Designing a boat at age 12

what type of boat do u have? and the pics are (that I would edit) of the process of bending the planks.

 

ok. kinda hard to see, but u can maximize it. theres the picture. thanks 4 showing me how to post them. this is the motor, mines going to be a little less complicated though.

 

Some boy, some...
look at my gallery............... just click my nickname and use the popup. Later the night I´ll come back with some issues about steam!
Regards
Richard

 

wow... you sure know how to build boats...

 

Nahh...... not quite..
there´s more I do´nt know.... really! The **** is, I do not know what I do not know.

 

hopefully I will be as good a boatbuilder as u r one day. boatbuilding's the thing I want to do when I'm old enough, for a job.

 

the cruel truth behind the puff puff boat: romance...

first revision in dark red
Do´nt wait until the world has killed your enthusiasm with all the "this and that does´nt work, we never did it that way" and the like! If your pocket money allows, build a boat! It can be done at your age! With some adult assisting, this for example:
http://www.bateau.com/proddetail.php?prod=FL12&cat=11
Ask this Forum, they will give you every achievable support! Use this incredible pool of knowledge! First take care to set your goal and pace at accomplishable figures.
Too many have overestimated their abilities, some of them you´ll find here. And your task will possibly take you into that society.

Now the good news: it works! and the bad: in toys only.
look at the samples you have seen, compare the scale of the "motor" with the size of the boats! ? !:idea: Some can hardly bear the weight of the apparatus.
Now you have to bear in mind, that a little boat of say 2ft length can be built easily to become very rigid and strong but still light. To achieve the same rigidity in a vessel of 10ft you will need a incredible effort. Will say to make a little model carry 5 times its weight is easy, to try that in real scale is very expensive! Although not impossible. as we see later.
We now come to the "propulsion system":
To make one liter of water to become steam you need 2.257kj of energy, producing 1,673 m³ of steam. I´ll work with rough and rounded figures now to make it easier.
The only source of energy that is as safe and efficient to be used in such application is pit coal! :!: And I mean the ONLY !!!:!:
Assuming your boat will have a weight of about 100 kg (sorry the real world uses metric system), you may have about 70 kg, the apparatus (incl. water) another 150 kg, coal for a trip 30 kg. sum 350 kg
To propel that battleship you need to produce about 0,15 m³ (1 barrel) of steam per second, as a rough minimal estimation. The boat will anyway be very slow, I guess slower than a classic rowboat!
The theory:
1 kg of pit coal heats about 10 ltr. of water to 100°C (steam). You need 1 ltr. every 10 seconds, so say roughly 1 kg of coal to be burned every minute (bearing in mind you have some serious losses, the App. is´nt hightech).
To keep a fire running constantly you will need some 10 kg of ember in your boiler, feeding 1kg coal every minute.
Having such oven in a boat needs some effort in insulation, a real heavy cast iron oven and a pretty sophisticated tubing in mild steel of 3 - 5 cm (1 1/2 to 2 inches) diameter with a sufficient wall thickness of about 3 - 4 mm! Copper melts away! Furthermore you will need a one way valve in your feeder duct. The vacuum suction does´nt work at this scale. It might, but the tubing will be very complex.
If you have all the stuff hammered together, the sampan (google that) built and the launching survived, you might notice it´s too small, you cannot take your girlfriend to the romantic places!
I appreciate very much your enthusiasm and the fact that you are willing to go unpopular ways! And if you want my opinion........ build it as a toy .. do it now.. enjoy your result and like the experience it gave you!!!!!!!!!
Until you moved to your home at the south you may think about another (big) project and develop that to maturity.
Maybe, as a steam lover, you build a steam launch with a real steam engine?
http://www.gartsideboats.com/catsteam.php#steam132
Maybe you can attract a old stoker or steam engine enthusiast like me to build you the engine while you build the boat? Then share the boat and your accumulated experience! Do´nt lough it is easy to get those old farts into a state of euphoria, I know I´m such a *****.
So, think twice if its worth to follow your plans or if it might be more enjoyable to have a real useful vessel that you can sail for the given purpose.
the romantic places as one example

And thanks to starling to open this thread and sorry that it was abused and hijacked soon!

Regards
Richard

and btw I am not a boatbuilder, I engage or employ them and sell their products. And even that as a hobby only

 

Well done Apex, I hope the nipper accepts your guidance...

 

thanks MAS, he seems to be bright, if he also has the sense to understand, he will.

 

ok. I understand what you mean. those toy boats have a pretty big engine to boat ratio, so maybe I can just use the weedeater engine in the garage with a busted gas tank. I remeber reading that the inventor of the 'pop'-'pop' engine wanted to use it on a full sized boat, or figure out how to, but it was too heavy. And by the way, what are you saying, battleship?! haha! I ain't going to have a battleship! I am just building a simple wooden boat, that was just a picture of a battleship that I posted, as a test for my ability to post pictures, kind of an expirement to see if it worked. Thanks for the advice. btw, I know what a sampan is. I don't really like fiberglass boats for some reason, but thanks anyway for that website with the 12 ft skiff. That steam launch website was pretty cool also, but a little too expensive... I know how steam engines work. These days, they r 2 expensive. I have a good website where I can buy the flywheel and cylinder, but the cylinder alone is(was) 90 us dollars, and the flywheel, (50 lb cast iron) is 80 us dollars. heres the site. go to products, then parts, and there is the flywheel and cylinder. http://tinypower.com/ wow. if I built a steam engine out of those parts, it would be a real torque monster!

 

Ahhh smart guy just wanted to test our knowledge.......................
Battleship i said because of the terrible weight of the construction you would need. As your clever designer / inventor already knows.
There is a thread here with a weedeater topic.............. find that.
Than have a look at the boatbuilder site I mentioned, make some drawings how your engine will fit in that. Come back and ask again. This boat mentioned is not a fiberglass boat you fool read the description!
Did I recommend to buy a steam engine??????
Learn to listen to the answer if you ask someone, otherwise you waste his time! Read my post again.
Let me know your steam engine website.
Regards
Richard

 

I posted a link to the steam engine website. and that boat is too expensive. sorry about that bateleship confusion. and I was just saying I could save a little more money and buy a steam engine... I only have 230 us dollars. I MIGHT be getting 100 dollars for my birthday coming up. 410 dollars is a litte over my price range.

 

Ok ok, thank you for the link.
As a first boat to be built the one I mentioned is really nice (and wooden). And 300$ ! Although time to build is closer to 50 than to 20 hrs.
http://www.bateau.com/studyplans/FL12_study.htm?prod=FL12
Later then, a steam launch is a vessel you might enjoy. At least it is always the most attractive in the parade, no matter if the local power monster has 12.000 or 8.000 hp only, the steam launch steals the observers admiration. And:
YOU cannot build a steam engine! The proper tools to do are far more expensive than th engine, let alone the skills needed.
Good luck
Richard

 

I don't really care how much time it takes to build a boat. 50 to 20 hours you say? wow. that is a very short time to me. and, I could build a steam engine if I wanted to. they sell them at tinypower.com, in fully machined kits, where all I would have to do is slap it together and voila! do you think this has the power to move at least an eight footer? http://cgi.ebay.com/Large-Vertical-...5|66:2|65:12|39:1|240:1318|301:0|293:1|294:50 I could probably get someone to machine it for me... it was 750.00 u.s dollars, but now it is 255.00 dollars...

 

1.
I cannot machine a steam engine in a professional manner! Any other way gets you in immediate trouble, steam is dangerous. And therefore a steam engine and boiler MUST be certified!
After some 40 years of experience with steam engines I would not be able if I had a lathe, a single spindle drilling machine, milling machine and all the tools EVERYONE needs to build a steam engine from cast parts. I do´nt have the skills! So you can?
2.
The engine shown on ebay is a very very lousy crafted piece of scrap! Probably a Chinese or Indian copy, hammered together in China or Zimbabwe.
Nobody in the civilized world will machine you such a engine for 500 US Rouble!
The engine is not reversible! Useless in a vessel! The guy on ebay claims it is easy to make her reversible but provides no plans or parts! He speaks nonsense!
The machinery you need for proper results will cost between 15.000$ and 25.000$! For that reason i recommended to find youself a ***** doing that for you!
Look at the prices at your steam engine shop tinypower! And they are cheap! Means probably not the highest quality!???
3.
The engine is only half of the rent.You´ll need a boiler, piping, Oil or coal bunkers and so on. That adds about another 60% to 80% of the engine price to the total amount.
4.
A steam engine of 1/4 horsepower propels easily a vessel of 16 -18 ft if light, slim and designed for that purpose. Steam engines are torque monsters! A diesel in comparison is a hairdryer, a outboard a toy. therefore:
This engine (any steam engine) cannot be used in the 12´ boat i recommended!
5.
Let the steam launch be a second task.........start with something like the 12´ boat. If you have proven your ability, reliability and endurance, you will impress some people in your neighborhood they will give a outboard for free.
6.
Stop to contradict me! I´ll otherwise bill you for my consulting service.:!:

Regards
Richard