Dutch barge for lake Ontario

Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by Jason Elliott, Aug 14, 2011.

  1. Jason Elliott
    Joined: Aug 2011
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    Location: Kingston Ontario

    Jason Elliott Junior Member

    My family and I have decided to take the plunge, Presently we live offgrid in a pair of yurts Canada. So we are used to limited space, power , and cold winters. We are considering a dutch barge style, 12 beam by 48 foot. Words of advice..or suggestions would be appreciated. BTW I am willing to build, but it would be great to get a project boat at reasonable price.
     
  2. Brian@BNE
    Joined: Jan 2010
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    Location: Brisbane, Australia

    Brian@BNE Senior Member

    Here is a pretty good site for info. http://www.barges.org/main.php?section=1707&SectionID=4

    There are links here to a number of designers and builders. You can probably find someone that can supply you with CNC CAD files to at least have a local Canadian supplier cut the steel for you. You really want to get a yard to weld, sandblast and prime for you. Even better if you could get a Canadian supplier to build to 'sailaway' stage. There's plenty of time and money required just for the fitout stage, you really don't want to get bogged down with the hull build.

    I think it would make a great off-grid solution. Why not go for 60'? Have a space on deck where you can drive a micro car on/off with some ramps.
     
  3. Jason Elliott
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    Location: Kingston Ontario

    Jason Elliott Junior Member

    Hi Brian, thanks for the response, I would love to have a 60, but the marinas around here seem to have space for 48 but not larger, I have been calling around to find out rates. As for the buildup. I would love to find someone to do the initial stage up but money says I will be welding it all myself. I do weld for a living, and I do have a good supply of steel available to me.
     
  4. Brian@BNE
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    Brian@BNE Senior Member

    Jason, I'm sure that with a well thought out layout you will be quite comfortable in 48'. Extra length allows a bit more privacy/luxury but your reasons for staying with 48' make sense.
    Good luck with the project, hope you will have some help along the way so it doesn't take too many years. Its a pretty big project!
     
  5. brian eiland
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    brian eiland Senior Member

  6. Tad
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    Tad Boat Designer

    Why a Dutch barge in Ontario?

    There are other solutions.....

    Sol48.JPG

    BellPuffer2.jpg

    Salvage1.jpg
     
  7. Tad
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    Tad Boat Designer

    Or my own submission.....flat-bottomed steel construction, full width house, folding unstayed spars, twin outboard power, twin centerboards.....

    Bargehome48.jpg
     
  8. sharpii2
    Joined: May 2004
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    Location: Michigan, USA

    sharpii2 Senior Member

    A very interesting design.

    I just don't get what the blunt ends are for. I suppose with the Thames barges, it was to get more internal volume, for light, bulky cargo, such as hay, and, possibly get greater displacement volume. But I suspect it was more the former than the latter.

    I can imagine bending that sheets of steel around the sharp turn of the bow would be no job for an amateur. I have worked with 0.125 inch plant in the stamping industry. It is no joke. It is heavy, has sharp edges, and has a vicious spring back to it.

    It appears you have finer, pointed waterlines under the bow. I don't know if a Thames barge had those. I think its bottom swept up like that of a scow, above the waterline.

    It seems like the bluff, round bow on this design is mostly an affectation and a costly one at that. Imagine butting through a head sea with that.
     
  9. Tad
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    Tad Boat Designer

    sharp...

    As Jason does not mention going anywhere internal volume (or living space as he does mention the vessel being home to some number of people) would be a design driver. As he dictated dimensions the designer is inclined to pull the midsection out to maximize that volume. Thus short ends.

    And I've bent 3/16" plate into a boat shape and believe it's entirely possible. Come-alongs, hydraulic jacks, front end loader, whatever it takes.

    Typical Thames Barges only have a chine and flat bottom amidships, their ends are very shapely with deep rounded sections in the bow and rounded sections turning concave aft.....very graceful hulls but rather complex for a sheet material build.

    I guess you could say all design is affectation.....:D......the style of your going is what it's all about.....

    This is the general shape of the design above....

    Bargehome48views.jpg
     
  10. Stumble
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    Stumble Senior Member

    Jason,

    It seems I am always the naysayer around here, but I would highly advise against building. It won't save you any money, and the time involved in the building process would be better spent doing other things unless you have a burning desire to build for the sake of building.

    I would advise instead to get on http://www.boattrader.com/ and do a search for houseboats in your area. Just a quick perusal pulled up a number of boats in the 45-48 foot range in reasonable shape for around 50,000. It may seem like a good bit, but a new build this size will be multiples of this amount, and it wouldn't be impossible to spend 50k just on the engines.

    A decent houseboat does have limitations, like limited seaworthiness, and they absolutely should not be taken off shore, but for a live aboard, river, and lake cruising they are great. And a houseboat is almost exactly what you are looking for, lots of interior volume for living accommodations, and that's about it.
     
  11. brian eiland
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    brian eiland Senior Member

    You might be in for some real surprises when you start looking at used steel houseboats built in USA. I looked thru a few...and what shoddy condition after only a few years....they are rust traps waiting to happen.
     
  12. brian eiland
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    brian eiland Senior Member

    Didn't know what a "yurt" was??
    http://www.shelter-systems.com/solor-dome.html

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yurt
     
  13. Lister

    Lister Previous Member

    Tad I like your project very much. It can be a real winner. I hope someone will jump on it.
    I know everyone will kill me, but I really don't care for the Bolger.
    You have a sense of aesthetic Bolger laked completely.
    Nobody can beat "Le Corbusier", even if Bolger tried hard.
    Lister
     
  14. Stumble
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    Stumble Senior Member

    Brian,

    The original question wasn't restricted to steel boats, that wasn't brought up until later. However if the question is restricted to just steel boats then perhaps you are right there aren't any available, but then I never looked for steel hulls.

    That being said I can't see why in this application a steel hull would be preferred over fiberglass. So long as he buys a boat as opposed to building one.
     

  15. Tad
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    Tad Boat Designer

    This is the fascinating thing about boats.....there are so many different approaches to the same issues.....The reality of what is available used in North America when you say "houseboat" is pretty awful....plastic ticky-tacky boxes poorly built and filled with fake luxury crap and foolish propulsion systems that none can afford to maintain or use.......I guess some are happy with this...but I suspect only for the 2 week summer holiday....I can't imagine actually living in such a thing.....

    For full time living one wants something that can be home....a substantial vessel with some class and the ability to carry any style interior from classic mahogany "gentleman's club" to modern loft apartment, or knotty pine country house.......

    Something like this.......still needs skylights, rigging, toerails, etc.....

    Black01.jpg
     
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