Bruce Bingham Flicka 20 Plans

Discussion in 'Boat Design' started by mustafaumu sarac, Dec 22, 2017.

  1. mustafaumu sarac
    Joined: May 2017
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    Location: Istanbul

    mustafaumu sarac Junior Member

    Hello there,

    At good old times ,may be 40 years ago , Turkish Yacht Magazine published Bruce Bingham Flicka 20 Plans. Here is the pdf article.

    I need your help , Rudder magazine published the Flicka 20 ferrocement construction articles - 6 or 8- starting from 1972 september issue.

    Can anyone send the scans in list or out of list or sell me the magazines or scans or photocopies.

    My email: mustafaumutsarac at gmail.com

    Thank you,

    Mustafa Umut Sarac
    Istanbul
     

    Attached Files:

  2. PAR
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    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    I can think of little worse than making a well burdened Flicka more so, in ferro cement.
     
  3. mustafaumu sarac
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    mustafaumu sarac Junior Member

    Flicka 20 designed for ferrocement , many been built than fiber used for mass production.
     
  4. PAR
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    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    I'm not sure where you're getting your information, but the extreme vast majority of Flicka plans were GRP built and only a handful of known ferro builds. Ferro was more time consuming and more costly, compairtivly and the rather burdensome lines of Flicka were made more so, to accommodate this alternative building process. Simply put and 20' long concrete yacht isn't a good idea. No Flicka's were production built as a ferro build, for the same reasons.
     
  5. Angélique
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    Angélique aka Angel (only by name)

    Now* for sale on eBay - 2 × - 1974 Ferro-Cement boat build book by Bruce Bingham . . . .

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    Ferro-Cement : Design, Techniques, and Application by Bruce Bingham (1974, Hardcover)

    Brand New: asking US $ 96.49 *

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    Ferro-cement: Design, Techniques, and Application by Bingham Concrete Boat Yacht

    Pre Owned: asking US $ 18.00 * - (spare link)

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    There are also some other Ferro Cement boat build books offered for sale on eBay right now, although varying in asking prices when doubles show up, like above, and in the example below . . . .

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    Ferrocement Yacht Construction by Chris Cairncross: Pre Owned asking US $ 9.90 *

    Ferrocement Yacht Construction by Chris Cairncross: Pre Owned ‘‘Excellent’’ asking US $ 24.95 *

    Ferrocement Yacht Construction by Chris Cairncross: Brand New asking US $ 79.49 *

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    Last edited: Dec 25, 2017
  6. Angélique
    Joined: Feb 2009
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    Angélique aka Angel (only by name)

    Here's an in 1973 started, but till today never finished, Flicka 20 ferro-cement build project, located in Branson, Missouri, USA. (ZIP code 65616)

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    This unfinished project is since a long time for sale, asking US $ 1,000, which means the project seller could still have the plans, if so; then maybe good photos of these Flicka 20 ferro-cement plans are available on request . . ?

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    Last edited: Dec 25, 2017
  7. mustafaumu sarac
    Joined: May 2017
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    mustafaumu sarac Junior Member

    Angelique,

    You are an treasure. I will buy these books after new year holiday. I will put the scans in to libgen.io. There are many boat plans over there. I am thinking to translate above books in to turkish also. My first boat will be GRP Yrvind 420 and than I find comfort , I will try to build flicka.

    Thank you very much.
     
  8. Boat Design Net Moderator
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    Boat Design Net Moderator Moderator

    Before scanning/translating if thinking of doing so to share please check the copyright and be sure you don't violate the author/publisher's copyright first. Thanks.
     
  9. PAR
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    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    This Cairncross book was written at the height of the ferro craze in the early 70's and is currently viewable online in a few locations. I consider the Jay Benford book far superior on the subject, but this is a good start. I think "Tiller Publications" still retains control over Jay's book, but do not think Cairncross is as protected. Bruce Bingham is a well known author, published many times over his career, so likely also is still protected. It's still a good idea to check about this protection, though.
     
  10. Steve W
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    Steve W Senior Member

    The Flicka has more than enough displacement for ferro construction and many were built in this medium, nothing wrong with it. I have personally seen two ferro versions, the first being a beautifully built example, built at Span Farm boatyard in Auckland, NZ by a guy from Oregon and subsequently sailed home to Portland. The second not so beautifully built in Minneapolis. Interestingly enough I just bought an old copy of Nautical Quarterly magazine which had a story about the Flicka and was showing the article to our parts guy at work (just this afternoon) who has had a Pacific Seacraft Flicka for many years and while the article gives a displacement of 4500 lbs he says his is actually around 6500lbs, very easy to accomplish in Ferro. I don't know if folks built them from plans in one off solid glass but if so it would be no less work than in ferro to achieve the same quality of finish as the one I saw in Auckland. I have personally built a larger version, the Fred Bingham designed 24 ft Allegra hull for a client using the C flex method in solid glass as well as a Hartley RORC 39 ferro sailboat so I do know a bit about both mediums.

    Steve.
     
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  11. PAR
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    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    My understanding (again) is the lines and offsets for a Flicka are different between the original and the ferro version, with obvious increases in volume and dimensions on the ferro version. Yes, this puppy does have the volume for this build method, but it was (the origional) a very burdened design, made much more so with this modification to the plans. I have a design much like Flicka, though less wetted surface, more refined appendages, etc., etc., etc. and it's about 26% lighter (3,700 LBS) than a GRP Flicka, yet still carries a 140 degrees of righting arm and a hefty for it's length displacement (315 D/L). The stock Flicka (GRP) has a D/L of around 505 and I can only imagine what a ferro Flicka would be 600? Really?
     
  12. Steve W
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    Steve W Senior Member

    My understanding is a little different than yours Par in that i believe that Flicka was originally designed to be built in Ferro and later built as a production boat by Northstar and then Pacific Seacraft. I am not aware of any being built by amateurs in glass but I could be wrong. Having built in ferro and various one off glass methods i don't agree that ferro is any more labor intensive. I do however agree that a 20ft concrete boat is not a great idea but then again I'm not a fan of a 6000lb boat in any material on an 18ft w/l.
     
  13. PAR
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    PAR Yacht Designer/Builder

    Flicka was originally designed as a set of plans for home building, with a couple hundred plan sets sold, before a partially completed plug was done by Bruce, eventually sold to Nor'star Marine for completion. Yeah, I miswrote the order of the design evolution. The ferro version was first, but never built by anyone other than the amateurs that bought the origional plans. I don't know when the design was redone to remove 40% of it's origional displacement, but this was done, because the ferro build idea, didn't take off like was expected. My understanding (which could be incorrect) is they were one off GRP's with a single skin and some amateur builds in C-Flex, though I've heard of molded veneer and carvel versions as well. I also understand no ferro Flicka's were production built. Almost all were GRP, with the first having a wooden deck and cabin structure, though all the rest where pulled off molds of this wooden decked version (Pacific Seacraft). Are there ferro versions, yep, sure are, but these puppies are pretty rare as completed and actually sailed boats. They also have half the capacity of the GRP versions and they need 8 knots just to get away from a leeward dock.

    In any case I think you and I are in agreement about the results of the concept. I've also heard that some of the original (ferro) home built's were over 9,000 lbs. displacement on an 18' LWL craft. Wow . . .
     
  14. Angélique
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    Angélique aka Angel (only by name)

    I'll don't think the OP is industriously gathering the asked for info, since the over a week ago in post #5 linked on topic Bruce Bingham books are still for sale, even the one only askin US $ 18 (in Türk lirası ₺), for what looks to be a comprehensive book by the designer of the boat of interest, about the asked for build method, which also looks to be in a nice and usable condition.

    P.S.

    -- An expansion of the message related to PM questions by the OP, answer partly posted here to be possibly reviewed by other forum members, and/or supplemented or corrected where needed. --

    International Priority Shipping costs from the seller's location in Murrieta, CA, US to Istanbul in Turkey would be somewhere around US $ 27 (in Türk lirası ₺) I'll guess. Maybe this could be cheaper too, best contact the seller for this through the eBay ad. However, I don't know whether Turkish taxes and/or import duties are due for items like this one. Best ask info for this at a local office in Istanbul which handles such cases.
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2018

  15. Steve W
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    Steve W Senior Member

    Are you sure about the lines being redrawn to reduce the displacement? I only ask because any competent ferro builder should be able to build to a 6500lb displacement without gobbling up all the payload. Now if you build the deck and cabin in ferro like the unfinished one shown above all bets are off. The biggest problem with overly heavy ferro boats stems from too much plaster over the steel armature. Too many builders did not spend enough time compacting the mesh and fairing the armature prior to plastering day and then the plastering team tried to fair with plaster. As with all method it comes down to workmanship and ferro was sold as a method that anyone could build with whereas I contend that any method that uses materials with no self fairing properties such as ferro and one off solid grp actually require a high level of skill if you want to keep the weight under control.
     
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