Do I need to visit a sawmill?

Discussion in 'Wooden Boat Building and Restoration' started by H248801, Nov 22, 2008.

  1. H248801
    Joined: Oct 2008
    Posts: 6
    Likes: 1, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 32
    Location: Lakeland, Florida U.S.A.

    H248801 Junior Member

    I have begun the process of building my first boat (Iain Oughtred's Puffin, a 10'-2' sailing dinghy) and will use the glued-lapstrake technique for construction. I plan on using white oak for the keel and laminated stem. Will it be possible to successfully create the laminated stem using epoxy or should I plan on using a different type of adhesive, or wood? Do I need to be concerned about the wood's moisture content? Should I be looking for a sawmill near Lakeland, Florida, or can I used dry-kiln lumber?

    As if I haven't asked enough newbie questions, can anyone point me in the direction of a reputable source for 6mm bs1088 okoume in Florida?

    Thanks in advance.
     
  2. PAR
    Joined: Nov 2003
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    Location: Eustis, FL

    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    There are several places for wood supplies where you are, which is about an hour and a half south of me. Your best bet for Okoume is in Vero Beach, which isn't far from you and saves shipping. The outfit is called Boat Builder's Supply, 772/770-1225 and tell Joel who sent you. Their site is WWW.boatbuildercentral.com and you'll find lots of other stuff you might need too.
     
  3. H248801
    Joined: Oct 2008
    Posts: 6
    Likes: 1, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 32
    Location: Lakeland, Florida U.S.A.

    H248801 Junior Member

    Thanks for the info Par. They're close enough that I can drive over and pick it up myself. Any input on whether I should be looking for green wood to build the keel and stem with, or whether dry-kiln lumber would suffice.

    As a follow-up, I plan on building a slightly larger sailing dinghy in the traditional manner, probably cedar planking on oak. Gotta think knowledge gained building this boat will make for a better second boat.
     
  4. marshmat
    Joined: Apr 2005
    Posts: 4,127
    Likes: 149, Points: 63, Legacy Rep: 2043
    Location: Ontario

    marshmat Senior Member

    That it certainly will.

    I'm an epoxy fan myself... but then again, I've never built a traditional wooden boat. (My current craft is a Phil Bolger glass/ply design.) Epoxy is a great material once you understand it, but it has its quirks and, like anything, can be made to fail. Some folks swear by resorcinol for laminating, others swear at it.

    Sawmills are COOL. If you have an excuse to go to one, take it!

    From what I've heard, air-dried is generally preferable to kiln-dried for boat use. Green wood can check in unpredictable ways sometimes and tends not to be dimensionally stable; I think I'd choose kiln-dried over green, and air-dried over kiln.... but I'm a long way from being any kind of expert.
     
  5. H248801
    Joined: Oct 2008
    Posts: 6
    Likes: 1, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 32
    Location: Lakeland, Florida U.S.A.

    H248801 Junior Member

    I almost feel that I need to apologize to forum members for having asked my questions before properly using the search feature of this site. Newbies as a whole, I think, owe it to established members to fully research their questions before begging for answers. No one likes to repeat the same information over and over. PAR, I now realize for instance, that you have addressed the lumber issue I poised on several previous occassions.

    I like COOL things. I gotta find a sawmill.
     
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  6. marshmat
    Joined: Apr 2005
    Posts: 4,127
    Likes: 149, Points: 63, Legacy Rep: 2043
    Location: Ontario

    marshmat Senior Member

    Points given for your courtesy and for taking the time to search the archives :) PAR is one of those experts who tosses great knowledge out left, right and centre whenever we ask, even if he's said it before.... the guy's forgotten far more about wooden boats than I'll ever learn.

    Do enjoy this project. I very much doubt it will be your last.

    Now, I gotta get me some shop space and start building things again....
     
    1 person likes this.
  7. PAR
    Joined: Nov 2003
    Posts: 19,133
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    Location: Eustis, FL

    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    For glued lapstrake, you'll want plywood planking, not solid stock. At least this is what I believe Iain had in mind when he developed the plans for Puffin.

    As for a traditional build, I've been involved in many and yes, you want naturally seasoned solid stock. The only time you'll want green (freshly cut) is for bending stock (ribs). You can use kiln dried stock in lots of areas, in some instances you might not have a choice (often the case).

    Might I suggest you use live oak for your keel and stem. It's one of the "whites", just better. It's a little heavier, but when talking about the white oaks, they're all heavy. It has an interlocking grain, which makes it much less prone to splits, checking and other ills. It's also stronger and more rot resistant.

    Yes, you can laminate the stem with oak and epoxy, especially if it's a trailer sailor. The laminations need to be very thin, no more then 3/8", preferably a 1/4". This means more in the "stack" that makes up the stem, but it's stronger and you shouldn't have the oak/epoxy bond issues common in thicker laminations. It's also important to clean the laminating stock of the tannin well, just before you apply the goo. A good scrubbing with acetone or denatured alcohol and a stiff brush will do. Perform this task literally just before you mix up the neat epoxy for wet out of the glue lines.

    On the other hand you could use plastic resin or resorcinol to glue up the stem. They have other issues related to them and require much finer fitting of the joints, big clamping pressure and can be temperature sensitive. I use them all, typically picking the one most suited for the tasks I'm asking.

    We have a number of saw mills in the area (there are three in a 30 mile radius of me) and you can get caught up in the operation, but don't get too excited. Other then an occasional appearance of some exotic stuff, you'll just see the piles of some pretty standard species. With the economy the way it is, you may find some deals or get a discounted "saw time" price, just to keep the mill running.
     
  8. H248801
    Joined: Oct 2008
    Posts: 6
    Likes: 1, Points: 0, Legacy Rep: 32
    Location: Lakeland, Florida U.S.A.

    H248801 Junior Member

    PAR, thanks for all the good info. I've a much better idea of what to look for in lumber, both for my current project and those to follow.

    I visited Mt. Dora a few weeks ago and loved the area.
     

  9. PAR
    Joined: Nov 2003
    Posts: 19,133
    Likes: 490, Points: 93, Legacy Rep: 3967
    Location: Eustis, FL

    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    I sail Lake Dora frequently, mostly because I like the ramp. It a couple of miles from the house. Many of my clients have their "pride and joy" hanging in boat houses along the shores of Lake Dora, so I can reminisce about a repair or restoration as I pass by.
     
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