designers dream or reality?

Discussion in 'Sailboats' started by tamkvaitis, Feb 23, 2007.

  1. tamkvaitis
    Joined: Aug 2005
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    Location: lithuania

    tamkvaitis sailor/amateur designer

    [​IMG] what do you think? is it reality or just designers dream? I think the foils should be huge to suport this much of carbon fiber. And is it worth it? the drag should be even bigger.
     
  2. Raggi_Thor
    Joined: Jan 2004
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    Location: Trondheim, NORWAY

    Raggi_Thor Nav.arch/Designer/Builder

    Looks very good :)
    Lets wait for Doug...
     
  3. chandler
    Joined: Mar 2004
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    chandler Senior Member

    If a cruiser wants to go that fast, why not just buy a motoryacht?
    So Raggi, when did you become a naval arch.?
     
  4. Vega
    Joined: Apr 2005
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    Vega Senior Member

    It seems very interesting:

    “The eXplorius Sailing Yacht is an exciting and innovative transportation concept which was awarded with the 1st prize of the Pininfarina Design Award.

    As a progressive mobility concept, the sailing yacht "eXplorius" introduces the Hydro-Foil technology to the sailing yacht class and takes an innovative approach to the traditional sailing yacht field.

    With wind speeds exceeding 10 kn, the underwater wings lift the hull of the eXplorius yacht out of water, reducing friction and displacement to a minimum.

    Gliding over the waves at sailing speeds of up to 32 kn, this yacht makes transatlantic trips for two to six "maritime jetsetters" possible”.


    http://www.dexigner.com/product/news-g10333.html


    "Arnold Freidling is a young Industrial Designer who studied at both the University of Art in Braunschweig, Germany and the California State University in Long Beach. He graduated in 2006 with high distinction after the completion of his master's thesis, the eXplorius Hydrofoil Sailing Yacht. The eXplorius was awarded 1st Prize of the Pininfarina Design Award in 2006. Arnold Freidling currently lives and works in Santa Barbara, California"
    .

    http://www.dexigner.com/directory/detail/8648/

    http://www.gizmag.com/go/6868/

    http://www.freidling.com/

    Seems interesting but I am confused. That boat, being narrow, doesn’t seem to have a big form stability. On the other hand, I can not see any ballast. So, from where comes the rightening moment needed to carry those big sails?

    The Drawings are beautiful, but that justifies an attribution of a Design award to a boat that will not work, I mean sail? I thought that Design was about drawing things that work very well, not only about beautiful drawings.

    I am missing something here?
     

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  5. Doug Lord

    Doug Lord Guest

    Explorius

    Before making any judgements I'd like to read a technical analysis by the designer. As I said in the 60' monofoiler thread regarding this boat (where it is also posted): the devil is in the details. The nice pictures raise far more questions than I've seen answers to yet.
    But one thing is for sure: the use of foils on large monohulls is not fantasy and can be done and such a monofoiler is likely to be quite fast.
    You can see how stability is addressed in the first post of the monofoiler thread-a foiler needs a lot of RM.. I'll try writing to this guy and see if he'll respond.
    ===================
    a copy of my e-mail:

    Sent e-mail message

    From: lorsail@webtv.net(Doug*Lord) Date: Sat, Feb 24, 2007, 8:51am To: website@freidling.com Subject: Explorius
    Mr. Friedling, congratulations on what appears to be a very exciting concept! There has been a thread posted on www.boatdesign.net under "Sailboats" entitled "Designers dream or reality" and I'd like to invite you to participate either in that thread or under the "60' monofoiler" thread where your concept is also posted. I and others would love to hear more about the technical apects of your design particularly in regard to righting moment.
    Sail Fast, Doug Lord
    ------X18T - www.monofoiler.com (soon)
    ------F100 - www.microsail.com
     
  6. Crag Cay
    Joined: May 2006
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    Crag Cay Senior Member

    I don't think so. There are only three essential points to consider:
    1. He was an art student
    2. He now lives in Santa Barbara, California
    3. He works for a firm called 'LifeStyleDesign'.

    Whilst I think it's good that the sometimes overly conservative world of sailing has an injection of fresh ideas from the likes of this guy and Phillipe Starck for instance, I don't think this is anymore 'realistic' than some concept cars at the motor show or ideas that surface in Popular Mechanics.

    Having said that, on the SA website at the moment, they have a piece on the uncanny resemblance between Maltese Falcon and a 'futuristic concept' boat published in PM many years ago. So perhaps one day, when I'm home on holiday from my arduous duties in the intergalactic spaceship building yard on the moon, I will get to use my 'jet pack' to nip down to the marina to take my 'foiler' for a spin around the bay.
     
  7. Chris Ostlind

    Chris Ostlind Previous Member


    Designer's prerogative, Vega... he has left out the virtual, holographic canting keel form, so that the presented line of the form can be more elegantly shown. The mechanical stuff operates in the one foot of bilge space below the main saloon deck. You know, down there with the folding sail drive and its potent drive system.

    Just wanted to let you know it was coming soon, even though Doug had no idea of its existence. ;-)

    Chris
     
  8. arnoldfreidling
    Joined: Feb 2007
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    arnoldfreidling New Member

    Hi everyone,

    I'm "that guy" who created the eXplorius sailing yacht.
    Thank you, Doug Lord, for inviting me to this lively discussion.

    This project is obviously polarizing people and I do appreciate the various discussions about it.
    My goal with this sailing yacht design was to put out a vision of a futuristic sailing boat. Not totally
    illusionary, but also not 100% solid engineered.
    Call it unrealistic dreaming, call it inspiring vision. I wanted people to rethink what they are doing right
    now and give them some suggestions of what might be possible, similar to what a show car is for.
    To turn this concept into reality it would definitely need a good chunk of refinement. And even if that
    will not happen, maybe some aspects of its design will inspire other boat builders.

    Thank you all for your comments, compliments and concerns!

    Arnold Freidling
     
  9. Vega
    Joined: Apr 2005
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    Vega Senior Member

    Arnold, you make beautiful drawings, drawings that make us dream...and that is at least half of it;)

    Do you sail?
     
  10. Raggi_Thor
    Joined: Jan 2004
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    Location: Trondheim, NORWAY

    Raggi_Thor Nav.arch/Designer/Builder

    1992/93 when I finally finished my studeies with a master thesis on CAD/CAM of wooden boats :)
     
  11. Mikey
    Joined: Sep 2004
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    Mikey Senior Member

    Welcome aboard Arnold :)

    Vega's question regarding ballast and rightening moment is very valid and an interesting subject, can you please elaborate?

    What rendering programme do you use to generate such high quality images? Or are you really using old-fashioned brushes and paint brushes? Beautiful art work :) Very Beautiful art work :) How can I do that? :)

    Mikey
     
  12. Panos_na
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    Panos_na Junior Member

    Hmmm...!

    Interesting design!

    But, I have some doubts about the stability.

    I didn't se any keel for ballast.

    And I think that neither the foils will produce the needed force to stabilize the boat , while operating with sails.
     
  13. Kitesail
    Joined: Mar 2007
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    Kitesail Junior Member

    Kite Control Systems

    Hi -
    I am in search of funding and working with people to make self-launching kite systems refined and adapted to boats for the marine industry. I have two US patents issued for launching, sheeting and cleating devices. Visit www.kitecontrolsystems.com [​IMG] Thank you, John
     
  14. Doug Lord

    Doug Lord Guest


  15. Kitesail
    Joined: Mar 2007
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    Location: White Salmon, WA

    Kitesail Junior Member

    Doug –Thanks for the links!
    Yes, I’ve been quite actively involved with the kiteboarding industry… R&D with boards, kites and control bars. The ‘up-wind’ capabilities of kites interest me greatly, and there have been significant improvements with ‘higher projected’ kites, typically less wingtip area. These types of kites offer greater AOA (angle of attack) which allow the kite to be sailed at all points of tact.

    Kites create lift and this generates early planning, which is why ‘foils’ can work so well with kitepower. It is up to you guys out there to design the ideal hull/s for kitepower. Understanding the dynamics of kites and control devices helps define the parameters.

    All for now,
    John
     
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