"CRUDE" oil, an absolute must see program !!!

Discussion in 'All Things Boats & Boating' started by brian eiland, Feb 22, 2008.

  1. brian eiland
    Joined: Jun 2002
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    brian eiland Senior Member

    CO2 Omissions vs HydroCarbon Usage

    ...on another forum I offered this concern of mine

    One of my primary concerns in this debate is not so much the CO2 emmissions situation, but rather our wasteful usage of the hydrocarbon gift we've been given.

    We (particularly USA) are not being good stewards of those hydrocarbon products. We are wasting a tremendous amount on private auto transportation. There are SO MANY other products in our daily lives that depend on the hydrocarbon product, and it would be a real shame to have to cut back on them as a resulting need for more auto fuel....but this could be the future, if we fail to practice some conservartion of those resources. And thus far our US Congress has failed to enact hardly ANY conservation bills.

    I just spent 40 days in Thailand, one of the biggest auto markets in Asia. They've gone auto crazy, as will China and India, and Indonesia. If these populations adopt our model, think of the impact on the remaining oil reserves. We may not have enough for the plastics industry, let alone many others....we'll burn it all up as fuel for cars!!

    Now at least in Thailand is more fuel conservative than the USA. I would guess that 80% of their vehicles are diesel engine powered, and relatively small diesels at that. And a big number are coming on as comman rail engines that are even more efficient. Compare that to the USA...no comparison.

    I guess the point that the documentrary "Crude" made to me is that we have a finite resource of oil that we need to consider, not only in terms of an energy source, but also in the scheme of our earth's evolution.

    It can't be wrong to seriously try to limit both oil usage and CO2 emissions if we desire to leave a liveable earth to the next generation, and the next one after that.
     
  2. Frosty

    Frosty Previous Member

    Ive just come back from India and believe me you could'nt get any more cars on the road and with fuel about 25% more than Thailand they run about in very small vehicles made by Piaggio,--single diesels,---yes amuzing to us,--but why not ?

    When I was in India I bought a motorcycle. When I took it back to the Hotel many people came to look ,--all of them asked what consumption to the the liter does it get? Not one asked how big it was or fast it goes.

    The point being they are very very fuel concious.

    I think Im right in saying the airbus 380 uses 11 tons per hour. Sounds a lot does'nt it but im sure thats what the Chinese Singapore airpilot said on the BBc the other day.

    If Emirates has ordered 40 of them!!! that alone is 400 tons of burnt fuel per hour in the sky.


    1000 Americans own 900 cars, 1000 chinese own 9 cars. (someone told me that yesterday, I will ask for verification of the information if it is challenged).
     
  3. Sean Herron
    Joined: May 2004
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    Sean Herron Senior Member

    Weird...

    Hello...

    I got into carving roses from radishes - I got into it man - imagine a blue collar - sore *** lower back - knees all F'cked up - white guy listening to ZZ top - carving radie roses for some **** salad - just wanting to go to the range and pump off a few rounds...

    I am trying to be a good man - but it gets under my skin...

    Hell - we need some prison footage for whats her face - Martha..

    Thing is - I am tired of my hate - it wears me down - this is a real point - my hate wears my tread thin - it is up to me to find some HOPE - and make good..

    SH.
     
  4. the1much
    Joined: Jul 2007
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    Location: maine

    the1much hippie dreams

    i say we jus shoot ourselves now,,,,least we'll get the peace of mind knowing at least who killed us and is responsible ;)
    and frosty,,,i just moved down south here on the border a few years ago,,,talk bout fuel usage at rates unbelievable to most us,,,i looked cross into mexico yesterday,,,and saw a station wagon pulled by 25 mules carring 47 1/2 mexicans ;)
    ( texas joke,,,,,how come there was only 3000 mexicans at the alimo?,,,,,they only had 3 station wagons ;) )
     
  5. the1much
    Joined: Jul 2007
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    Location: maine

    the1much hippie dreams

    well ya,,,,,time is money,,,,and i have none ;)
     
  6. Sean Herron
    Joined: May 2004
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    Sean Herron Senior Member

    I Want Your BBQ

    Hello...

    ARE YOU OK MAN...

    I am sure there is some American English smoldering in the back of your head...

    LET IT ALL OUT...

    SH.
     
  7. Frosty

    Frosty Previous Member

    The much --I see youve got 454 points thats a nice round Chevrolet kind of number. But anyway you'lle be ok in Texas, oil is bubbling on the surface there isn it?

    I remember seeing a 'small film about this guy out one day a hunting for some food, and up from the ground come a bubbling crude, oil that is, liquid gold. Well the first thing you know old Jeds a millionare, the kin folks say 'Jed move away from there' ,they said Californy is the place you aughta be, so the loaded up the truck and they moved to Beverlee.

    Oh,-- Whats his name?---- Clampet! Yeah thats it,--hows he doing?

    Texan without money ,--yeah
     
  8. milliken
    Joined: Jan 2008
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    Location: cleveland

    milliken New Member

    I've spent 20 or so years of my life working in advanced energy generation and efficiency / pollution reduction. I've worked with small companies, big companies, and Universities. "Energy" and the production of power is at the heart of our food production, the heart of our mobility, the heart of our communication, the heart of our economy, and literally, the heart of 'man's control over his environment.

    Over the last few years, I've grown to believe that the discussion has been so dominated but FUD - Fear, Uncertainty, and Doubt - for so long that no reasonable conversation can be conducted. People 'know' too much and have formed opinion based on numbers, ideas, and facts, that are, themselves, simply guesses.

    To that end, one of the most personally 'enlightening' experiences in my life was to discover the 'source' of some of the data in a CRC Handbook of Chemistry and Physics. I was looking up a thermal conductivity and thermal expansion for a new material. I found the data that I was looking for and called up a University professor in knew was working in the field. After talking a bit, I came to learn that his graduate student was THE SOURCE for the data in the CRC. Cool! I then talked to the graduate student and he showed me the sample that was used.

    Yes, THE SAMPLE. As in one piece of ceramic about the size of an eraser. It turned out that he had only made one sample from some old reagents. He'd hand mixed the components, sintered it, cut it, x-rayed it, measured properties, etc. He wrote four papers, submitted them for publication, gave his sample to a friend who then measured it and published another paper or two.

    A SAMPLE. Made once. By one guy. Looking to get his degree and get out of school. And thus the 'fact' was created. What it taught me was to understand that sometimes 'facts' come about from sources that may or may not be truly represenative of the whole. That doesn't mean he was wrong. Sometime, if you're ever curious and really bored, look up the 'electrical conductivity' of aluminium oxide (Al2O3). It's always a funny example because, dispite being a 'simple material' that has been evaluated by hundreds of researchers, the "accepted" electrical conductivity measurement changes by almost SEVEN ORDERS OF MAGNITUDE depending on the year. The preponderance of data has settled on a more or less a 'commonly accepted value' but the variation itself is really amusing.

    Undeniably, humanity is consuming carbon fuel and putting CO2 into the air in a measureable quantity. Undeniably, that effort will continue and will chip away at the convenient and readily available supply. Undeniably, the earth will create a new equilibrium to accommodate the increased CO2 levels. The ultimate impact on human population is unknowable because of the complexity of the interactions.

    Just something to think about the next time you 'know' something. Less yelling and more listening can sometimes help.
     
  9. Guest625101138

    Guest625101138 Previous Member


    V2 rocket got into space in 1942. It was 27 years later that the US put a man on the moon. More like 30 years than 9 years. Support my point about the time required.

    You have a more optimistic view of mankind than me. I see very little effort directed at conservation. Unless it hits the hip pocket there is little incentive to change.

    My proposition is that there is so much momentum toward rampant consumtion of hydrocarbons that there is no way voluntary conservation will work. The USA is the model that most undeveloped countries aspire to.

    No point in worrying about it or trying to change views here. Just do what you can to reduce reliance - sailing boats have to be one avenue for reduced consumption. I do see a few people on this forum wanting to convert their planing gas guzzlers to efficient displacement boats but this is simply hip pocket.

    If voluntary conservation was to work you would need to see a huge and powerful movement in that direction now - I don't see it. It will be the hip pocket that forces the change as the demand continues and the stuff runs out. Prices will go up. Those that have it will become enormously wealthy and those that don't will need to redirect their economies.

    Rick W.
     
  10. Frosty

    Frosty Previous Member

    Oh,--- I was just going to say that!!

    Mathmatics will not save us ,--about time for some common sence, Sigh dont hold your breath.

    Ive never seen these two abilities in the one person.

    So who do you listen too ,--the quantum physics proffesor or the Taxi driver. The answer is both. Oh and you too!!

    The problem is there is no answer, only history will tell us that we were right or wrong . How can we know what to do, we have never had this problem before.

    I remember some big guy saying "fire your arrows straight up into the air"
    Oh-- good idea.

    Bit of common sence might have helped a bit there.
     
  11. Frosty

    Frosty Previous Member

    [QUOTE
    You have a more optimistic view of mankind than me. I see very little effort directed at conservation. Unless it hits the hip pocket there is little incentive to change. Rick W.[/QUOTE]


    I suppose we could try pessimism, and not talking about it. That might help.
     
  12. LP
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    LP Flying Boatman

  13. the1much
    Joined: Jul 2007
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    Location: maine

    the1much hippie dreams

    first of all frosty,,,,,,i aint no freakin "texan" hehe,,,,these people still think somehow they won the revolutionary war,,,,,i keep reminding them of that wooden submarine they built to win the war,,hahhahaa
    and for these people to get oil,,,,they have to pump 300 barrels of brine water,,,bout 5 barrels of parifen wax,,jus to get 1 barrel of crude oil,,,,and these big smart oil companies pay me $75 a day for a big "barrel" on a trailer that seperates the oil,gas,and water and tells them how much of each they got,,hahahahhaa.
    oooo on the effort,,,,,,compared to the "effort" to kill ourselves,,,,there is basically nothing being done,,,,,,is like 1 dude bailing out a boat,,and 198 dudes bailing it in. even tho the efforts of the 1 is great,,appreciated,,,and very commendable,,,i have a feelin they gonna drown
    as for the back of my head,and english,,,,trust me there aint nuffin dere ;)
     
  14. brian eiland
    Joined: Jun 2002
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    brian eiland Senior Member

    Video references for Crude

    The problem with that video source is the 'streaming feature' is screwed up and results in broken sound thru-out.

    My reference site at posting #4 works better although it has its own problems for the first 2 minutes....you need to turn up the volumn.
     

  15. brian eiland
    Joined: Jun 2002
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    Location: St Augustine Fl, Thailand

    brian eiland Senior Member

    Do you argue for argument's sake?

    There was no goal of putting a man on the moon in 1942. That goal was defined by President Kennedy in 1961, and was realized by 1969. This nine year period does not support your 30 year figure.

    At the time Pres Kennedy made this goal, we were very little beyond the stage of playing around with the old German V2 technology. That was my point.
     
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