Convert No-EPA fuel tank to EPA

Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by Cacciatore, Sep 24, 2021.

  1. Cacciatore
    Joined: Oct 2008
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    Cacciatore Junior Member

    Hi Guys , are there components to convert a No-EPA ''PERMANENT'' fuel tank to EPA ?
    The permanent tanks are in rotomolding plastic .

    Thanks in advance
     
  2. fallguy
    Joined: Dec 2016
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    fallguy Senior Member

    You are going to need to expound on the permanent tank in place. As far as I understand, the EPA approval is for a certain material and thickness. Basically, they want to stop fuel from escaping.

    But, you can't change the plastic in a old plastic tank.

    You can change the lines to something better.
     
  3. DCockey
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    DCockey Senior Member

    Do you want to convert fittings, add a vapor recovery system, or decrease the permeability of the tank? Are the changes need for legal reasons?
     
  4. Cacciatore
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    Cacciatore Junior Member

    Thanks for reply. The reason is only to import European boat in U. S. A.
     
  5. DCockey
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    DCockey Senior Member

    fallguy and bajansailor like this.
  6. Ike
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    Ike Senior Member

    David is right. However, some questions about the boat need to be answered. Is this a privately owned boat? Is the boat owner importing it for their own use? If so they may not have to upgrade it. Specifically if the boat was constructed before the EPA regulations went into affect and it is not being imported for the purpose of selling it, then it doesn't have to meet EPA evaporative fuel standards. However, if it is being imported for the purpose of sale then you need to talk to the Coast Guard about what changes you may have to make. email Jeff Ludwig at USCG HQ. jeffrey.a.ludwig@uscg.mil
     
  7. philSweet
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    philSweet Senior Member

    And please let us know how you get on with the USCG. I would expect that if the boat was compliant with EU requirements when built, and was available for sale in the EU, that the USCG will have some system in place to handle this. But I've been wrong before. Fuel systems are one of the things they are supposed to be persnickety about.
     
  8. Cacciatore
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    Cacciatore Junior Member

    Thanks ,just sent an email to USCG . I will paste the reply on the matter. I suppose that Ike is right there will be a difference of procedure based on private importer and on U.S. local dealer.
     
  9. Cacciatore
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    Cacciatore Junior Member

    Hi Guys i have received a reply from Coast Guard but i am more perplexed than before. Why exist fuel tank companies like Moeller Marine that produce in rotomolding for US.Market and are not EPA compliant ?
    The EPA compliant is mandatory or optional ? Because i my boat i am using nice looking design fuel inlet and i know only 1 fuel inlet in plastic by Perko EPA compliant that not match so much with the design of the whole boat....and i should create a locker like car's fuel inlet.



    "The short answer to this is that all boats gasoline fuel systems sold in the United States need to comply with the US EPA regulations found in 40 CFR 1060. Compliance with USCG regulations or issuance of a MIC by the Coast Guard does not imply or guarantee compliance with the EPA.
    Compliance to Coast Guard regulations for non-metallic tanks may be found in 33 CFR 183 Subpart J. Additionally, you may look at the “Boat Builders Handbook” found at www.safeafloat.com, for a layman’s description on how you comply with the USCG regulations.
    For specific questions regarding EPA compliance and what documentation is needed you would need to reach out to the EPA directly."
     
  10. fallguy
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    fallguy Senior Member

    Here is one page from Moeller.

    57C72726-5F4C-4879-BD4C-2D4282553B39.png
    the tank manufacturers are very full of it

    they will tell you a tank is epa compliant, but it is not

    the only way to be EPA compliant is to meet all the EPA requirements

    If you want to make boats for the US market; you need to use diurnal systems.

    Read the fine print.

    FB41682A-9C13-4FE1-9FA9-29BF871DC5B9.png
     
  11. DCockey
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    DCockey Senior Member

    The EPA requirements can be met by installing a system with all components meeting EPA requirements for the individual components, including fuel tanks. My understanding is Moeller is claiming that certain of their fuel tanks meet the EPA requirements for fuel tanks. They are not claiming that using one of the fuel tanks makes the entire fuel system compliant with EPA regulations.
     
    TANSL likes this.
  12. Cacciatore
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    Cacciatore Junior Member

    EPA is mandatory for all boats sell in US ? I see several new boats with classic fuel deck filler how could be EPA compliant ? Regarding Moeller i have asked for 1 tank model and said that is not possible make it EPA compliant. Do you know some bladder fuel tank compliant EPA? The boat is a full carbon catamaran and i prefer have a save weight choice with the fuel system.
     
  13. DCockey
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    DCockey Senior Member

    Yes, for boats spark-ignition (gasoline) engines built after 2011. Diesel fuel systems are not covered. https://www.uscgboating.org/assets/1/AssetManager/ABYC.1002.01.pdf Perko Fuel Systems http://www.perkofuelsystems.com/regulations/epa/
    I have never heard of anything like a bladder to convert a tank and do not think it is possible.
     
  14. Cacciatore
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    Cacciatore Junior Member

    I thought to use in the next boats permanent fuel tank bladder but EPA compliant but it exists? ATL not seems EPA
     

  15. fallguy
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    fallguy Senior Member

    I well understand their marketing bull. I bought two EPA compliant tanks that cannot be used to make an EPA compliant fuel system because their EPA compliant tanks are not equipped for diurnal bits.

    The principal beef I have with the EPA is they did NOT do a good job. And neither did ABYC on these changes back in 2011. ABYC knows it and deferred to EPA in their own language versus adopting the methods as standards. And Moeller doesn't tell you anywhere that an EPA compliant tank will not be able to be part of an EPA compliant system except for the first page of a brochure or catalog. Further, some Moeller tanks are marketed all over the internet as EPA compliant, but cannot be made into an EPA compliant system. See a problem?

    Poor @Cacciatore has english as a second language and he can't understand it at all.

    A fuel bladder may be EPA compliant, but its use in a boat will not make an EPA compliant system @Cacciatore, because the venting may not be EPA compliant.

    It is one of the worst and most poorly done things in boating.

    I am hoping for a change away from diurnal venting to something where a single vent line can be used. And don't get me started on anti-spill..
     
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