Evolvement of foiling sailboats over the last 70 years

Discussion in 'Sailboats' started by Angélique, Feb 4, 2019.

  1. Angélique
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    Angélique aka Angel (only by name)

    Recently I've read the below, what seems to me a false claim on these sailboat forums...

    Thread: yes, it is a Revolution - post #21

    ‘‘ . . . . foils themselves have evolved almost nothing in the last 70 years . . . . ’’
    New materials and new computer technology have made many developments possible in the field of sailboat hydrofoils since 1949.

    So I wonder if the poster or someone else can name any examples of pre 1949 hydrofoils on sailboats which are comparable in their performance¹ level to those of 2019.

    ¹ lifting a sailboat's hull(s) out of the water to enable lower drag and higher speeds
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2019
  2. Ad Hoc
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    Ad Hoc Naval Architect

    I wouldn't listen too much to the noise coming from Tansl. Always misguided and a desperate attempt to sound important and knowledgeable for some reason - yet always falls short.

    There is in 1938, by Americans R. Gilruth and Bill Carl:

    [​IMG]

    As for it's quality - no idea! But it is indeed a sailing boat with foils.
     
  3. OzFred
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    OzFred Senior Member

    I think the statement is hyperbole, but the sentiment is that design hasn't changed.

    I don't agree with it. If limited to single wings like those used for flapped T foils, maybe there's some support. But the huge variety of curved foils being used on multihulls completely contradicts it. Advances in materials, computer aided everything and construction techniques have led to foils that could not have been built 70 years ago, much less built to a quality that would survive use. It's likely that people imagined things similar to current foils (and a lot more), but that would have been just conjecture.
     
  4. Ad Hoc
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    Ad Hoc Naval Architect

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  5. Angélique
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    Angélique aka Angel (only by name)

    Thanks for the 1938 picture in post #2 John, as far as I can tell from the pic the foils as expected don't show the low drag of their today's counterparts.
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2019
  6. Angélique
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    Angélique aka Angel (only by name)

    I disagree with that sentiment, those who do agree best look again at eg the post #2 picture and compare it to today's versions.
     
  7. Angélique
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    Angélique aka Angel (only by name)

    Thanks John, that's a lot of info . . :)

    Evolvement of foiling sailboats over the last 70 years 1970 cover.jpg

    Evolvement of foiling sailboats over the last 70 years 1955 1.jpg

    Evolvement of foiling sailboats over the last 70 years 1955 2.jpg

    Looking at that info and to today's huge variety of foils which are tried out to fine tune for further improvement and development, I would say a lot of design changes are being made all the time.
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2019
  8. Angélique
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    Angélique aka Angel (only by name)

    So I would consider the outlandish post #1 quote to be as false as it seemed to be right away.
     
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  9. Ad Hoc
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    Ad Hoc Naval Architect

    Fully concur.
    Everything evolves, either slowly or rapidly over time...
     
  10. Angélique
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    Angélique aka Angel (only by name)

    A mistake seems to have been made, found several sources that says she's Gordon Baker’s 1955 Monitor, which correspondents with the ‘Baker’ info on the sails.

    According to several sources R. Gilruth and Bill Carl from America produced the first known sailing hydrofoil in 1938.

    Found also the post #7 cover photo boat . . :)

    Yachting World: The foiling phenomenon – how sailing boats got up on foils to go ever-faster - - Quant Boats PDF

    Quote:
    - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

    1938 – First known sailing hydrofoil was produced by Americans R. Gilruth and Bill Carl. - (no picture nor a boat name found yet)

    - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

    [​IMG]
    Gordon Baker’s Monitor

    1955 – Monitor clocked at 25 knots. She was designed by Gordon Baker and built by the Baker Manufacturing Company of Evansville, Wisconsin. The US Navy shared part of the cost of construction.

    In October 1956 she was recorded at 30.4 knots and was later said to have sailed close to 40 knots.

    - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

    [​IMG]
    David Kelper’s Williwaw

    1970 – The first hydrofoil cruiser. David Keiper’s Williwaw cruised throughout the South Pacific clocking up 20,000 miles.

    - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
     
  11. Ad Hoc
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    Ad Hoc Naval Architect

    I have the same image in my Marchaj book..but doesn't give the date.


    This:

    upload_2019-2-5_17-9-5.png

    All fascinating stuff.
     
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  12. Angélique
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    Angélique aka Angel (only by name)

    That's great info John, thanks . . :)
     
  13. Dolfiman
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    Dolfiman Senior Member

    In french, about the historical foilers : the first is said to be "1941 - Catafoil of Robert Gilruth" with drawings from his patent. The Catafoil was built in 1941, of length 3,65 m , and the first full flying sail occured in the Chesapeake Bay in 1941, W. Rockefeller on board describes the sail : "That was a very pleasant moment, we firstly sail (on hull) at about 4 knots trying to catch up with a sailboat ... After passing it, we got up on the foils. You can imagine their stunned regards when we passed about 12 knots hanging in the air".
    http://www.voiles-alternatives.com/documents/on-a-marche-surlamer.pdf
     
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  14. Angélique
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    Angélique aka Angel (only by name)

    Great info too Dolfiman, and clear photos and drawings, I'm gonna dig further into it, thanks . . :)
     

  15. Angélique
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    Angélique aka Angel (only by name)

    A little mistake in the article I think, below I've enhanced Baker into Gilruth directly below the little top left corner picture.

    Evolvement of foiling sailboats over the last 70 years Gordon Baker 1955.jpg

    Catafoil of Robert Gilruth patent drawings

    Evolvement of foiling sailboats over the last 70 years Robert Gilruth patent.jpg

    Great stuff !
     
    Last edited: Feb 7, 2019
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