Buccaneer 24 Builders Forum

Discussion in 'Multihulls' started by oldsailor7, Jul 22, 2009.

  1. oldsailor7
    Joined: May 2008
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    oldsailor7 Senior Member

    MIKE.
    As they say "If it ain't broke, don't fix it".
    Unless you are a very heavy bloke, and intend to hang a heavy outboard on the transom, build it as designed.

    The low wetted surface and light weight makes the B24 a superberb light wind sailer, which will silently move out when other boats appear to be anchored to the water.

    If dragging it's transom worries you (it shouldn't) then load all your heavy gear up in the foward bunk area.

    The sail plan shown is ideal for cruising. You simply dont need a bigger sail plan unless you intend to indulge in serious racing (like Samz) :D.

    The B24's waterline L/B ratio is fairly low for a multi.
    If it had been designed as an all out racer it would have an L/B of 11 or 12, but would then have to be very light, with minimum load carring capacity.
    The B24 has a good payload capacity, since it was designed as a simple, low cost, pocket cruiser-- It's effortless speed came as a bonus.

    All I can say about the mods you suggest, is, don't do it. All you are doing is adding to the weight and wetted surface (drag), and detrimentally changing the hulls prismatic co-efficient.

    Just my HO. :D
     
  2. Oceannavagator
    Joined: Jul 2009
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    Oceannavagator Junior Member

    Got cha OS, I like the idea of build as designed, I was just daydreaming a little. Oh yeah, didn't you say that you built yours out of 1/4 inch fir marine ply? It's writen as an option on the plans. Were the floats 1/4 also?
    Mike :D
     
  3. oldsailor7
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    oldsailor7 Senior Member

    MIKE.
    I built mine with 1/4" Samba mahogany, a very light wood. I am sure it is not available today.

    1/4" Douglas Fir (Oregon) is very strong but heavy. It is OK if you don't sheath the boat with F/Glass. Three thin coats of epoxy and taped seams are all you need. Just follow the directions in the little booklet I sent you.

    If you will be sailing in a fresh water area you must make sure that the fir ply is completely coated EVERYWHERE, as it rots very quickly. Even if you sail in seawater, rainwater gets into the bilge and does its rotten job.

    OS7. :D
     
  4. bruceb
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    bruceb Senior Member

    buc ply

    Mike, my boat is fir ply and I would not recommend it. Mine was very carefully coated and spent most of its life in salt water- that is why it has survived, but any marine mahogany would be a much better choice. Keep to the thicknesses that Crowther specified and the boat will come out light and plenty strong. Bruce
     
  5. oldsailor7
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    oldsailor7 Senior Member

    As an example my Buccaneer 28 was not sheathed in F/Glass.
    I used 1/4" Weldwood mahogany marine ply and simply coated it with the three coats of epoxy and finished off with two coats of UV resistant polyeurethane paint.
    All the seams were glassed with 2" tape of course.
    Lasted very well until I sold it on leaving for Australia.

    I holed the boat once (on a concrete block at the edge of Toronto harbour) and another hole where a drifting boat rammed my starboard float near the stern above the waterline, whilst on the mooring. Both damages were easily repaired using standard epoxy techniques. If the hull had been fiberglassed it would have made no difference.
     
  6. Oceannavagator
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    Oceannavagator Junior Member

    Ok. I'm beginning to lean towards Okoume 4 mm ply covered with 2oz surfboard cloth if for no other reason than weight savings. Okoume in 4mm weighs in at 13 pounds per sheet while fir and meranti in 1/4 are more like 20-23 lbs. I'm partial to the hard smooth surface that the light cloth gives and the weight is negligible. It may not add to the puncture resistance but it makes for a slick, hard to scratch surface that slips through the water well. Samba, I think, may be a brand name for Okoume ply but I'm not sure. I do know that there are only two major mahogany's; African and Philippine, everything else is just a sub species of one or the other. This may be an over simplification but in my experience, I think that the manufacturer has more to do with the quality of the stuff than what it is made of.
    By the way, I don't know which one of you guys put the 6 minute video up on Utube of a buccaneer 24 sailing off Milwaukee, but KUDOS to whoever did it. I am inspired and anxious for a vid of your boat in stronger winds. The ice boat stuff was cool too, scary fast, and cold looking. Thanks
    Mike
     
  7. bruceb
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    bruceb Senior Member

    ply choices

    Mike, the 4mm is probably fine for the upper sides of the all the hulls, but from the upper chine down, I would use meranti or power ply in at least 6mm or double 4mm (or more on the bottom). 4mm does not allow for any "rounding" of the chines, which I think is important. The area is small so the added weight and cost is minimal and you will have a stronger and much more rot proof boat. I can show you where mine has had problems, and I have seen the same issues in most all wooden boats that live in southern waters. The heat and moisture eventually gets to all of them. At this time, it is easy to reduce or prevent almost all of the problems. Do it right. I do like the light glass covering, it will make a nice finish without much weight. Bruce
     
  8. Oceannavagator
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    Oceannavagator Junior Member

    well, now that I'm totally undecided.:confused: we are talking about 100-150 lbs aren't we? Is the weight that important? A total of say 480 sq feet of plywood 15 sheets, 4mm vs 6mm = 100 lbs difference. everything else is equal. Are we just splitting hairs here? Most people carry that much in beer, ice and fishing equipment. Wouldn't a heavy 24 be much faster than a light monohull? On the plans I see 3000 lbs for max displacement. I can't see the structure weighting more than 5 or 6 hundred lbs.
    I'm swimming in indecision here.HELP!! :eek:
    Mike
     
  9. oldsailor7
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    oldsailor7 Senior Member

    MIKE.
    Don't get your knickers in a knot with indecision.
    Just build it according to the designers specs.

    1/4" ply all over, and 5/16" ply where specified.

    It will be fine.

    Cheers, OS7. :D
     
  10. bruceb
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    bruceb Senior Member

    weight

    Mike, you can see in the photos that mine floats on its lines, and that is in fresh water. The cabin would add about 130 lbs, but in the pics at least that much in gear is on board and I have a taller, heavier mast. Mine is mostly 1/4" fir ply with some 1/2" in the cockpit floor- not lightly built but still under 1500 lbs. Don't worry too much about weight, just use good materials to spec. My floats are just under 200 lbs each (quite heavy), I estimate my main hull at 800 lbs, and the rest is in the cross tubes, mast, rig and fittings. By my estimates, using ply as I suggested, the boat should be 1200-1300 lbs as designed, and very fast:), or it could carry plenty of extra gear and crew. Bruce
     

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  11. Oceannavagator
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    Oceannavagator Junior Member

    Thanks for the picture Bruce, I've calmed down now. Question; is your mast an extrusion or the pipe specified in the plans? If it's an extrusion, I'd like to know the dimensions as I don;t think I'll be happy with the pipe mast. I'm trying to find out what the moment of inertia is for 4 1/2 inch tube but it's not easy to find and there's too many unknowns for me to figure it out myself. I know that a multihull's quick motion requires a heavier stick, at least in the fore and aft direction, but the question is how much heavier?
    Mike :)
     
  12. oldsailor7
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    oldsailor7 Senior Member

    Bruce.
    How are you making out with your super long daggerboard?
    How noticeable are the performance improvements.?
    Close windedness, speed to windward etc:

    You are our prime experimentor in this regard. :cool:

    Cheers. Paddy. :D
     
  13. bruceb
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    bruceb Senior Member

    Boards and masts

    Mike, my mast is the same as a Stiletto 27 catamaran complete with fittings, spreaders and rotating base and ball. 36' overall with an I of 30'. The ball (step) is about 14" lower than a Buc 24 with a cabin. I will measure the section next time I am at the boat. It was added by the second owner and seems to be a good choice. I am still experimenting with the board- I have not had it out in wind over 12 kts and I am still learning how to best use it. I am hoping for a breeze this weekend:) I will report with details. Bruce
     
  14. bruceb
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    bruceb Senior Member

    board thoughts

    I tried the boat in 15kts gusting a little higher and smooth water with my self-tacking jib (85%) and about 350lbs of crew. With the board down all the way the boat will lift slightly above its heading. (fun but probably slower) I experimented with raising it a few inches at a time, it seems to be best raised about 8-10 inches. My knot meter is not accurate enough to see the difference, but I was tuning against a couple of larger monohulls that were pretty steady. I have the board angled aft about half the stock amount, that seems to be a good compromise of balance and pointing with my rig. My board is 89" overall with a 15" max cord and my trunk is 29" deep. I have filled the extra trunk opening with foam. The boat is faster, points a lot higher, and responds to the rudder better. Close hauled, it accelerates more in the puffs and doesn't seem to heel as much. I will keep testing and reporting, I really like it so far. Bruce
     

  15. oldsailor7
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    oldsailor7 Senior Member

    Bruce.
    If you can borrow a hand held GPS you can accurately determine the most efficient depth for your new board.
    Paddy. :D
     
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