Free Internet Rowing Model (FIRM)

Discussion in 'Software' started by Leo Lazauskas, Oct 30, 2014.

  1. Martijn_vE
    Joined: Apr 2005
    Posts: 254
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    Location: Netherlands

    Martijn_vE Marine software developer

    Dear NoEyeDeer,

    We've actually worked quite long on the new graphics and it should be significantly improved. All graphics are now completely rendered using OpenGL which is supported by all graphics cards but each vendor has its own implementation. The only thing I can think of why your graphics look so horrible is that either your graphics card doesn't support the required version of opengl (3.0 or higher) or the drivers are perhaps outdated.

    Can you perhaps post a screenshot so I can actually see what it looks like on your computer?
    It would also be helpful if you can mention which operating system you are running and which opengl version.

    The interface has also been completely updated to support the new office like scenic ribbons. I'm sorry to hear that you're not a fan of these ribbons

    Martijn van Engeland.
     
  2. NoEyeDeer
    Joined: Jun 2010
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    Location: Australia

    NoEyeDeer Senior Member

    I'm running an nVidia GT630 card, with up to date drivers, and OpenGL 4.4. The card fully supports OpenGL 4.4. OS is W7 64 bit.

    To do a screenshot I'd have to install 7.1, then uninstall it from my box completely, then reinstall 6.27 to get me back to where I am now. I'm not inclined to do that at this time of night (it's late here).

    The gfx in 7.1 are faster, if that's what you were aiming for, but the speed seems to come at the expense of quality.

    And yes you probably can't please everyone with gui changes. I use the context menu a lot anyway, so tend to prefer that. I cbf'd scrolling to some menu when I can get the same functionality with a simple right click anywhere on the screen.

    ETA: I'd still say that the new gui does not seem to be user-friendly.

    I'll do a screenshot sometime tomorrow.
     
  3. NoEyeDeer
    Joined: Jun 2010
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    Location: Australia

    NoEyeDeer Senior Member

    Oh and while I have your attention, I find that one of the most annoying things about Delftship is when I need a few extra mesh points somewhere.

    If I subdivide the entire mesh, the control curves will still work for fairing. However, often I don't want to subdivide the whole thing. I just need one extra line of points and edges in a particular area.

    These can be added, sure, but adding them always borks the control curves so that they can no longer be used for fairing, because the addition of extra points always throws weird lumps into the control curves and there is no way of getting rid of these.

    I cannot see why it should behave like this, since I would expect that it should behave like it does during a full subdivision: the fairness of the control curves being maintained (or at least retrievable).

    Personally, I'd call this a fairly major bug for a hull design app.
     
  4. Martijn_vE
    Joined: Apr 2005
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    Location: Netherlands

    Martijn_vE Marine software developer

    Hmm, that's very strange. It would be very helpful if you could find the time to post a screenshot.
     
  5. DCockey
    Joined: Oct 2009
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    Location: Midcoast Maine

    DCockey Senior Member

    Try an older driver. Recent drivers from NVidia for their GT class cards have been causing problems with some software.
     
  6. Sailplan
    Joined: Jan 2012
    Posts: 16
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    Location: Dublin

    Sailplan Junior Member

    DelftShip Version 7

    Hi there,
    My DelftShip updated itself on Friday. At first glance I was very excited by the changes and additions though I realised it would take a little while to get used to where things had moved to. The ability to model in shaded mode and template options under the new command were both on my wish-list.

    Over the weekend the software became unstable and I submitted a support ticket. I ran through the usual unistall/reinstall/repair checks and did get it working again.

    Martijn from DelftShip was in touch first thing this morning to make sure everything was back up and running, you really couldn't ask for better support. It seems the update server was overwhelmed over the weekend.

    Everything's running perfectly now and I for one am very impressed with this upgrade.

    If you've lost your view menu in v7 look in Settings > Preferences > Auto hide view menu. This took me a while to figure out.

    Someone mentioned the Export menu being buried. It's in the top level Save Menu as a flyout.

    Hope this helps someone.
    Cheers
    Paul
     
  7. BenH
    Joined: Nov 2014
    Posts: 8
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    Location: Kansas City, KS

    BenH Junior Member

    Hi everyone. New to the forum. NoEyeDeer, when you are done putting the Saranac Laker into Delftship could I please piggy back off your efforts and get the finished file? I have the offsets from the book, but I am lousy at imputing them into the program. I have built a Grant guideboat in kevlar and fiberglass, and have the station forms in a .dxf file if anyone is interested, but keep in mind I'm an amateur at this. Also, since I didn't use wood stems I adjusted the bow and stern stations for a composite build.
     
  8. mike1
    Joined: May 2004
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    Location: Cape Town

    mike1 Junior Member

    Just to mention that I have a copy of John Garner's book,, Building Classic Small Craft.
    on the Herreshoff / Gardner 17ft there are off sets for both the original Gardner version as well as his revision 2. The revision 2 has the same water lines as 1 but a flared topside, as there was a report that the bow might be cutting into waves. This required the rower to slow down a bit .
    No Eye Deer if you would like to contact me I can help with the Offsets.
     
  9. NoEyeDeer
    Joined: Jun 2010
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    Location: Australia

    NoEyeDeer Senior Member

    Oh cool. :D Yeah I'd like a copy of those Gardner offsets. I'll PM you.

    Yes BenH, I'll be fine with anyone having a copy of the Saranac file once I finish it. I'd also be interested in looking at the Grant .dxf, but have no way of importing it into Delftship.
     
  10. NoEyeDeer
    Joined: Jun 2010
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    Location: Australia

    NoEyeDeer Senior Member

    Here's a shot of the perspective/shaded view in 6.27 vs 7.10 on my box. The 7.10 version is a lot rougher, particularly along the lap lines where it blurs things badly, and throws in white artifacts. It's also lacking the highlighting that 6.27 had. The overall effect is just less defined and more "cartoonish", for want of a better word.

    Similar things happen with the zebra shading. It's less crisp in 7.1 on my box, and basically looks like a kid's finger painting.
     

    Attached Files:

  11. NoEyeDeer
    Joined: Jun 2010
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    Location: Australia

    NoEyeDeer Senior Member

    I just had another go at getting the "good" version of the Saranac Laker back. Ended up with something else. :D

    I was just messing around fairing things up and filling out the ends a bit below the waterline to get the prismatic back to where it had been. I subdivided the mesh, and threw fairing curves at all the sections and faired it that way too. Ended up very good for fairness every which way, with the same prismatic as the lost low resistance version.

    I wasn't checking this against the Saranac Laker offsets as I went though. I was just winging it. Resistance ended up the same as David's Rushton_GB_003M model, IOW about 3% higher than the version I lost.

    However, somehow while fairing the sections I'd gained more BWL, so although it had the same resistance as the Rushton_GB_003M model (which David reckons is almost spot on the Rushton offsets) this new one has an extra 90mm added to GMT. IOW, it has a fair whack more stability for the same resistance and displacement. That's a bit of a surprise.

    Files for this one are attached. I'll have another crack at dropping stability back to Rushton levels and see how low I can get the resistance.
     
    Last edited: Nov 5, 2014
  12. BenH
    Joined: Nov 2014
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    Location: Kansas City, KS

    BenH Junior Member

    I'm at work now and don't have access to all my files, but I have an excel file of the table of offsets taken from Rushton's Saranac Laker. Probably the best numbers we'll get without measuring it ourselves. I'll see if I can dig up the Grant Virginia files tonight.

    Edit: I'm not sure about copyright issues for lines taken from historical craft and their subsequent publication, so I'm taking the offfset table down, but feel free to pm me if anyone is interested. I have offsets for Rushton's Saranac Laker and the Grant Virginia.
     
    Last edited: Nov 4, 2014
  13. NoEyeDeer
    Joined: Jun 2010
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    Location: Australia

    NoEyeDeer Senior Member

    Ok, I'm wasting too much time on this. I've attached a zip of the best so far. It's based on the offsets given for the Rushton boat, but not guaranteed to be identical to the boat in the museum. However, overall length, beam and depth are the same. It's been faired to within an inch of its life too.

    This one has the lower resistance of the model I forgot to back up (3% less than David's old Rushton_GB_003M model) but still has more stability. BMT is 23 mm greater, which adds a fair percentage to GMT on these boats. I think this is good enough for a benchmark.

    The zip contains the .fbm Delftship file, the Michlet out.mlt, and .dxf and .obj exports from Delftship. That should keep everyone happy.

    Back to working on my oars now. :)
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Nov 4, 2014
  14. BenH
    Joined: Nov 2014
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    Location: Kansas City, KS

    BenH Junior Member

    Thanks for all your hard work. This stuff is very daunting to those of us who only open Delftship a few times a year, get frustrated, and give up. I don't think anyone is going to complain about improvements. I know I wont.
     

  15. NoEyeDeer
    Joined: Jun 2010
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    Location: Australia

    NoEyeDeer Senior Member

    Thanks to Mike1, I've received the offsets for the Gardner revision of Herreshoff's 17 foot rowboat. A quick comparison tells me that the approximation I was using for my own reference is very close to the real thing, which is nice for me since it means my existing Michlet shenanigans won't be too far out. Also means my memory isn't too bad.

    I'll whip up a model of the real thing as I get time. Should have it sorted next week.
     
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