Dufour 39 (Frers) What performance can I expect

Anyone own a Dufour 39? My wife and I recently bought one. I am curious to know anyone else's experiences on this boat type. Particularily boat speed and performance. I am thinking of getting a new mainsail to speed her up but I need to know what I can expect.

 

My partner, Simon Smith, and I own a 1985 Dufour 39.

Formerly named Take 5, we purchased her in San Diego, California last August. Three cabin/one head layout, with a pilot berth to port in the main salon, and the dinette seats convert to sea berths. We're fitted with two thirty-five gallon, stainless steel, fresh water tanks, and a thirty gallon stainless diesel tank. Her Perkins 4-108 pushes her along at roughly 7 knots (GPS).

We surveyed at 18,900 pounds. We've seen 8 knots with the assymetric up, and we've got a symmetric spinnaker that we have yet to use. The previous owner, being a racer, was kind enough to outfit her with a gorgeous, 155%, genoa. Our mainsail is two years old, and a little baggie, but we 've seen 7.5 in 15-20 knots (GPS) with the combination. Above that it's a bit too much for the genoa and we switch down to a 100% jib.

Our first trip in her was a three hundred-fifty mile run north, up the California coast, around Point Conception, to her new home port; Port San Luis California; 35°10.1´N, 120°45.1´W. Four days into our trip, on our very first night at sea (ever), we found ourselves motorsailing into swells between ten and fifteen feet, with winds at 35 knots. She took every bit of it.

The Frers name attached with her design is what attracted us to her. She's essentailly a baby Swan. We're happy with her so far and have cruising in mind.

Lew Morris
D39 "Diligence"

 

one of these days I'll get all these sorted out...

 

Well I guess my mainsail must be a bit tired then. I have'nt been able to coax her past 7 yet. I know that a previous owner had her reaching at 11 knots, but that was when she was only a few years old, with brand new gear, in a blow. I would like to get her up to 8 on a reach consistlently.

We bought our boat in August of 2003. She is a 1989 boat with two heads and two cabins. Our decision to buy this boat was mainly on her ballast ratio (42%) and pedigree in design. We wanted a safe family sailor, which liked all wind conditions.

Our first sail (literaly) was the delivery from Falmouth UK to Tarbert Scotland ( about 450 miles ). She handled great. We had some quite nasty weather, with a F6 gusting 7 in the Irish sea. We surfed down some good waves, some 12 to 15 feet high. With a foul tide the irish sea can be a bit of an animal, but "Bandit" handled everything with grace. Even the little St4000 wheelpilot had no problems keeping her straight, in those firece trailing seas. It must be the design, the way her beam isn't carried farther aft, and her deep draught.

I agree on your "little swan comment". Although I have'nt seen the undersides of a frers swan 40, the top sides, freeboard, and beam/length ratio look identical.

Any idea on what her angle of vanishing stability would be?

This winter I have added Webasto heating and a gas alarm. My next job is to sand the hull, and then re-epoxy her. I am a bit paranoid of ever getting osmosis, so now that she is so dry, I thought I should go for prevention early. I think I am going to use thislebond. This is a commercial glue/resin company which has only recently started marketing to the sailboat industry. I would be keen to know your experiences with epoxy though, and if any one you know has used this thistlebond stuff ( www.thistlebond.com).

I would also be interested in knowing or seeing where your forward bulkhead is located, that separates the forepeak cabin from the area where the head is. Our boat has two heads and we are thinking of some time coverting the aft head back into a double cabin. But I need to see or know how the manufacturers placed the port aft cabin, the door and bulkhead to the forepeak cabin, and the proportions of the port cockpit lazerrette locker. I will actually be in the USA (San Jose CA) for the weekend of March 20/21 2004. So I could travel and take photos of your boat. Would this be OK? Is Port San Luis anywhere near San Jose?

Vaughn

 

Hi Vaugn,

You are only the second D39 owner we've made contact with. I'm sure they built more than three, but I can't for the life of me figure out where they all went.

Port San Luis is near, oddly enough, the city of San Luis Obispo (SLO), California. SLO (the use of the acronym is obvious if you write this name enough times...) is about one hundred and fifty miles south of San Jose on Highway 101. Port San Luis is another ten miles south of that off 101, near the beach community of Avila Beach. It's actually an international port of entry... provided you can climb the rusty, fifteen foot ladder up the side of the old pier.

My partner, Simon, and I work at the nearby power plant and will be switching over to a night-shift schedule starting that weekend, but there is probably some way that we could accommodate you. Diligence (formerly Take 5) is on a mooring out in the harbor and is accessible via the harbor's water taxi (at $6US per round trip).

In the meantime: A verbal description of the layout might be useful.

Where to start... Looking Aft from the v-berth; the v-berth door is in the bulkhead that forms the forward "wall" of the head. As you step aft from the v-berth, the head is on your right, and is fitted with a sliding door. On your left is a storage "closet"; the v-berth door latches to this closet's door, in a rather clever manner, to keep it open. The aft "wall" of the head/closet forms the forward bulkhead of the salon. This short passage is open to the salon. As I recall, the mast compression post is about three feet aft of that (passing through the table).

The dinette (or whatever you want to call it) is to your right (remember, you are looking aft), a sette/sea berth is on the left, the nav station is aft of that, and the galley is on your right. The two aft cabins are tucked under the cockpit and both are fitted with a small wash basin. The doors to these two aft berths are angled forward to accommodate the companionway and the engine which lives below it. I imagine this is a common detail between our two vessels.


Lew

 

Dufour 39 forecabin

My boat sounds quite similiar. I don't have this sliding door to the head though.

From the salon moving forward you pass thru a door into the fore area( It sounds like this door is not located here on your boat but has been moved forward ).

Once thru the door into the fore area, there are two tall lockers on the starboard side, with the doors spaced approximately 6"-8" apart. On the port side is the door to the head. There is stooped standing area approximately 3 1/2 feet long from the entrance into the fore area, until you hit the fore berth. Our fore berth is quite short, Just six feet long.

Interestingly there is a recess in the ceiling inner molding. It extends across the ceiling, and is located between the two lockers. It was here that I thought dufour would have put an additional bulkhead in, in order to change the boat to a single head, 3 cabin layout. A bulkhead here would allow one locker to be in the forecabin, and one to be in the head area. I think I'd need detailed study and pictures though before I even considered a change here. Does your boat have this ceiling recess?

I know of three other D39's as well. Unfortunately they are all much older or belong to people who live far away. One in florida is used by a charter company, the second is in the UK owned by a wildlife trust and is constantly sailing the Irish sea and northern Scotland as it monitors whale shark counts ( this says alot for the boat ), the third is another charter boat in Holland. Yours is the only boat I have a email contact to.

P.S. I have recently started to strip the cabin sole boards. You don't know of any method for removing black water stain marks from teak do you?

 

Vaughn,

I've crashed my head enough times in that low overhead area, you'd think I would remember the detail ... but I don't. And I won't be able to get out to Diligence until next Saturday or Sunday. Simon and I were looking over some photos we took while we were still in the "investigative" stage of our purchase of her. We were looking for some detail shots of the interior for you.

I was wondering if our v-berth door would not be moved back to the "forward bulkhead" of the salon to create the two-cabin layout. I was also wondering how the aft head was configured. Is part of that space converted to lazarette accessible storage? I would imagine that would limit engine accessibilty too much.

Speaking of engines.... what is yours?

Teak stains.... I don't have a clue either. Our soles are starting to look a little ratty too. We are considering a new urethane deck material that I just spotted in Professional Boatbuilder magazine. It is similar to linoleum or vinyl flooring material, but specifically for marine deck use. It would be applied over the old decking. Granted, it doesn't have that richness of texture that teak has but it does have a very "purposeful", ship-like, look to it and comes in many colors that compliment teak (and other interior materials), and three or four texture patterns (if I recall correctly... ). I've seen it in place, and it provides a VERY sure feel under foot. I have the web-address at home, I'll forward it to you later this afternoon. I may be mistaken, but I think it's made on your side of the pond.

More later mate, Lew

 

Vaughn,

I found the company on-line. Their name is Lonseal, and boy was I wrong! They'e about two hundred miles south on me in the LA area....

Check this stuff out.

http://www.lonsealspecialty.com/product-marine.html

regards,

Lew

 

Dufour 39 Layout

I have drawn a layout of my boat, and included it as an attachment.

Locker wise, we are lucky.
We have two standard aft lockers each cavernous.
We also have a bigger yet, port side lazerette locker in the cockpit. It holds the gas bottle as well. On the port side we have a shallow lazerette locker for halyards.

Our engine is Volvo 2003 43hp turbo. OK but I wish it was a Bukh or yanmar as they are cheaper to fix should it get sick.

We have an inmast furling main, but we can also hoist battened sails in it. I am not a fan of in-mast furling systems but this one is great. It is simply a self tailing winch mounted into the mast. Apparently selden's newest design is a copy of this 15 year old francespar system.

Teak decks and cockpit seats, and lovely teak gratings in the cockpit floor.

Our interior is a honey shade of teak. We have just replaced all cushions and fabric. The fabric we chose was a alcantera copy. Looks and feels like tan suede leather, but is 100% polyester, tough as nails, quite stain resistant, and cheap. Only 10 USA dollars a meter.

On the subject of my teak/holly cabin sole boards I have made some success. I am not to be quoted or held to this yet as I am not finished but:

I removed all varnish from a board : 1 hr

I wetted the surface, and then sprinkled it liberally
with bi-carbonate soda. I then mushed this into any
blackened stains, like I was sanding, with a wet
sponge. : 1/2 hour

Wipe with acetone or other de-greaser. 5 Minutes.

Allow to completely dry.

Sand surface with 100 and 200 grit paper. 25 mins.

And walah a respectable looking cabin sole board. Its appearance changes quite dramatically during the process. After removbing varnish it looks fab, very light, but black water stains are visible. After soda scrub it does'nt appear to be much better, however upon drying stains are nearly all gone. It now however looks very dull. Sanding lightens it again a bit, but a soon as you wipe it with terps to remove dust it brightens up. I now plan to coat them with three coats of West 105 epoxy at room temp 80-100 degrees farenheit. Then 3 coats satin floor varnish.

Vaughn

 

I also own a Dufour 39

Hi Vaughn

Since 1st may I am now owner of a Dufour 39 from 1983, building no 17 from the wharf in La Rochelle.

I bought the boat from a retired german captain who was sailing the boat mainly in the Netherlands. Last thursday I sailed her from Ijselmeer in the Netherlands to Copenhagen where I live. We sailed 408 nautical miles (GPS) in 3,5 days including an overnight stay in the Kiel channel.
The boat sails lovely and my family and I look forward to spending a lot of time with her.

On this site I saw your exchange of ideas and experiences with Lew Morris, and I would like to join your little network if its ok with you?

From reading the threats I can say that my boat seems to have an exact identical layout like Lews. My motor is a Perkins 4.108 50 hp with a Hurth gear. The only thing I am not satisfied with right now is the propeller (fixed 2 blade) that seems to cavitate above 2200 rpm. I consider to change it to a 3 blade folding propeller (Gori).

My family and I have been looking long time for this boat which we are only going to use for weekend and holiday sailing - no racing. Sailboat racing I do in a Finn which is much more exciting to race in. Being an experienced racing sailor I would go "nuts" to sit in a sailboat that does not sail well, but I have a good feeling the Dufour 39 will not disappoint me in this respect.

I know of no other Dufour 39 of the same kind here in Scandinavia. They seem to be more common in the mediteranian area.

Looking forward to hear from you.

Best regards

Michael Staal

PS. I dont know this forum so well and will have to experiment a little with the functionality - sorry if I get it a little wrong in the beginning.