau, retour en vidéo | ScanVoile https://www.scanvoile.com/2019/08/credit-mutuel-class40-ian-lipinski-video-images-mise-eau-plan-raison.html
    159 Banque du Léman, a Mach40.3 design by Sam Manuard, skipper Simon Koster, to be launched to the end of august, here presented with Sam comments, with a new word to describe the bow line ! : " the important bow spatulage should allow the boat to sail above the wave when downwind"
    Des lignes extrêmes pour le futur Class40 Banque du Léman, le duo Gautier - Koster : "On a décidé de taper dans les coins" | ScanVoile https://www.scanvoile.com/2019/07/class40-construction-Manuard-Koster-gautier-Banque-du-Leman-chantier.html#.XVexTdEzWf0
    Both preparing of course the next Jacques Vabre in October.
     
  7. Dolfiman
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    Dolfiman Senior Member

    Thanks to Le Télégramme, these interesting interviews of skipper Ian Lipinsky and NA David Raison about the concept of this new class 40 design Credit Mutuel :

    Ian Lipinsky interview :
    Q : « Why a Class 40 and not an Imoca ? »
    Ian Lipinsky : « Already, I had the chance with Credit Mutuel to start from a white page, to be able to work with David Raison who had already drawn this incredible mini. To do it on a 40 feet up to the Route du Rhum 2022, it's super exciting. I do not pretend to jump immediately into an Imoca. Maybe one day but to go step by step is good too. The Class40 is another way of sailing, it is also a reasonable budget: it costs 700,000 euros for the design part, manufacture of tools and all the equipment. The operating budget is about 300,000 euros per year. »

    Q : « The Class40 rules does not allow you to make rounded bows: how did you do to hijack the problem? «
    Ian Lipinsky : « We had a 650 with extraordinary characteristics and we wanted to reproduce that in Class40. But actually, each class has its rule so we comply with while imagining a boat with similar characteristics, i.e. more power in the front, more width possible even if it is limited by the rule. »

    Q : « David Reason as an architect, it was obvious? »
    Ian Lipinsky : « Yes. All the people I work with are not there by hazard : I have woven with them very beautiful relationships in recent years. David Raison, I sailed on his boat, I know him well, I have very good relations with him. It was logical to continue with him because, sportingly speaking and in terms of performance, he has a huge expertise of these boats with a lot of volume in front. He started the concept of scows in ocean racing. He drew the Magnum, which was very good, then the Maximum, which was excellent. We saw on the 650 minis that other architects tried the same concepts but that it did not work as well. I think David Raison has a head start on this concept. »

    Q :"How would you define the Raison concept ?"
    Ian lipinsky : « My mini was very powerful, she did not heeled and even when she was heeling a little, she kept going straight. In two years of navigation, I have never go to luff, nor to « à l'abattée » (Ndt : in french, it is the contrary of luff, I don't know the term in english). It's pretty amazing. When my opponents were in waterproof suits and arrived in Martinique with buttons everywhere, I had never to put one during the transat. The 650 David Raison always had a constant speed, she would never deccelerate, she had a steady speed. And that is relaxing for the skipper but also for the structure of the boat. A boat that goes into waves, these are huge constraints for the structure, for the rigging. The idea is to reproduce the same thing with this Class40 but we can never be sure that it works »

    David Raison interview :
    Q : « What is the basic idea of this Class40? »
    David Raison : « The idea of this new Class40 is to have an easy-to-sail boat that is not too demanding for the skipper. The 40 feet are physically and mentally demanding boats. The goal is for the boat to save the skipper energy as much as possible in order to preserve his intellectual and physical potential for maneuvering. To move bags of wet sails, the setting and lowering of fore sails, it is bursting. We want this Class40 to go fast, straight on, under pilot. In short, to try to have the behavior of the Mini which made the success of Ian. »

    Q : « To reproduce a 650 in a 40 feet, it must not be simple? »
    David Raison : « For an architect, this means "trying to fit a mini in the tonnage imposed by the Class40". These boats have longitudinal lines quite pronounced, we remove the bow knuckle, that is to say the lower end of the bow to have only very flat fore waterlines, a minimum of hollows to go to the bottom, and a floatation length as reduced as possible to promote planning»

    Q : « The rounded nose seems here more pointed ... »
    David Raison : « Doing a rounded bow in a triangle is a bit of a challenge. There is a triangle
    (NdT : from the rules) o
    n the front so we managed to get our bow in there. We shortened the boat and then stretched the nose. »

    Q : « Rounded bows have proven themselves on the mini circuit. Why do you think the other classes, like the 40's and 60's, are cautious about this? »
    David Raison : « These are owner classes, it's their right. They may not want to see the boats depreciate too fast. The Class40 took three months to react when I won the Mini-Transat in 2011 but I was not a member of the Class40 at the time, I do not have to comment on this subject. In Imoca, I think they were afraid of the impact on humans with faster boats that could hit the waves more. Well, round noses are very comfortable boats upwind and that do not wet. Downwind, it will hit hard ricocheting on the waves. Well, the Imoca have foils and it's even worse! »

    Q : « Does David Reason dare more than other architects? »
    David raison : « I dare but I validate upstream. I know where I'm going. All those who have tried the curved bow boats are generally convinced so there are reasons for satisfaction. Now, in Class40, I had a big delay to catch up so I had to work. What is important is to answer the confidence of Ian Lipinski. The challenge is that Ian and his partners are happy. »

    Source : Class40. Lipinski, jamais sans Raison https://www.letelegramme.fr/voile/class40-lipinski-jamais-sans-raison-15-05-2019-12284530.php
     

  8. Dolfiman
    Joined: Aug 2017
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    Dolfiman Senior Member

    Another complementary article about the new David Raison Class 40 : as he explains, she is designed like a shorter but full scow bow (as his Mini 650 which are so successful) + a true/false triangular nose to comply with the Class rule. So an even more radical option that the previous Lift 40 from Marc Lombard (winner of the last Route du Rhum) , and interesting to compare to the next Sam Manuard Mach 40.3 ( launching is imminent) on the same line.
    As regard this curious bi colour red white of the hull, the explanation is in the picture in the gallery : that fits with jib decoration to give the Credit Mutuel logo.
    Le Class40 Crédit Mutuel — Skipper Crédit Mutuel https://skippercreditmutuel.fr/le-class40-credit-mutuel/
     
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