Building A new Thames Barge

Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by ThamesSail, Apr 28, 2010.

  1. peter radclyffe
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    peter radclyffe Senior Member

    contact everards in greenhithe
     
  2. capt littlelegs
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    capt littlelegs New Member

    Unfortunately most if not all of these old companies are no longer in the same places or in existance or running under the same names anymore. Everards were bought out in 2006 and are now James Fisher Everard in Barrow in Furness. Hopefully they may still have the old records.
     
  3. keith66
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    keith66 Senior Member

    Here is a good source of info from the model sailing barge website, as it says most will have been built from half models but many had their lines taken of, there is a comprehensive list of barges for which plans of some sort are available.
    http://www.thamesbarge.org.uk/barges/models/plans.html
     
  4. Tad
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    Tad Boat Designer

    In 1935 Uffa Fox recorded the lines and sail plan of the James R. Piper designed and built barge Giralda (1897). The drawings appear in Uffa Fox's Second Book. Giralda was apparently fairly successful in racing after her launch, and for a barge her lines are rather nice. LOA is 86', LWL 85', beam 18'6", draft loaded 5', displacement loaded 150 tons, sail area 3000 sq ft.

    This barge could be scaled to any size desired.
     
  5. keith66
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    keith66 Senior Member

    I beleive Giralda was broken up in 1943, her lines show a fairly flat sheer but her bottom had some rocker with her run starting nearly midships, she was reputed to be very fast indeed.
     
  6. capt littlelegs
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    capt littlelegs New Member

    My father-in-law knew Uffa Fox, he was his bank manager on the Isle of Wight some years ago!
     
  7. Brian@BNE
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    Brian@BNE Senior Member

    replica dutch barge

    There are a number of 'replica' barge designs, and some can provide cut steel ready for welding which might suit ThamesSail quite well. I just can't locate my bookmarks for these at the minute!

    Here is a good resource http://www.barging.co.uk/

    Also http://www.barges.org/

    Wolstenholme's designs look great to my eye although midfied from 'classic' lines http://http://www.wolstenholmedesign.com/barges.htm
    and "Ida" looks quite nice although I'd prefer a longer vesion.

    See http://web.me.com/ida57/Ida_/Welcome.html

    and http://www.stokedutchbarges.co.uk/default.asp

    Piper: http://www.piperboats.com/id33.html

    and 'Elessina" shows what can be achieved with a Piper design http://www.barging.co.uk/Forsale_Elessina.htm

    I think Branson offer kits http://www.dutch-barges.net/steel_kits.html

    Other builders include:

    http://www.dutch-barge.co.uk/anglodutch/design.php

    http://www.trickettboats.com/Welcome_to_Will_Trickett_Boats_Ltd.html

    http://www.aqualinemarine.co.uk/index.htm

    http://www.delta-marineservices.co.uk/

    And a question for the forum - if some of the 'replica' designs can be built to the EU's RCD Cat B standard, what would it take for something to get to Cat A? Obviously windows need attention for sizing, glass thickness and probably steel shutters for a start. Could a long retractable keel be fitted under the sole for lowering when offshore to provide additional stabilty?
     
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2010
  8. Crag Cay
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    Crag Cay Senior Member

    Some of the help offered on here would be more focussed if people bothered to find out what a Thames Barge looks like.
    Thames Barge.jpg
     
  9. Tad
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    Tad Boat Designer

    Ya...take yer dutch barge stuff to the dutch barge thread.......:D

    A Thames Barge is something completely different.....
     
  10. keith66
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    keith66 Senior Member

    As for the RCD is it applicable to something like a Thames barge? as such a vessel is going to have to work for a living i would have thought commercial codes would apply.
    If someone is brave enough to build a new one there is all the more reason to make it a proven good sailer.
    As for retractable keels for offshore work forget it, they were not generally designed or intended for such work. they are fitted with twin leeboards which were often asymetric aerofoil section for better windward performance.
    Many years ago i was of work having busted my arm & was sitting on Canvey sea wall atching the world go by when i saw a barge beating down the Thames towards the sea, it was blowing a steady F5 gusting 6 and the spring ebb tide was starting to run hard.
    It turned out to be the barge Ironsides (she had just been rebuilt & rerigged) & with the tide under her she was going like a train.
    To anyone who thinks these barges are slow & stately think again, the wind aganst tide had kicked up a heavy estuary chop & she battered through it with spray crashing over her bow & flying halfway up the mainsail, her windward chine was out of the water and as she rose to the seas you could see daylight under her bow.
    As she winded (tacked) close to the shore the noise from her sails was like thunder & she stood away across the river with her tan sails like boards.
    It was the first time i ever saw a Thames barge being driven really hard & i would have given my left nut to have been aboard with them!
     
  11. Brian@BNE
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    Brian@BNE Senior Member

    Ahh, My Bad!

    Death to hijackers!

    Of course the Dutch also had a rag phase - and the better handling one's still have a forward mast. But the Thames sprit'sl rig was a pretty nifty setup, leeboards effective even if unattractive.

    I'll cop the slap on the wrist, but suggest that it wouldn't be too much of a stretch for the somewhat larger DB industry to be able to design what Chris is looking for and supply cut steel ready to weld.
     

  12. peter radclyffe
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    peter radclyffe Senior Member

    the dutch are so organized, they could supply a dutch barge flat pack assembly, including a pre-construction anger management course video
     
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