Dutch Barge long distance cruisers

Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by Greenseas2, Apr 18, 2006.

  1. daveinthekeys
    Joined: Jul 2011
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    daveinthekeys New Member

    Study

    I have been following this forum since it began. i have been in search of [ for most of my life] a comfortable and stylish home on the water. having retired from the Navy i am no longer interested in long open ocean travel. but want a nice coastal cruiser like the Roi Soleil but shorter its just me and my wife. are there any plans like her? love the dutch barges but she is more my style. having allot of experiance in welding and manufacture. i want to build this in the states.
     
  2. rasorinc
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    rasorinc Senior Member

  3. Tad
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    Tad Boat Designer

  4. daveinthekeys
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    daveinthekeys New Member

    wonderfull i will contact Amazon thank you what a beutifull boat
     
  5. Wavewacker
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    Wavewacker Senior Member

    Very interesting and entertaining thread and yes they are beauties.....I'm surprised that there was never a suggestion of simply adding a flat hull below the frame, with a bit of dead rise ahead and beyond the tounge and a rounded deck astern of a good used Fleetwood! :D
     
  6. brian eiland
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    brian eiland Senior Member

    Let us know of your progress/planning/info gathering

    Brian
     
  7. Val567
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    Val567 Junior Member

    Ok GreenSeas2. You wanted thoughts on a desirable boat design for the US based on the Dutch Barge. I love this idea.

    I fall into your company's target customer base. I want a boat to live on, without having to sacrifice much.

    The ONLY way this is going to be a good idea though is if you can get a truly seaworthy boat going on though. Otherwise, might as well go with an ugly houseboat cause it is so much cheaper.

    Here is what I am trying to do:

    #1. I want a boat to travel around the entire great loop including along America's east coast.

    #2. I want a boat that can go from Florida down to the Caribbean islands.

    #3. I want a boat that can go out to Hawaii, New Zealand, Australia, and Japan.

    #4. I don't want to pay for gas. Also gas/diesel engine maintenance is too costly. I don't like sail boats because they are too expensive for their size, don't have much living space, and tilt WAY too much though. I don't like my boat being sideways, so I want to make a boat that is entirely solar / wind generator powered.

    Before you say that is impossible:

    http://www.treehugger.com/green-architecture/bauhaus-100-solar-electric-houseboat-action.html

    http://www.duckflatwoodenboats.com/mainpages/mundoo.php

    Now...

    So far I had pretty much accepted the fact that I was going to have to buy a 50ft x 14ft to 70ft x 18ft houseboat, and cover the top in solar panels, pull out the gas tank, install WAY more batteries, and replace the engines with electric ones. PLUS, I was only going to get great loop access and eastern American coast. No seaworthy -ness.

    What I am about to suggest... just start with the idea of a Dutch barge, but understand what we are going to end up with won't be able to be defined that way...

    1. Is there any reason why we can't have a V-hull to make it more seaworthy? Let's do that, and make sure the hull is tough enough with reinforcements and such so that it doesn't breath so bad.

    2. Wider. Let's go with 14-18 feet wide. A lot of the barges are too narrow for my liking. I want a middle-class house sized living room inside: 15'x20' or so. Also wider with respect to length makes it less likely to roll in tough weather.

    3. Make it so that heavy seas won't break the glass, flood your boat and sink it. Tougher windows, and altered top?

    4. If it tips over, it needs to auto-right itself. (Maybe if all the heavy batteries were in the bottom of the V-hull beneath the water line).

    5. The top is nice and flat. COVER it in solar panels mounted properly so the waves won't scrape them off. Yes, lots of batteries (they will help weigh it down).

    6. Dual electric engines. Running each at half thrust is sufficient to move the boat at a decent speed. If one breaks, max out the other one, and "cripple" your way home so you don't have to call for towing, which is expensive. There are companies that make these engines.

    Take out the old engines and gas tank. (sell them to help pay for changes)

    7. Add water distilling machine, and run it with the solar power to remove salt and other impurities for drinking / bathing / cooking water.

    In addition...

    If I am going to live on this thing, I'm American, and don't want to have to deal with less, so...

    1. I don't want to have to worry about ever hitting my head on the ceiling in any rooms. I am 6'2".

    2. I want full sized sinks, bathtub, shower, toilet, refrigerator, kitchen double sink, oven, microwave, dishwasher, clothes washer / dryer, TV.

    3. I want at least 1 open space where I can spread my arms all the way out, turn 360 degrees and not hit anything.

    4. Don't put the bed in the corner. If I am sleeping with my wife, and one of use needs to go the bathroom, don't make 1 of us climb over the other one.

    The reason I like your dutch barge idea so much is because it is about the right length / width I am looking for, looks like it could be made truly seaworthy... maybe not North Atlantic, but the areas that I described at least, AND the top appears to have the flat surface area needed for the solar panels. On top of that the horse power requirements to move it are pretty reasonable.

    I think a modified barge like you are suggesting could deliver this right? You think your company could build this? If not, can you think of another boat design that would be better suited?
     
  8. Greenseas2
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    Greenseas2 Senior Member

    Interesting reqirements

    You have interesting requirements but far beyond the scope of the thread. Best way to go to the south seas and live on a barge is ffly there and rent one.
     
  9. ben2go
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    ben2go Boat Builder Wanna Be

    The only real concern with doing the great loop is your draft in water and air draft above water.Water levels are running low in a lot of areas so that maximum GL draft is now closer to three foot. http://captainjohn.org/GL-1.html
     
  10. brian eiland
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    brian eiland Senior Member

    IMPOSSIBLE. You will not find any 'barge/canal' type vessel that will make those offshore passages,...particularly with any safety factors.

    For instance, do you happen to realize that the Caribbean Islands are almost a thousand miles to windward of the FL coast...into the trades winds?

    Have you ever experience the Mona Passage with just a little bit of weather?

    Greenseas was right...fly there and rent one.

    Or spot a couple of vessels around the world :)
    http://www.yachtforums.com/forums/yachtforums-yacht-club/18431-what-would-you-build-$600-million-lotto-ticket-4.html
     
  11. rasorinc
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    rasorinc Senior Member

    Perhaps you should look at ocean going tug boat hull designs. But for long crossings you really must have a diesel back-up engine because you can go days W/O sun and electric engines plus power usage for all those appliances will drain any size battery bank in no time at all. We have a retired sea tug captain on this forum, maybe he will chime in with some ideas. He goes by the name Yobarnacle. Also AdHoc, a N.A., may have done some of these designs and have them in his library.
     
  12. Tad
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    Tad Boat Designer

    And electric motors, controllers, batteries, charging systems, and solar panels are free and require no maintenance? And yes it is possible to make the great circle with the power source you intend, if you travel at 2 knots for 1/2 day per month. The longer voyages are not really possible....see PlanetSolar, only 585 days to get around the world, the sun does not shine on demand.......

    :eek: "I know nothing about boats or cruising but my boat will do everything and cost nothing." It doesn't really work that way.........sorry
     
  13. Ad Hoc
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    Ad Hoc Naval Architect

  14. Val567
    Joined: Aug 2012
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    Val567 Junior Member

    Look, you guys... JUST criticizing me isn't helping. If you are going to criticize, give constructive criticism with alternatives too.

    Take ben2go for example: Water levels running low. Max GL draft is currently close to 3 feet.

    Good to know. Constructive thought to be considered vs a barge. Thank you.


    Now take Ad Hoc for example: "Wow, I want some of what you're smoking; a total disconnect from reality"

    Despite the fact that there is a video of a 100% solar houseboat right there. It already exists. It's not a total disconnect from reality. Someone already built it. No it's not seaworthy, but I bet it can be built much better, tougher, stronger, faster though. Also, let me introduce you to a boat named Sun 21. Google it. It is a 100% solar boat that already made it across the Atlantic. I suppose there will always be people who will be ready to tell you, "That can't be done," though.

    Also, I don't mind 16-18 hours of battery life, and then having to sit for 3-6 days to recharge. That could probably be done if you have a 10-15 kilowatt solar panel array on top of the boat.


    Now I appreciate the thought about the barge / canal type not being able to make those kinds of trips. Thanks very much. What other type of boats have flat tops with lots of space that you could cram solar panels onto? Not trawlers obviously! Where would you put the panels? Hah! Don't just tell me what can't be done. Tell me why it won't work. Then tell me what it is going to take to do it.
     

  15. RCardozo
    Joined: Oct 2006
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    RCardozo RCardozo

    trade offs

    All boats are a whole mess of variables and trade offs. You want everything and no one can have everything. You want a Bluewater capable ship that is 100% zero energy. Of all the ship building companies in the whold w/ tons of cargo moving back and forth no one has figured this out. You are going to be the first except you don't really know what you are doing. Good Luck though.
     
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