Commercial Fishing Sailboat

Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by MickT, Nov 14, 2010.

  1. YuriB
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    YuriB Junior Member

    it seems to be not efficient way, to keep the catch live in tanks on board of sailing vessel, especially because of limited volume of holds. Even transportation in ice, fish take 60% of volume. All the rest is ice.
    Assuming that if catch can stay in ice about 2 weeks, this may not be enough time for slow sailing boat to get home with all catch in good quality. So deep freezing is probably only the right way.
     
  2. brian eiland
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    brian eiland Senior Member

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  3. Kanfish
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    Kanfish Kansai Fishing Company

    Commercial fishing under sail

    May well be a semi commercial fishing vessel under sail with what I assume are registration numbers painted on the mainsail boom perhaps and the orange windy buoys on deck forward too?
    Nice looking unit all up in appearance. Again though with that cluttered Ketch rig
    of multiple sails and rigging getting in the way.
    I think I nailed it better in the ' K ' class I drew up with the same sail effect and no side rigging etc in a sail assisted fishing vessel of similar size though.

    I did follow up on the Tad photos of historical tuna trolling vessels and really enjoyed the historical photo review down the years of the older and still fishing vessels. I can see there would be some very entrenched and long standing opinions here and that it will be a challenge to open this up to another view point of sail assisted. The rising cost of fuel will do it though and open this up for deeper discussion over time I am sure.
     
  4. Tad
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    Tad Boat Designer


    "entrenched and long standing" Of course, you're taking about fishermen here......;)

    I have a book of design articles re-published by National Fisherman in 1981.....precisely 30 years ago.......of the 85 new designs (not old stuff) presented fully 14 (16%) are sail assisted (not just steadying sails) fishing vessels. Every one of these 14 articles states that the rising cost of fuel will make sailing or sail assisted fishing vessels more prevalent in the future.......hasn't happened yet that I can see......I've been ready to design these sailing fishing boats for 30 years and no one has asked for one...........

    If someone wanted to promote fishing under sail the easy way will be to create a fishery that only allows sail power......I think there are at least 2 of these left in the Western World, oyster dredging in the Chesapeake and certain areas of the UK.........these fisheries use ancient boats, some over 100 years old.........no one can see enough profit to build new for a marginal subsistence industry......But the use of sail keeps these fisheries sustainable..........
     
  5. Kanfish
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    Kanfish Kansai Fishing Company

    Sail assisted fishing

    Yes, I was meaning fishermen in the first instance and I know from my own fishing buddies here that there is, as you say, not exactly a rush to order a new sail assisted vessel from which to make their fortune so you have that right as well Tad.
    Interest, yes, but no cheque books being waved around as yet.

    I did make contact with a Sian Robbins in Cornwall, UK concerning their sail only fishing fleet and he was kind enough to send me some information on the fleet activities there.

    A couple of the sail assisted fishing vessels here that have been around for a while with good Skippers and individually owned vessels and that I have spoken too at length, all speak highly of all the aspects that make up a sail assisted vessel.
    ie; fuel reduction, reduction of engine load and noise etc. but I think for the majority of the others the need / interest is just not enough for them to think in this direction. Many are company owned vessels here being run by Skippers that come and go frequently and also many just have no sailing experience at all so it is hardly surprising that there is no big movement into this direction.
    I have sailed all my life, it is second nature to me, and more than a little frustrating that the saying of ' You can take a horse to water BUT you can not make him drink ' is right to the fore here at present!!
     
  6. Perm Stress
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    Perm Stress Senior Member

    Fishermen get HUGE discounts on fuel they burn (at least in Europe), they pay no tax on fuel and get it ~50% cheaper.
    This should be quite a factor in decision to stay with motors. ;)
     
  7. Kanfish
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    Kanfish Kansai Fishing Company

    Sail assisted fishing

    Fishing companies here do give their vessels a better rate for fuel here too but no way is it huge by any stretch of the imagination. What they give in fuel rate is usually taken back though with prices paid to the vessels on landing into the same company!
    The much lauded fish ' Quota ' system here in New Zealand is run by five or so main companies now and is not much more than Mafia in reality aided and controlled by Govt.
    They in fact, have screwed up many of the fisheries, and to a large extent have exterminated the owner operator fishermen down to the point that so much of the fish ' quotas ' is now under caught yearly from what was very conservitive tonnages in the first place.
    Save the fish and screw the fishermen type mentality.
     
  8. Perm Stress
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    Perm Stress Senior Member

    I Europe fuel discount is Government politics. Otherwise fishing with motor boats would be commercially impossible.
     
  9. Kanfish
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    Kanfish Kansai Fishing Company

    I did an interesting ' develpoment ' during the weekend here. A fishing buddy of long standing that has been away from New Zealand living in Queensland, Australia for a number of years arrived back several months ago and wants to go back commercial fishing. ( Why this would be is a mystery known only to himself ) but having had a good look through all the commercial fishing boats for sale picked on an ex- trawler, steel, 1957 built, aft wheelhouse model. All in good nick and in survey, low asking price etc.

    This is a deep draft, double chine and flat bottom Dory looking hull with what I would describe as a slack bilge from the out of water photos I was shown.
    What is in it,s favour though is all the machinery is very low down in the hull and same with the fuel tanks and with word of mouth saying that it is a very good vessel at sea from those that have crewed her in the past.

    The ' development ' as such was that from a colour side profile A 4 photo I was given I drew a ' Mast Aft ' sail assisted rig on it that to my eye anyway ' adds ' to the appearance and really looks like it fits this paticular hull.
    This is to be a Fish Trap and Troll vessel ( if it is bought ) and the ' owner ' has yet to see the drawing but he does know I have done this to be seen soon I imagine. Should be interesting as to any reaction.

    All low cost set up of course with a box section steel mast and Galvanized rigging envisaged. Maybe there is a case to be considered with this paticular vessel, fuel cost keep rising etc and this ' owner ' I know gets seasick fairly easily so sail dampening might just be a great benefit to him as a side issue too. Time will tell I guess!
     
  10. brian eiland
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    brian eiland Senior Member

    [Originally Posted by Cattledog]
    ...Revisit this when diesel is $10 / gallon.[/QUOTE]


    Lets see that posting was made in Dec 2010. in only 3 months diesel here in the USA has reached almost $4 with indicators it may reach $5 by Memorial day. I believe it is already at $10 in Britian.

    Have to imagine the MotorSailor concept is going to gain a lot of converts soon.
     
  11. Kanfish
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    Kanfish Kansai Fishing Company

    Sail assist, commercial and other.

    I would have to think that the case for adding sail assist to new and suitable hulls would have to be rapidly growing stronger by the day even if just for the pleasure to be able to say that you are trying to be ahead of the game with fuel costs rising!

    What I really love about the ' Mast Aft ' rig sail assist concept is the simplicity of the sail plan for actual working of the vessel being just one head sail that may need to be be adjusted at any time to gain the advantage with sail power. The mizzen at best is a balance sail and not a driving sail so much. Having said that it would come into it,s own when hove to for the night offshore perhaps giving a little drive back up to windward to counter drift during this shut down period and a steadying effect too. Also if sheeted hard amidships while using a sea anchor perhaps also keeping the vessel directly head to wind being most comfortable while stopped.You would not win too many yacht races with this rig for speed BUT it would get you home if it became necessary under sail alone though.

    All the other sail rigs, though well proven, are 'work horse ' rigs requiring a lot of attention constantly and are made to sail the vessel rather than a lower key sail assist only while still under engine power. Fishermen need those engines running no matter what fishery they are involved in for their work.

    This mast aft sail assist rig really has so much going for it and I look forward to many more being developed in due course. You do not really even have to know how to sail to get the fuel saving benefit etc for miles travelled from this rig.

    Kanfish
     
  12. Kanfish
    Joined: Nov 2010
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    Location: Northland , New Zealand

    Kanfish Kansai Fishing Company

    Sail assisted commercial fishing

    A huge plus factor in ' marketing ' and selling of catch off a vessel using sail assist is just that fact that the product in the fish room is produced using the least amount of toxicity to the enviroment as perceived by the buying public.
    Much like the organic produce off farms and commanding a higher price back to the vessel. Marketing product with an edge like this to a buyer would have to be a bonus, right?

    When it all comes down to it the only thing that really matters to a fisherman is the size / amount of the cheque for his catch at the end of a trip, be it good or bad, and this is what makes the difference if the cat gets kicked or cuddled when he gets home again from the trip.

    Add that all to the rest of the package of under cover catching deck aft with sun shelter and some wind protection too. Delivery direct to the fish room from the catch deck after spiking, bleeding and washing without being landed on a sun heated deck and time spent lying around during heavy fishing action etc then you would produce a best product to the buyers and be rewarded for your foresight as a top producer of best product. It all adds up!

    Kanfish
     
  13. Kanfish
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    Kanfish Kansai Fishing Company

    I can now say that there is a highly likely chance that the first of the sail assist K class Kansai design units will be built in New Zealand soon.

    Fishermen are starting to think now and strong inquiry,s are coming in from the commercial fishing sector Internationally. The superb ' blend ' of design features are starting to be recognized and appreciated for what has gone into this vessel. Expectations are for many more to follow and be built.

    Photos will be posted as construction takes place over time.

    Kanfish
     
  14. augbug27
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    augbug27 Junior Member

    I really like the idea of a commercial motor/sailor, as someone else mentioned I would definitely outfit her with hydraulic winches for all the sail handling. I would also consider roller furling on both the fore and the main, operated hydraulically so you can really maximize the work/effort ratio. Have you also considered any computer aides, as in auto trimming based on your course and speed. A friend and I had been working on a system to auto trim and steer a boat for maximum efficiency (I know they already exist commercially as well), which could be really nice while working. You also might want to consider some solar panels and wind generators, really hit the green angle hard and why not more efficiency= more profit. Good luck and a great idea.
     

  15. Robbo
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    Robbo Junior Member

    Quick question OT-what happened to Apex1?
    He was very active on here and suddenly just seems to have disappeared and his account closed. Was he kicked off or something?
     
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