Cost Of Traditional Wood Build Vs Various Modern Techniques

Go. but go now......

 

Boston, what you really wants.
When I have to go on the water on a budget, I don't care I will even go steel fastener if needed by my bank account (And I did it)
Guess what, it works.
Do what you have to do to built fast, dirty, solid and cheap.
And the design can be beautiful. Why not. Cheap is not the attribute of ugliness, it is just the incompetence of the designer.
Do not have misconception.
The rest is details and semantics.
As say Richard: Go now.
Daniel

 

sorry dskira, cannot agree on the steel fasteners idea.....you still have to sell it one day, and what if you decide that you like your boat and want to keep it......relying on steel fasteners in the sea is not a good idea at all....you have my permission to remove the comment.....I am sure that you are not that silly.

 

I am not silly and it was done for century. They are silly? no of course.
If you start by thinking of resale value, you are dead in the water. It is the worst situation for NOT doing the boat, and for doing NOTHING.
The boat is for you. If not it is an other ballgame, a complete different situation.
And no, I don't remove a post when I know the result.
Did you do it for commenting (the steel fastening)?
And do you know how to do it (the steel fastening)?

Daniel

 

And don't go with: but it was iron.

 

Im sure the aesthetic appeal of any boat is purely a personal call and not necessarily based on how much the build cost

what Im after is carefully designing a strong and efficient structure and getting it to the water as soon as its critical systems are in place. Doesn't mean I want to rush things or that I'll cut corners, Tads point about fasteners kinda woke me up to how much I'll save if I run even just the bolts myself ( they are really easy )

everyone seems to want me to rush into things and its just not my style whenever I build something complex. I prefer to do a lot of homework until I feel completely confident in what Im up to. The boat build is definetly one of my more complex projects and regardless of how much homework I sink into it still needs to me checked by someone of real experience in precisely the type of build Im after. Its not a rush job by any means until I actually have prints in hand and a pile of materials ready to go. Thats where organization and experience in woodworking will come into play and thats one reason a more traditional build is going to be my best option.

I also dont like starting projects untill I have all the funding in place to finish, its not the norm but look how many people never finish something they start. Not my style either. One good year like I used to have and this thing could be sitting in a pile just waiting to get put together. Oh the opportunities lost.

for those who seem to be getting impatient for me to start I must say I appreciate all the encouragement but the stark reality is I've got at least another year of design and corrections to be working on. Then I'll need one of the more sober souls amongst the croud to double check all my work and we can go from there but in the mean time I just want to thank everyone for all the help and all Ive learned over the last two years

you are all helping me realize a childhood dream while Im still young enough to enjoy it

speaking of which I got that first bike ride in today. Rode about 40 miles, my legs held up no problem but my *** is killing me, I need a new seat I guess. Lungs did well and hands are ok, they get tired of being under the pressure of the biking position for to long. I'll ride almost everyday 40~50 miles untill I feel like Im over the winter sloth and then Ill tone it down some.

thanks again peeps
B

 

Oh yeah! Know what you mean!

I got out for my first paddle of the year a few days ago. I had to push through the last of the winter ice to get out of the river and into the lake. The wind had jammed it underneath the bridge and it took several tries to find a place that was soft enough to yield without the kayak riding up and onto the ice, which is a bad thing unless the paddler likes swimming in freezing water ...

Worth every stroke, though, and did not feel at all cold once I got going. The damn geese are noisy at this time of year though.

 

Ya I took the bike path down by the river. No ice although it did snow just the other day.

I was surprised it was the seat that killed me. my legs are not even remotely feeling it and my lungs are good. My *** on the other hand is not happy at all. I gotta get a new seat and fast.

so Im coming to the conclusion that a largely traditional build but with doudle diagonal and epoxy between layers planking is going to be the way to go
silicon bronze screwed over a white oak stringers ( I got a bunch already out in the back yard )
I really liked Tads Idea of the sandwich skin, I think he mentioned 4 layers though which will take more epoxy. Doug fir over red cedar, dam I hate Dougy though. I've worked with that crap way to many times to have much of an opinion about it. I might keep looking for something to take the place of the Dougy. Stan suggested another pine that I need to look into more closely.

hmmmmmm

 

Around these parts doug fir is well thought of. The good stuff is harder to source but still readily available. You must have slim pickins in the Rockies.

 

we get a lot of stuff from Oregon around here, its supposed to be the best but it sucks to tell you the truth. stuff splits when you nail it, never stays straight and occasionally when it does go south on you it will take a whole wall or floor with it. It splinters badly, doesn't plane well at all, is full of sap pockets and is heavy as all hell.

I've never understood why the boating industry loves the stuff when its such crap wood to work with

I think its based on tradition more than anything

stuff was everywhere and comes in huge sizes sooooo
the boat building industry convinced itself that even though the **** has poor rot resistance and incredibly inconsistent strength characteristics its great stuff to use building a boat

after using Dougy for roughly 30+ years its the last wood I would chose for a boat build intended to last

 

LOL,
You evidently aren't aquainted with good material. Many of the charactoristics you describe sound more like hemlock than fir. The good stuff is hard to source but not that hard. Maybe they just send the crap to the Rockies because it won't sell where it comes from.

It is also evident you're not aquainted with the actual boats built with fir. It's not as long lived as some other woods but old growth fir has a decent enough reputation used and maintained wisely.

I can't imagine why you're having problems framing with it. Your problems are not representative of the material that is standard here in Pugetropolis. We use hem/fir on a budget and doug fir for quality work. Beams are almost always doug fir if of sawn stock or gluelams. Either is superior to the manufactored parralam type stuff in real world field conditions.

You may think you're comparing apples to apples, but your apples ain't the equal of our apples!

 

I went round and round about this over on the wooden boat forum

the short story is that as a kid I watched my old grand dad Robby used mahogany to do all his planking. We often had boats there that had been repaired not 10 or 15 years earlier in Dougy and I remember old Robby always talking about how worthless the stuff is as he cut up what he could for fire wood

my working experience with Dougy may be old but I remember how badly that stuff held up and I sure wouldn't want to have to replank my boat every 10 or 15 years

the longer and more detailed explanation is best found in a post I made over at WBMF

 

oh and someone mentioned something about glass

this is me a while ago sealing the cladding ( made myself ) to the low E insulated glass ( made myself ) over the conservatory ( made myself although I did not design it )



whats funny that I just noticed is that although I darken up like an indian my *** is white as a ghost

goofy looking I know

 

There's a simple cure for that but not recommended if you're building in the city or posting photos of yourself ...

 

But not that pervert you thinking Just cold enough to avoid any contact to sunlight..