drawing needs scale

Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by sandpiper32, Aug 28, 2014.

  1. Jammer Six

    Jammer Six Previous Member

    Rabah, I disagree.

    None of what PAR says will attract business. His claim that he doesn't solicit business here is absolutely true.
     
  2. upchurchmr
    Joined: Feb 2011
    Posts: 2,452
    Likes: 45, Points: 48, Legacy Rep: 579
    Location: Ft. Worth, Tx, USA

    upchurchmr Senior Member

    Rabah,

    It really is difficult to catch everthing being said when it is in a second language.
    I'm going to assume that is some of the problem here.

    In any forum, it is difficult to discuss difference of opinion, much less difference of fact and experience.
    Most people do not even try to provide any facts or rationale for their statements, making it hard to understand.

    In my opinion, PAR does not deal in attacks, he tries to provide his experience, and with a little discussion the facts behind his experience, which I welcome.

    In my own professional experience (not boats), there is lots of misinformation and advertising trying to say that anyone can do something technical without the education or experience. Generally that especially comes from new free software which is unproven.
     
  3. Jammer Six

    Jammer Six Previous Member

    Gonzo doesn't deal in attacks. PAR attacks whenever he isn't capable of explanation and/or feels that his opinion has been challenged. The and is a guarantee, the or a likely attack.

    I invite you to compare the two and review your opinion.

    Rabah challenged PAR's opinion. Note that this post does not judge either opinion-- it is solely about attack.
     
  4. Boat Design Net Moderator
    Joined: Feb 2010
    Posts: 422
    Likes: 61, Points: 28, Legacy Rep: 1004
    Location: www.boatdesign.net

    Boat Design Net Moderator Moderator

    Guys, let's please try and get the thread back on topic. If you find you repeatedly don't find someone's answer or opinions on the issue in the thread useful and their responses are causing you annoyance, please add them to your ignore list by clicking their username and click "Add to Ignore List." Thanks.
     
  5. Rabah
    Joined: Mar 2014
    Posts: 230
    Likes: 4, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 50
    Location: Bulgaria

    Rabah Senior Member

    Hello All,
    A little bit a material for criticism.
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Sep 16, 2014
  6. NoEyeDeer
    Joined: Jun 2010
    Posts: 977
    Likes: 29, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 300
    Location: Australia

    NoEyeDeer Senior Member

    Ok, here's a bit of constructive criticism. You are obviously having fun, which is good, and may even be learning something new, which is also good.

    However, the poor bloke in the OP only wanted to know what dimensions the sails were on the Sandpiper 32's original rig. That's the question this thread is supposed to be about. Instead of creating a huge thread full of stuff the OP does not want to know, we could always create another thread for sidetracks and keep this one focused.

    As I said, my opinion is that since the Sandpiper was a production boat it is obvious that somebody made sails for it, and it's possible that person is still in business. They should have the relevant dimensions on file. I would start by emailing all good sailmakers in the general area. The OP is going to need sails for his new rig anyway, which means he will be taking to sailmakers anyway. Might as well start now.
     
  7. PAR
    Joined: Nov 2003
    Posts: 18,071
    Likes: 355, Points: 93, Legacy Rep: 3967
    Location: Eustis, FL

    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    The OP has clearly stated and repeated by me and a few others, that he wants to convert the current cat ketch rig to a cat schooner. His initial thought was to enlarge the brochure drawing and work from that. After some discussion, he learned the plans are available for this rig on this type of boat.

    So how is drawing up his hull and an outline of a sail plan, going to help him get accurate and balanced plans for a new rig to fit on the current hull, with the associated and necessary reinforcements and re-locations, that would be necessary in a retro fit such as this? NoEyeDeer is correct, though neither the designer nor the builder are currently active, the information is available, at least in as much as a working sail plan, that lofts once worked from.

    You've proven you have some mastery of software, but none of these drawings address the needs of the OP. His needs (again) are; a cat schooner upgrade to the current cat ketch, which of course needs to balance over the hull's lateral area, hopefully without also having to revise it as well, appropriate scantlings for the spars, structural changes to support the new rig and a sail plan reflective of the free standing rig requirements (assumed).
     
  8. NoEyeDeer
    Joined: Jun 2010
    Posts: 977
    Likes: 29, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 300
    Location: Australia

    NoEyeDeer Senior Member

    I was thinking that since the OP's boat was converted from the original rig to the current one, that hopefully all the necessary (original) reinforcement would still be in place. My guess is that the current tabernacles are based on stumps that fit the original mast steps and partners.
     
  9. Jammer Six

    Jammer Six Previous Member

    I'm glad I'm here.
     
  10. PAR
    Joined: Nov 2003
    Posts: 18,071
    Likes: 355, Points: 93, Legacy Rep: 3967
    Location: Eustis, FL

    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    That's lovely Jammer, still nothing constructive to add though?

    It's possible NoEye, but typically the schooner would have it's main a bit (not a lot) further forward than the ketch's mizzen. In any case the mizzen loads would be considerably less than the schooner's main, so it would need to be beefed up at least. Other than the aesthetic considerations of the schooner, a step backwards in the performance envelop. It would be able to carry a bigger staysail though, making beam and further aft points of sail, a bit more exciting, with the schooner.
     
  11. sandpiper32
    Joined: Aug 2014
    Posts: 8
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: Seekonk Ma.

    sandpiper32 Junior Member

    I've been contacting sail lofts. No luck yet. The original partners are still there, covered up by the tabernacles, which are aluminum a frames, bolted to the cabin top and fore deck, all of which are reinforced for the original masts. They were aluminium. Since I know how, I'll build hollow, round, doug fir masts with wooden booms ala Mr. Parker with his designs. I'm now thinking of keeping the fore sail the soling main and using a larger main. Being some what of a bottom feeder, I'm hoping to find a stock main that is close in dimension and area.
     
  12. frank smith
    Joined: Oct 2009
    Posts: 980
    Likes: 14, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 185
    Location: usa

    frank smith Senior Member

    the NA is Walt Scott , I guess
    25 beachcoamer 798.jpg

    25 beachcoamer 800.jpg

    25 beachcoamer 799.jpg

    I see this is redundant info. Time to call a NA.
     
  13. frank smith
    Joined: Oct 2009
    Posts: 980
    Likes: 14, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 185
    Location: usa

    frank smith Senior Member

    It needs a junk rig!
     
  14. NoEyeDeer
    Joined: Jun 2010
    Posts: 977
    Likes: 29, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 300
    Location: Australia

    NoEyeDeer Senior Member

    Does anyone know what the original masts were made of?
     

  15. sandpiper32
    Joined: Aug 2014
    Posts: 8
    Likes: 0, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 10
    Location: Seekonk Ma.

    sandpiper32 Junior Member

Loading...
Forum posts represent the experience, opinion, and view of individual users. Boat Design Net does not necessarily endorse nor share the view of each individual post.
When making potentially dangerous or financial decisions, always employ and consult appropriate professionals. Your circumstances or experience may be different.