Dare to Say No

Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by Chris Ostlind, Nov 23, 2009.

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  1. portacruise
    Joined: Jun 2009
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    Location: USA

    portacruise Senior Member

    Wow, Rick time to look into the OZ buck if you can get 7%, nothing close in USA without big risk.

    If you can somehow make a version of your pedal craft easily transportable by air, you can add unlimited reach. Get your 10K per nut bar in other beautiful waters, if it should please you to change the scenery. Probably nothing on the rental market can come close in reliability and speed to your ideas of water transport, as you embark on unique adventures.

    "Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after." Henry David Thoreau

    Porta


     
  2. PAR
    Joined: Nov 2003
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    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    The "flat top" was (in it's day) as opulent as many of the offerings are today. Now, she may seem "tasteful", but then just as much a representation of the wealth and status of it's owner.

    Other then the rather small market of folks who truly love and enjoy boating (like those here), such as hobby fishing, skiing, sight seeing, sailing, etc., the remainder of the market is driven by folks interested in a show piece, a social phallic. Lets not forget that pleasure boating is a relatively new thing, born of booming economic times, mass production and a low rate second mortgage possibility.

    Do you think Herreshoff built pleasure craft for Bubba and his three brothers to go hand grenade fishing with? Yachts are the bread and butter of an elite crowd and the successful designer recognizes this and services reality.

    The smaller pleasure boat crowd (the Bubbas of life) buy many more boats by volume, but the amount that these bring to the corporate diner table is meager compared to the returns on the non-trailerable craft they may market.

    How many 18' bow riders with a 160 HP outdrive, does it take to equal the value of a single 50' production powerboat? Yep, that's a lot of Bubbas . . .

    I don't disagree that we have to focus client desires, I do frequently, but eventually, we all wear down. There was a time when I swore I'd never design a reverse sheer boat, but now I actually have a few and like them. I said the same thing about sugar scoop transoms, but now have a hot design that I really like, with a wide open sugar scoop and a reverse sheer. I'll hold the line on a hot tub in a 25' trailer sailor, but hell, if they toss enough money at the issue, I might be swayed again, especially now.
     
  3. Guest625101138

    Guest625101138 Previous Member

    Vic

    Why do you think the exchange rate is where it is? Almost par with USA. Our interest rates are on the rise. The retailers have reported the best start to Christmas sales on record.

    I went to Seattle and Calgary last year and had no problem having a ride in nice pedal boats. Could also go to Maine and Illinois and do the same. Also confident I could get a ride in England, France and Italy.

    I was about 25yo when I realised why I should be going fishing and bought a sailing boat. I was well over fishing by that age. I could not see much point in catch and release. A lot of what we caught in deep water had ruptured guts by the time we got it to the surface anyway - was just shark food if released. What we didn't eat was used for fertiliser. I was really spoilt in Dampier, north west Australia. I can remember being in a creek up there that was too narrow for the boat to turn and yet I was continually baiting my wife's line and pointing out what fish to catch - we could see the bottom. She did not even like fishing but we got about 70lb of pan size fish in an hour or so. Took me longer to clean them than she took to catch them. When younger we used to catch decent size snapper by the dozens. We got these just offshore on the southern Queensland coast in small runabouts.

    With sailing I was once told by a doctor to do more of it because it was the best form of relaxation. He was almost right. I have now found the best form of relaxation.

    Rick W
     

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  4. boat fan
    Joined: Sep 2008
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    boat fan Senior Member

    So PAR ..design...

    So PAR ..design a22- 25 ft version of that SwordFish please........:D


    Can`t afford the big one............:D

    It would trailer nicely , too......
     

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  5. Guest625101138

    Guest625101138 Previous Member

    How old are the boys? You might keep them interested but I felt it important for mine to try other things beyond my interests so I got involved in local sporting clubs and eventually got rid of the expensive garden gnome I had downsized to by that stage. Once they made their own choices their computers got more grunt and the games got more lifelike. Only one still plays sport but all three still game for relaxation. Their boating interest ends at being support crew for their old dad in the Murray Marathon.

    The 60 to 80 litres is OK for your weekend on the water providing the other 6.7bn people on the globe are unable to do the same thing. It would not have much future if that was the case.

    I guess my conscience has got the better of me and I do regret how wasteful I was in my younger days. If nothing else I know what I am not missing now. Many dream of doing what I have done with boats.

    Rick W
     
  6. Guest625101138

    Guest625101138 Previous Member

    When you consider profitability I was a little surprised by the price of a Hobie Mirage. In Australia the basic 8ft boat is about AUD2500. Adding a few options like paddle and car-top rack adds about AUD1000. If you want to get a sail, that will cost AUD700 for something not much bigger than a handkerchief. So not hard to get these thing up to AUD5000.

    Makes me wonder whether this is not more profitable than the luxury cruiser market. I expect they are selling the Hobies by the thousands. They are growing like rabbits here.

    Rick W
     

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  7. fcfc
    Joined: Feb 2005
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    fcfc Senior Member

    I am astonished by the lack of economic knowledge in this post .... :confused:

    How do you earn money selling things (boats or anything else) to people with no money to pay you ?

    As far as I know, the most profitable car manufacturer is Porsche , not Tata.
    And even for base workers. You d better work for Porsche than for Tata.
     
  8. boat fan
    Joined: Sep 2008
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    boat fan Senior Member

    This was about affordable , aethetically pleasing , practical.
    The builder`s question was : How do we go ( back to ) that ........?
    Not economic knowledge.Not being the ' Porsche ' of boats....

    The original post was :


     
  9. PAR
    Joined: Nov 2003
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    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    I'm sorry to hear about your Hobbie out break. You can get shots for this disorder now.

    To answer your question, it takes about 100 or so Bubba boats to pay for a quality 50' power cruiser maybe half that to cost out a cheap one.

    Considering in good times, these mid size yachts are cranked out at 50 to 100 per year, that's a lot of Bubba's.

    How do we get back to sensible designs? Triple current fuel coats for a few years.
     
  10. boat fan
    Joined: Sep 2008
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    boat fan Senior Member


    Hubba Bubba PAR :D!
    It is indeed......
     
  11. Guest625101138

    Guest625101138 Previous Member

    Attached might come as a surprise then!

    Luxury is the first thing to go when things get a bit tough. But people drink more, gamble more and still need to get around.

    Rick W
     

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  12. boat fan
    Joined: Sep 2008
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    boat fan Senior Member

    Rick , I personally would not pay $ 5000.00 for something THAT FUGLY !!!!

    ( That Hobie thing that is .....).

    That is also a lot of bubbas ( or should I say Tata`s ) Rick.....
     
  13. Guest625101138

    Guest625101138 Previous Member

    And another example of the value in volume as long as it is profitable and where it can lead. It is about positive margins and volume not price.

    I would prefer to make a million boats for $3000 each sold at 50% profit than 100 boats sold for $5,000,000 at 30% profit. The luxury boat buyer is more discerning and there are more aspiring builders trying to get there. Who competes with Hobie in their market. Hobie boats are priced at credit card level - an easy buy. No special finance needed.

    Rick
     

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  14. boat fan
    Joined: Sep 2008
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    boat fan Senior Member

    Yep ....there is money hidden there for sure. Developing market.

    Unfortunately they look it too.....
     

  15. Guest625101138

    Guest625101138 Previous Member

    A lot do pay that amount and have tremendous fun with them. They get regular use. There are web sites dedicated to Hobie fishing boats:
    http://www.hobiefishing.com.au/

    There is a bit of magic in pedaling these boats out to a fishing ground with a few like minded people. There is tremendous feeling of righteousness that owners get because of the fitness aspect, the serenity of it and the overall health benefits.

    I would be interested to know how profitable Hobie Inc is. I know there are a few retailers making money out of these boats.

    Rick W
     
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