Cat Design comparo question

Discussion in 'Multihulls' started by Geno41, Jul 28, 2017.

  1. sailhand
    Joined: Jan 2017
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    Location: australia

    sailhand Junior Member

    Recently a 60ft( I think) gforce left pancake creek with two oram catamarans, one 44ft and one 46ft one of which only has a 14mt mast. They both beat the gforce over the 50 mile passage. Gforce cost over a million possibly two. For the same money you could build four of the Oram's. I'm biased as i own an oram cat. I am also a good mate of bob Oram's, just declaring my association for your reference. Build time on the Oram's will be a lot faster and so will the boat probably. One of grainger latest designs I think a barefoot 40 has been sailing in company with a few Oram's lately. They leave a few hours before the Oram's and arrive in the anchorage an hour or two later. So maybe I should say they are being overtaken on a regular basis rather than cruising in company. Bob's website is up and running if you are keen to check out his boats. Fortunately he's a much better designer than Web page developer, but I believe he's still working on the website so it's a work in progress. If you wish to contact current owners let me know and I'll put you in touch with a few.
     
  2. Geno41
    Joined: Jul 2017
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    Location: Potomac, MD

    Geno41 Junior Member

    Sailhand, thank you for advise but I have a feeling he is a very busy man since he didn't even bother responding to my simple e-mail inquiry about his 48C.
    Now talking about performance it's uncertain as there are so many variables at any given moment, I don't doubt orams designs but if they are that fast why don't they compete in any of the local racing events?
    After hearing many opinions of seasoned cruisers I've come to conclusion of settling somewhere in between and having a well rounded cat with decent performance and reasonable payload ( at least 2tons of payload). My kid and I was just talking about scuba diving and spearfishing so all of this would take some weight to carry.
     
  3. sailhand
    Joined: Jan 2017
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    Location: australia

    sailhand Junior Member

    Bob is actually out of range as he is cruising on his own boat in far north queensland and no doubt enjoying himself i am sure he'll find time in his hectic schedule to respond to your simple email when he gets to see it. No Oram's currently race as none of us are willing to commit to the level of funding required and have a life to live enjoying our boats. A few Oram's have raced quite successfully in the past and have been very competitive. I raced on a fully fledged cruising liveaboard and quite heavy version of bobs 44c in the kingfisher regatta a few years back and the only two boats that beat us for line honors were the two fastest boats in the racing division. We weren't allowed to use a kite downhill as we were in the cruising division and the same two racing multis would come past us down hill generating heaps of apparent under kite and we would peg them back uphill again. Pretty much the same pattern all weekend. That boat has a dedicated 5kva Genset and even an electric rear window between the cockpit and saloon. It also has a pull out pantry with stainless racking and a dinghy around the 150 kg mark,washing machine, watermaker etc etc. It would easily be carrying 2000kg and is still one of the fastest cruisers for its waterline length on the aussie east coast. I am not saying nothing will beat it what I am saying is it is fast for a cruiser and definitely heaps faster than any of the graingers I have sailed on around the same size with much more sail area. They also have much much smaller rigs than the grainger or schionning and that means easier to handle and cheaper to build but they are not for everyone. I am sure you'll be happy with whatever you build and enjoy your time on the water.
    Cheers
     
  4. Herman Karsten
    Joined: Feb 2018
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    Location: Australia

    Herman Karsten New Member

    Geno41, did you come to a conclusion?
    I'm in a similar process and have narrowed it down to the Schionning Arrow 1500 vs the Raku48, maybe even the Raku54.

    Not that interested in racing performance but not wanting a production cat's performance either.
     
  5. sailhand
    Joined: Jan 2017
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    Location: australia

    sailhand Junior Member

    Hi Herman are you in queensland
     
  6. Herman Karsten
    Joined: Feb 2018
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    Location: Australia

    Herman Karsten New Member

    No mate, in Canberra unfortunately.
     
  7. sailhand
    Joined: Jan 2017
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    Location: australia

    sailhand Junior Member

    Herman, I have been involved in a few of these builds now and have been living on a sailing cat for 14 years. I may have a few insights that may be of help to you at this early stage. I have built them and designed smaller cats and studied engineering at USQ. I would be happy to discuss your new project and put you in touch with others involved in building and sailing cats. Pm me for contact details if you are interested. Always happy to help out a fellow sailor, especially another Aussie.
     
  8. Geno41
    Joined: Jul 2017
    Posts: 14
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    Location: Potomac, MD

    Geno41 Junior Member

    Herman,
    I've decided to "shrink" the project a little and came down to either Arrow 1360 or demount-able trimaran around 36-40ft.
    Wife said go sail your self so it won't be that many people sailing with me since they all have their own life and priorities.
    Another factor is I'm not planning on living aboard as I really love "land" comforts and tend to get best room possible whenever I travel and explore around,
    so my boat needs to take me there fast and will be used for occasional sailing in my area whenever we decide going fishing. Who knows if I really like it
    boat of that size still should take me quiet a distance. G-Force is tricky to build I've heard it from number of pro builders but to this day it remains to be my favorite,
    Raku should be easier to build but expect to spend a little extra as it's slightly bigger and has a 20M rig (going for 54 isn't a bad idea since it uses the same rig).
    I've got to approach it carefully as plans with the building site have changed and I'm invested more and more in my business nowadays. I'll keep everyone posted in this thread when I finalize my choice of a vessel and purchase the plans.
     
    Corley likes this.
  9. Herman Karsten
    Joined: Feb 2018
    Posts: 3
    Likes: 0, Points: 1
    Location: Australia

    Herman Karsten New Member

    @sailhand: I'd love to chat to you and get your views and experience. As a new forum member I can't PM yet. A bit about me - I grew up in South Africa 1500km from water so anything boat related is new to me. I'm now Aussie :)
    I know I'm a bit crazy but that's how I do things. Last year I announced our life's vision involving roaming the seas in a catamaran for the next 20 years to the family. My wife just looked at me dumbstruck and checked if I had taken the dog's medication. That was 6 months ago and now after much actual research (watching La Vagabond isn't research I know) and discussion, a plan is starting to form including where the money is going to come from.
    As you can imagine, not everything you read on the internet is factual so testing my findings against real world experience might come as a rude shock to me/us.
    So first things first - I need to talk to people that own the cats on my short list and then go sailing on them before selling the dog and kids to buy my kit cat.

    TLDR: Love to chat. IT Project Manager and Sculpture Artist wants to build a cat. They have no idea what they're doing or about to take on.

    @Geno41: There is always some life event that interrupts your dreams :)
     

  10. sailhand
    Joined: Jan 2017
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    Location: australia

    sailhand Junior Member

    Hi Herman my email is apc.tender@gmail.com. send me an email and I'll give you my phone number.
     
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