crowther 10 hull refit: how much ?

Discussion in 'Multihulls' started by guzzis3, Jan 16, 2012.

  1. sabahcat
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    sabahcat Senior Member

    Seawind 31

    So very easy to raise the boom a bit, pull a nice cabin across built from polycore or foam, get rid of the existing rudders and put a set of steps on with nice balanced spades getting it to look more like this
    http://www.yachtandboat.com.au/classifieds/ad/13083/seawind-1000xl-play-on-cruising-yachts-nsw

    Keep the weight out and she's a nice budget cruiser
    It is a boat you could improve on for little cost when your ready for the next step up
    This sort of mod has been done to numerous windspeeds over the years.
     
  2. guzzis3
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    guzzis3 Senior Member

    Sabahcat: Which boat are you referring to ?

    You could certainly do that with the F1 but how much would building that bridgedeck cost ? The F1 starts $7k less than the seawind asking price and it looks in better order.

    Redreuben: Yes the pod. There would only be the two of us onboard. The cockpit is only 4' long so a 4 seater. There are single setees in the hulls. Hulls are only 900 wide so not enough for facing seats. I know this is a potential problem, but you will see socialising and accomodating many people specifically missing from my list above. I view the mitchell as a sort of 8 - 9 meter boat with long hulls. Sounds odd but you get what I mean.

    I am really specifically looking for a boat for 1 - 2 people for coastal cruising.

    Anyway again thank you all for the thoughts. :D
     
  3. sabahcat
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    sabahcat Senior Member

    Seawind 31

    a few grand if you can do the work yourself
     
  4. guzzis3
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    guzzis3 Senior Member

    I had another look at the simpson. I had asked previously if the length was correct and was assured it was, now it shows 8 meters/26'.

    Apparently brokers charge 10%. Sigh.
     
  5. neville2006
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    neville2006 Junior Member

    Sure Damian, I didn't mean to come across all defensive about the Seawind...I don't have any stake in it, or selling it...just a past owner who would like to see it get off the mooring and go to a good home.
    Don't think there would be any structural issues, I only sold it about 4 1/2 yrs ago and, due to unfortunate set of medical and work issues the current owner has not used it since.
    Probably would need new rigging, (3 shroud rotating rig)...some might not bother as it looked good when I had it, but I would feel more comfortable out there knowing the age of it... and motor service etc, new batts. Clean the bird do off and needs a good scrub underwater.
    Has a proper marine head and shower (plumbed for hot water but no hot water system), the porta-potty is actually in the foward bedroom...which also could show that you could extend that berth easily...pressure water, newer anchor winch (remote) with big SARCA anchor,
    Haven't been on board for about a year but it was dry inside then.
    Yep if you wanted to extend the hulls down the track she would sail cleaner for sure...the last 2 built were extended...Shiralee had long extensions at construction and had 2 outboards...somewhere in Indonesia now I think.
    Having said that, the existing transom swing rudder design is simple and balanced; they over-rotate foward to give foward balance to the rudders.
     
  6. guzzis3
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    guzzis3 Senior Member

    Please understand there was no hostility in my response. Unfortunately without the aid of body language and voice I have learned that I come across sometimes as abrupt in type. Rather I was attempting to clarify how I see the situation.

    The boat would be nice, but I struggle to see value in the asking prices of a lot of this stuff. If you list off the 3 or 4 boats I see as representing good value right now boats like the seawind and that crowther open deck 10 look about double what I'd pay for them.

    For example if you could have the woods gypsy for $25k or whatever he would take on his asking price, then I see the 31 as probably a $30k boat assuming there aren't too many bills. A re-rig, clean and tidy sounds simple if you say it fast but it can be thousands real quick. If that simpson in tassy could be had for $30, or closer to the 35 asking that's a lot of boat for that money. Ok there are issues, some are a problem some don't worry me (like the rig), but again I struggle to add 15-20k for foam, no pod or bridgedeck.

    I have no doubt I'd be happy with the seawind and could make it work for me, but the $ aren't there right now. As long as that gypsy is sitting there unsold I am asking myself how much of a premium do I put on glass.

    As I have said previously I thank you all for your comments and appreciate the input. It has been valuable for my contemplations. I won't get the perfect boat, and it helps considering what compromises I am really willing to make.

    By the way is anyone else PO'd that if we register a boat nationally we still have to register it in your home state. No one else has to do that, trucks, aircraft....
     
  7. neville2006
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    neville2006 Junior Member

    Yeah there seems to be a real hole in the market between an older second hand cat at $250k and the ones you are looking at. Why is nobody else looking at these boats? Why does everyone seem to think you need to spend big bucks to get a boat that will take a couple or small family coastal cruising?
    The multihull fraternity seems to be getting browbeaten into believing we need big expensive full bridgedeck cats with big diesels, gen-sets, washing machines and airconditioning. Don't get me wrong, I would love to have one, but can't justify the spend.
    What is it in particular about bridgedeck accom that is a must?
    Sure, if you don't use that space it might not be the most efficient packaging but...am I wrong or are there still plenty of people out there cruising in MONOs?
    Personally I liked the open bridgedeck with two cockpits, as long as you can get some shade...boom tent...biminis, whatever same as every other mono out there that didn't pay $250k
    I'm probably the only one, but if someone was to start producing a longer version of the Seawind 31...say about 41-42' with the same other hull dimensions and composite beams I would be interested. There would be room for a head in each hull and bigger bunks and with the extra waterline she would fly. And one economic hull mould.
    Nobody would build it because nobody wants one!

    And I agree with you about the registration. In VIC boat reg is handled by VIC Roads and you can't transfer the boat registration to an interstate buyer unless they have a VIC (car) drivers licence. Also my NSW buyer had some issue because they had to SIGHT the boat in NSW to register it there, and needed a mooring to register it.
     
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  8. guzzis3
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    guzzis3 Senior Member

    The two large hulls thing is something I have thought about. It is worth pointing to the comment on Richard Woods sight about thinking hard about a boat over 40':

    The over 40ft range of designs comprise both open and bridge deck cabin boats. All these designs are more suited for offshore sailing. We do not recommend home builders to attempt a boat over 40 ft unless experienced and want a boat for charter or long term cruising. Most families will find that boats under 40 ft will comfortably meet their needs.

    For coastal cruising, that is blue water but not self sufficient nor away from land for mare than a few days or a week, I have always thought 30' was perfectly adequate. Smallest boat that'll do it rather than the biggest you can afford and all that.

    But the market is probably 4 kinds of buyers.

    The executive market I imagine buy most of the big $ boats. These people are concerned with prestige at the marina not actually sailing.

    The beginners, the sailing equivalent of the grey nomads, are easily lead by salespeople unfortunately and will get taken for all the money they can spend.

    The third group are the partners, wives, girlfriends, who are not interested in sailing but participating for the sake of the spouse. They are all about the accommodations, that's where your bridgedeck market comes in. No exposure to salt or prying eyes crossing from one hull to the other, and look at that lovely dinette.

    Finally there is me, and probably you. I have a partner, but she is quite reasonable, however I want her to be comfortable. You know when your knocked down with a really bad flu ? She's had that every day for 10 years. She doesn't complain much and she deserves a decent bed. Me ? All I care about is somewhere to sleep, a head of some sort and somewhere to fix some sort of meal. I don't mind getting wet and cold, bounced about, the trip time blowing out. All part of the fun. An F24 (for example) would do me fine although I do prefer cats..

    The mitchell would do me perfectly but I think the money and aggravation of bringing it across is going to swamp me. I haven't run hard numbers yet but it's looking grim. Hopefully I'll get some numbers together this week. So far I know customs/quarantine will sting me $5kish. There is some fitout for an ocean crossing, and I have no idea how much it costs to get a professional inspection of a rig, most of the rest I can price. Australian rego is $1190 now. I assume the offer I make on it is less than he will want and that's fair enough.

    In hindsight (wonderful thing that) I probably should have bought the racing cat that came up on the gold coast about 6 months ago. Sort of a grainger 305 style of thing (of foam 9m GBE if you like). Asking $20k and I think it even had a trailer. With a pod and a basic fitout it might have done me a treat. Suppose I'll never know.

    I am surprised NSW had to see the boat and even more surprised they required a mooring. What if you've got a marina berth ? or store it on hardstand ? What about tinnies and trailer yachts ?

    I am surprise no one has organised a petition to the state governments to fix this. One should not have to register the same vessel twice.

    Anyway.
     
  9. guzzis3
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    guzzis3 Senior Member

  10. redreuben
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    redreuben redreuben

    That Parallax looks awfully good value !
     
  11. waikikin
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    waikikin Senior Member

  12. guzzis3
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    guzzis3 Senior Member

    redreuben: That's what I thought, looks tidy too.

    waikikin: I haven't had time. Spent 4 hours today listing stuff on ebay, including the J5 :)

    Yeah that crowther is a nice boat, although a bit scruffy, my issue is the price. If you assume both sellers will drop the same amount then for $5k more you get IMO a much nicer boat (parrallax).

    Also remember the mitchell, while a bit odd, could definitely be landed for less than $70k, a lot less. Might not be everyone's cup of tea but remember $47500NZ is about $36000AU. That's the ASKING price. Say it cost $20k to land that's $56k for a "small" 11 meter cat.

    As I say the reason I'm looking NOW is there seem to be interesting and well priced boats coming on the market in numbers.

    Thank you for the comments.
     
  13. redreuben
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    redreuben redreuben

    Guzzis3,
    Given your partners condition, the Mitchell is out of the question for mine.
    Her bed/retreat on deck ? Nuh, ain't going to work mate ! Find a boat with berths in hulls, close to all the conveniences, like a warmer top, a drink, the head, another book etc. Otherwise it will be you going up, down, up, down etc !
     
  14. guzzis3
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    guzzis3 Senior Member

    I hear you, but she is pretty good. One of the reasons I've kept her is that while she exhibits female traits she is very much more reasonable than a lot of them. A good woman is a precious thing and a bad one, well your best off topping yourself.

    It'd be nice to find something more convenient along the lines you suggest, but to get a big enough bed in a hull it's got to be a big hull (or have some side flare like the simpson and parallax), and as we discussed above when you add a bridgedeck you add a lot of $ expectation from the sellers. I've heard all the arguments about berths but I truly believe we need a 4'6" double minimum. We are not tall but I'm rather wide and apparently I do a good impression of a furnace when sleeping (and apparently a fog horn to boot). 3' "doubles" just aren't going to cut it.

    The parallax is a really nice thing, might have to look into that, but meanwhile I want to sort out the mitchell. It's grown on me :)
     

  15. sabahcat
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    sabahcat Senior Member

    Thats why I was thinking the seawind 31 and pulling a low bridgedeck cabin across.

    I had a layout similar to a seawind 850 - Parallax 9 in the last boat.
    I pulled a low cabin across and put a full queen sized bed on the bridgedeck panel
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
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